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Snoopy 2025 production issues?
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Evitzee
·By definition, a rough estimate is never correct...... but i dont hink there are 5K Snoopies made yet so the die may not be the problem.
Six pages in and no cat picture yet, how about a beagle pic?
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bsowers34
·Obviously no one other than Omega knows, but it's almost certain more than 5,000 Snoopy 50th watches have been made in its five year production run. This is a cash cow for Omega and they are capitalizing on it, they are matching production to demand, and five years in demand is still high. Way more than 5,000 have been made, imvho.
Six pages in and no cat picture yet, how about a beagle pic?
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ErichKeane
·Definitely not trying to throw any shade.
I gather that bsowers has been blessed with a longer life than I have so far. My eyes' time is coming, I'm sure....
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ErichKeane
·
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerHere’s a much a better photo of the new Snoopy in the same position as the old Snoopy. It’s worth noting that the stars are bigger/contain more visible silver in the new one. Also, the anniversary text being thinner (less silver) whereas Snoopy has thinner blue lines (more silver) lends credence to a new manufacturing process.
Is it a "defect"? I doubt it. Will Omega do anything about it? I doubt it. Will people complain? I have zero doubt of that! 😉
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Davidt
·These two photos would lead me to believe that the only difference is how much material has been removed from the top surface after the die was struck. If you look closely, the "original" has more depth between the top of the letters and the bottom of the blue surface. The "newer" version has less depth - more material has been ground off, leading to larger stars, and loss of some definition in the zipper.
Is it a "defect"? I doubt it. Will Omega do anything about it? I doubt it. Will people complain? I have zero doubt of that! 😉
I was thinking exactly the same. It simply looks as though more of the blue layer has been removed on the recent examples.
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ErichKeane
·I was thinking exactly the same. It simply looks as though more of the blue layer has been removed on the recent examples.
My guess is that they originally planned for a certain number of watches, designed their dies around it/etc, and the conversation goes:
Management: "can we do another 100 Snoopies? That extra million would be awesome on our bottom line..."
Engineering/Mfg: "Well, the dies are hitting their EOL, so the details are going to be less good on the subdial, we should probably spend a few hundred thousand getting a new die made if we want it to be up to our quality"
Management: "But its only 100, no one will notice, its only slightly worse than the last ones we did"
Engineering/Mfg: "Thats what you said LAST time we did an additional 100..."
Management: "And it was fine last time, just do it!"
Ad-infinem
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GrouchoM
·I'm happy with my little beagle
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerYeah, that IMO is why the 'worn die' theory holds a lot of water to me. Basically all of the details are 'struck lighter', but the overall depth seems to be the same(edges of dies are what wear, not the overall depth) so this isn't a case where the die isn't hitting as hard/not set as deep.
My guess is that they originally planned for a certain number of watches, designed their dies around it/etc, and the conversation goes:
Management: "can we do another 100 Snoopies? That extra million would be awesome on our bottom line..."
Engineering/Mfg: "Well, the dies are hitting their EOL, so the details are going to be less good on the subdial, we should probably spend a few hundred thousand getting a new die made if we want it to be up to our quality"
Management: "But its only 100, no one will notice, its only slightly worse than the last ones we did"
Engineering/Mfg: "Thats what you said LAST time we did an additional 100..."
Management: "And it was fine last time, just do it!"
Ad-infinem
I worked in a place that once used large presses to stamp part numbers into solid steel parts (so not just thin sheet metal). Dies lasted for tens of thousands of parts. Dies aren’t going to wear out stamping soft materials like this short of making millions of dials…
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kidnamedomega
·Sorry, but I don’t see it. If you for example look at the stars on the right side, there has simply been more material taken off the top surface after the die was struck, leading to a larger star appearance. This has also removed more of the zipper. I don’t think worn dies have anything to do with this at all.
I worked in a place that once used large presses to stamp part numbers into solid steel parts (so not just thin sheet metal). Dies lasted for tens of thousands of parts. Dies aren’t going to wear out stamping soft materials like this short of making millions of dials…
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Evitzee
·In my view it comes down to QC, it slipped along the way for whatever reason(s).
