Relumed hands— does it matter?

Syrte · Nov 26, 2020

It might seem a minor point but these discussions pop up on various threads on a regular basis.

Personally I really don’t care if the hands on a vintage watch have been relumed, especially of course if the job is done well.
If the job is really ugly, I always figure I can have it redone. (Unless it’s clear the hands are irreversibly damaged— but that’s another issue).

In any event, a hand relume adds a bit to the cost - but if I really like the watch, I do not care so much.
I suppose it makes a difference that I know a number of people who can redo a matching lume at a reasonable cost.

Curious what others think?

For those to whom it matters, is it on the grounds of cost/ complication or just as a matter principle, for the sake of originality ?

I care mostly about aesthetics, to me original hand lume is a nice bonus, but not an absolute requirement.

Am I just an outlier in that respect ?
(Not that it matters)

Flip · Nov 26, 2020

IMHO if you like vintage watches then take them as they come and leave all original. If you want a watch with working lume then buy a new watch.
However, everyone is different and we all like different things, so buy what you like and if you want to refresh a watch do so ( if you plan to keep it ) otherwise leave well alone.
Collectors who have the money can afford to sit tight and wait for LNOS grail pieces that sell at a premium but personally if a watch is 70 years old, I don’t mind if it looks aged, it is what it is.

Syrte · Nov 26, 2020

Thanks for your thoughts.
Maybe I didn't phrase the question properly and I should clarify: the point is not to have working lume or to have them relumed.
The point is that many vintage watches available on the market already have relumed hands.
Do people think it's a deal breaker for prospective buyers, and if not how much impact does it have on value ?

airansun · Nov 26, 2020

If the lume looks nice and appears correct under various lights, it works for me. (Just no perfectly matching pumpkin lume for me.)

I’d be hard pressed to buy a watch with ugly lume or one whose lume looked prepped. And, I’d rather not buy a watch, planning to relume it.

Flip · Nov 26, 2020

Ok, so personally I wouldn’t buy a watch with relumed hands, knowing they were relumed. I prefer 100% original, warts and all.
On that basis, as there are many who think the same, the value of a watch would likely be less as it wouldn’t be as desirable as one with original lume.
Obviously people still buy watches that have been relumed along with redialled watches, polished cases, replaced parts etc etc but prices will reflect this, or should.

Zapatta · Nov 26, 2020

If lume on hands matches overall look of dial, I couldn't care less if its redial. If we are talking about mega expensive and collectible watch, I would leave it like it is.

Spruce · Nov 26, 2020

Syrte
It might seem a minor point but these discussions pop up on various threads on a regular basis.

Personally I really don’t care if the hands on a vintage watch have been relumed, especially of course if the job is done well.
If the job is really ugly, I always figure I can have it redone. (Unless it’s clear the hands are irreversibly damaged— but that’s another issue).

In any event, a hand relume adds a bit to the cost - but if I really like the watch, I do not care so much.
I suppose it makes a difference that I know a number of people who can redo a matching lume at a reasonable cost.

Curious what others think?

For those to whom it matters, is it on the grounds of cost/ complication or just as a matter principle, for the sake of originality ?

I care mostly about aesthetics, to me original hand lume is a nice bonus, but not an absolute requirement.

Am I just an outlier in that respect ?
(Not that it matters)

I agree with you. If I like the look of the watch I’ll buy it and wear it.
Obviously, as a collector of old watches, and with a restricted/self imposed budget, I am careful about what I get but, to be brutally honest, I’d rather wear a well-done redial that a crème brûlée patina original.
And the same goes for hands.

Maganator · Nov 26, 2020

I have no issue with relumed hands so long as it has been done well.

I wouldn't be put off buying a watch that had ugly lume on the hands either.

I am not sure why, but lume on dials is slightly different for me and I would give way more consideration to having a dial relumed than I would a set of hands.

cchen · Nov 26, 2020

I think it's fine as long as the job was done properly and the hands are original. I too care more about the aesthetics at least when it comes to hands

janice&fred · Nov 26, 2020

Syrte
I care mostly about aesthetics, to me original hand lume is a nice bonus, but not an absolute requirement.

Am I just an outlier in that respect ?

Definitely not an outlier. As much as I like keeping stuff "as found", I wouldn't want to look at ugly hands 👍

Peemacgee · Nov 26, 2020

I think the answer to me is both yes and no @Syrte

Yes, if originality is the most important thing to you (which it generally is to me)

but relumed hands wouldn’t stop me buying an otherwise desirable watch - but like others, I would expect it to be reflected in the price

(and if they were glaringly bad, I would have them more sympathetically redone)

Lucasssssss · Nov 26, 2020

I saw the Davidoff Brothers talking about this recently, they say that they (and their clients) don't particularly mind about a relume, for either dial or hands, as long as it looks good. This surprised me to be honest.