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ErichKeane
·Sorry, but I don’t see it. If you for example look at the stars on the right side, there has simply been more material taken off the top surface after the die was struck, leading to a larger star appearance. This has also removed more of the zipper. I don’t think worn dies have anything to do with this at all.
I worked in a place that once used large presses to stamp part numbers into solid steel parts (so not just thin sheet metal). Dies lasted for tens of thousands of parts. Dies aren’t going to wear out stamping soft materials like this short of making millions of dials…
As far as die wearing: with something this small, even hardened dies in soft material can show some pretty significant wear with only a few strikes. Number-strikes are way different because they have 'flatter' sides. As dies wear, they get 'pointier' as the sides wear, so part number dies tend to be pretty immune to wear.
Additionally, the die material is going to be different for a watch than something in a harder material. Something with fine details can't use a hardened die without losing some of the details, so you'd probably choose to do no treatment, particularly if you were only going with a few thousand units. If you were going for something with a 'low' item count + really fine details, you'd probably optimize for ease-of-die manufacturing, so you might even go with a softer material.
For example, I worked near a project that only had to do ~20k units in precious metals (silicon manufacturing) so they used a brass die, as it was much easier to laser-engrave without distortion. Die life was 1750 units, so they made 20 dies.
All that to say, hardened steel dies designed to work for a million units with high tolerance for variation on large details are a WAY different than small details, low units, no/low tolerance for variation.
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ErichPryde
··Seamasters ForeverDies lasted for tens of thousands of parts. Dies aren’t going to wear out stamping soft materials like this short of making millions of dials…
Agreed. The worn die theory is definitely fun and has spawned some interesting conversation, but it also could be that the amount of material ground off is greater reducing the details.
There is more than one case in which a die was prematurely damaged because it DIDN'T strike the proper material and instead struck something else that damaged it. I really don't see any indication that's what happened (or the die has been polished to hide this fact) though.
Could also be a lighter strike. Or, perhaps less enamel is being applied while "the same amount" is being ground off. Also not an unreasonable possibility of someone is trying to cut costs.
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pdxleaf
·Time for another dog picture
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bsowers34
·Time also for cats.
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kidnamedomega
·I’ll throw something else in that might be of interest. Some posters with late 2024 acquisitions have a bit more finger demarcation and more of the zipper than the “new” 2025 models.
For example, this Redditor:
Overall, it looks like the “new” Snoopy, though it seems to suggest that either there’s some variance in the amount of blue material cut away, or over time, some of the finer blue lines were lost.
At this point I’m just adding to the discussion because it’s fun to speculate, I have absolutely no idea what’s actually happening lol.
For example, this Redditor:
Overall, it looks like the “new” Snoopy, though it seems to suggest that either there’s some variance in the amount of blue material cut away, or over time, some of the finer blue lines were lost.
At this point I’m just adding to the discussion because it’s fun to speculate, I have absolutely no idea what’s actually happening lol.
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ErichPryde
··Seamasters ForeverI’ll throw something else in that might be of interest. Some posters with late 2024 acquisitions have a bit more finger demarcation and more of the zipper than the “new” 2025 models.
For example, this Redditor:
Overall, it looks like the “new” Snoopy, though it seems to suggest that either there’s some variance in the amount of blue material cut away, or over time, some of the finer blue lines were lost.
At this point I’m just adding to the discussion because it’s fun to speculate, I have absolutely no idea what’s actually happening lol.
This is what I originally saw as well looking through pictures- the lack of detail seems to be somewhat progressive, which could be suggestive of damage or wear. I don't know why a strike with less pressure would be progressive as opposed to sudden, or more material removal would slowly become apparent in series.
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M.Alessa
·I wouldn't. If I were Omega I would replace these dials as they come in for service or as Service is requested and never confirm publicly there was an "error."
That'd be the Rolex play.
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