I prefer keeping things as found if I can, but if something has already been badly re-lumed, or the dial washed of lume, then I do not have any problems re-luming.

I think lume should be considered as a replaceable part, similar to crystals for example, if it is re done well, then it wont put me off.

STANDY · Nov 26, 2020

Nowadays I’m more inclined to wait for a watch that’s not going to need anything done and pay a bit more for it. Gave up projects a few years ago as learnt that buying watches then looking for parts or relume game to make it how I really wanted it was not as enjoyable as buying that excellent condition watch to start with.

Not that many of the vintage dress watches I buy have that much Lume anyway.

Think the longer I have collected the more picky for perfection I am now.

fibonacci · Nov 26, 2020

Syrte
Personally I really don’t care if the hands on a vintage watch have been relumed, especially of course if the job is done well. If the job is really ugly, I always figure I can have it redone.

Is it completely non-invasive to relume hands, other than to the lume itself? For instance, if the hands are painted, could it be the case that some paint might be removed in the process? I don't have any experience with reluming hands and don't know how it is done, but I might be concerned if there were any slight additional loss of originality, at least for some watches.

Otherwise, I'd value relumed hands roughly the same as skeletonized ones, given that they are interchangeable states (modulo the cost of actually having it done).

Intact lume would, of course, be most preferable, but my understanding is it will eventually deteriorate and fall out in the end.

DaveK · Nov 26, 2020

The hands on my ‘61 Seamaster look amazing in the right light. In poor lighting, the look that the watch’s designer envisioned just doesn’t come through the same way. I’d consider a relume if it ever bothered me enough. I also like some watches with hands that have aged equally with the rest of the dial. This is for my collection and keeping, I’m not planning to sell or start a museum

M'Bob · Nov 26, 2020

I don’t mind the aesthetics of a re-lume if done nicely, particularly if I contract it.

One problem, though, with obtaining a previously re-lumed watch, at least for me, is that it causes that little voice in my head to ask “why.” Why was it needed? Is the reason obvious? What happened to the watch to cause this? Could there be other issues to look out for that may not be obvious?

Dan S · Nov 26, 2020

I would pay more for a watch with nice original lume in the hands. And I'll wait for a watch like that if finding one is plausible. Similarly, I find that some people selling watches with "color matched" hands are asking too much for their watches, since many collectors do feel that it represents a significant loss of originality.

Obviously if a watch is really rare, then sometimes you have to take what you can find and make the best of it, which might include re-luming the hands if they are bad enough (e.g. lume mostly missing, poorly re-lumed already, etc.). I do have some watches that fit into this category.

I don't choose to relume hands just because the original lume isn't terribly attractive, but generally I'd avoid purchasing watches like that as well.

Larry S · Nov 26, 2020

janice&fred
Definitely not an outlier. As much as I like keeping stuff "as found", I wouldn't want to look at ugly hands 👍

This is where I’m at too. There are times when a well done relume is a good idea.

OllieOnTheRocks · Nov 26, 2020

I agree! A relumed watch done well can look a hell of a lot better and make a much more attractive piece that I can enjoy than one that looks ugly. I have yet to relume any of mine but the alchemist relumer on Instagram gives me the confidence to do it in future if I decide to!

Damaged lume in hands used to turn me away from buying some watches and now I regret it as it’s a reasonably easy and not too expensive fix.

Of course original is always best but I would not shy away from an attractively re lumed watch. Providing it had been done in a sympathetic and attractive way.

JwRosenthal · Nov 26, 2020

I won’t buy a watch if the dial is damaged or lume dark and ashy (unless to be used for parts)- but hands I know I can have relumed to match any color I want. I have gotten great deals on some spectacular watches because the lume was missing or cracked on the hands- knowing it could have it repaired.
I wouldn’t apply value for a relume, but I wouldn’t let it keep me from buying a watch.
I bought this one knowing I could have the minute hand relumed to match the hour hand.

If I didn’t have the resources to have it done, I wouldn’t have purchased the watch- I couldn’t stand to look at it.

Relumed hands— does it matter?

Syrte

Flip

Syrte

airansun

Flip

Zapatta

Spruce

Maganator

cchen

janice&fred

Peemacgee

Lucasssssss

STANDY

fibonacci

DaveK

M'Bob

Dan S

Larry S

OllieOnTheRocks

JwRosenthal

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