Refinished dial on this 18k Constellation?

jantjewgm · Dec 19, 2022

Hello and good afternoon,
My friend was happy with his recent purchase of this Omega Constellation in 18k gold with a cal. 505 movement. I believe it’s from the 60’s. I pointed out that in my opinion the dial has been refinished at some point, but the case looks ok. He pays 1800€ for it. Did he made a mistake? What are your thoughts on it? Is it worth searching for a replacement original dial?

TheGreekPhysique · Dec 19, 2022

Dial has been refinished yes. And crown is wrong. Case is very polished. 1800 is way to much for it IMO.

Dan S · Dec 19, 2022

Can he just return it?

Kraal90 · Dec 19, 2022

If your friend is happy with the watch and is going to use it then keep it as is. Dial has been refinished and case polished as others have said.
It really depends on how much of a watch geek your friend is. Most people are happy with the watch as it looks in the pictures.

140dave · Dec 19, 2022

....and if he isnt a watch geek just say "Nice watch!" and move on

akshayluc420 · Dec 19, 2022

I'm not familiar with vintage pieces, did Omega ever make deployants like that at that time? I don't see a logo so assuming after-market, pairs well with the case though.

BarbVl · Dec 19, 2022

For me it's always very difficult to estimate a value of a gold watch..but seems a little to high for this one.

jantjewgm · Dec 19, 2022

I agree, 1800 seems way too high. Didn’t know the crown was wrong as well. Hope he can return it!

X350 XJR · Dec 19, 2022

I'm going to disagree a bit.

While yes, the case has seen some polish the bevel on the bezel is still pretty good as is the medallion on the back.

As for the dial, as refinished dials go it's really not so bad.

A decent wearable watch for the non collector, perhaps not an $1800 watch but not a $1000 watch either.

jantjewgm · Dec 20, 2022

He tells me the buckle/clasp is 18k gold as well, so that adds up to the value. Not sure what that would be worth but for sure a small part of the price.

MtV · Dec 20, 2022

X350 XJR
I'm going to disagree a bit.

While yes, the case has seen some polish the bevel on the bezel is still pretty good as is the medallion on the back.

As for the dial, as refinished dials go it's really not so bad.

A decent wearable watch for the non collector, perhaps not an $1800 watch but not a $1000 watch either.

I'll second this. Add a nice dial (and the right crown) and this is a ~ 2.5-3k watch. Even though it's a redial, I'd say 1800$ isn't too far off a realistic price.

jantjewgm
He tells me the buckle/clasp is 18k gold as well, so that adds up to the value. Not sure what that would be worth but for sure a small part of the price.

And that makes it a good buy to me, provided you're comfortable searching for a replacement dial, which you'll most likely find in form of another full example. A period-correct, 16mm 18k buckle is ~300$ or so, leaving 1500$ (or maybe a little less with negotiations for the watch.
/edit: I have to correct myself, didnt check the pictures above - was assuming we were speaking of an 18k Omega buckle. If it's a generic one, it'll "just" be worth gold value.

mondodec · Dec 20, 2022

Good point, the lugs still retain their lines and bevel on the bezel is fine. I find the polishing okay and it seems to have been done without rounding any sharp edges.

For those who declared redial on this watch, I'm wondering if you could point out specifically what red flags led you to that conclusion.

Looking at the dial pic in large format what I see are perfectly aligned five minute printed markers with the applied markers, perfectly aligned Swiss Made, good cross hair, MOY and lettering within accepted margins for a cal 505 model, and not much I can fault.

I think the pic is a lower pixel pic and there has been some marginal distortion to the dial by potential scratches on the crystal, but short of having a pic that showed the printing was flat and not embossed, I wouldn't be inclined to call this dial an imposter.

Cheers

Desmond

X350 XJR
I'm going to disagree a bit.

While yes, the case has seen some polish the bevel on the bezel is still pretty good as is the medallion on the back.

As for the dial, as refinished dials go it's really not so bad.

A decent wearable watch for the non collector, perhaps not an $1800 watch but not a $1000 watch either.

Olhenry56 · Dec 20, 2022

It seems that the minute track is for a 12-sided pie pan dial, but it seems to be a domed dial. The crosshairs look a little inconsistent, as do the fonts, which don't seem to have any serifs. That said, I have about 1/10,000 the experience and I'm looking at the photos on my phone, so these may not be valid red flags.
Edit: I would have expected the older spelling, "Chronometre," too. Happy to be corrected and learn something.

gatorcpa · Dec 20, 2022

The pictures here lack clarity, so I’m not going to say much about the dial, other than to point out that unless this is a very late (like serial number in high 16M range) Ref. 2852 example, it should have “Chronometre” on the dial.

Also, shouldn’t there be engravings of “Constellation” and “Waterproof” on the back of the watch?

This one may be polished just a bit too much for me.
gatorcpa

jantjewgm · Dec 21, 2022

The movement serial is in the 16M, but the reference he does not know.

as for the font, I thought the A’s are with a flat top, or is that incorrect.

MtV · Dec 21, 2022

jantjewgm
The movement serial is in the 16M, but the reference he does not know.

There's no other Constellation reference it could be with a cal. 505.

Olhenry56 · Dec 21, 2022

I found the listing for the auction which states that the reference is 2943/54. If I understand correctly, I think that means the case back is probably incorrect since those are date models? If so, that would make me question whether the case is solid gold, unless that's a hallmark on the back of the 7 o'clock lug (or perhaps someone here knows another way to be certain).
https://www.invaluable.com/auction-...prod&queryID=47ee75c8dc5360896690bfe4b2240fa1

gatorcpa · Dec 21, 2022

The Ref. 2943/2954 casebacks also have the engraving on the outside, which seems to be missing or very faint on this piece. So at the very least we know it is over polished.

Then regardless of whether the cataloguer made an error on the movement (504, rather than 505) or on the case reference, we have a frankenwatch here with a possible redial.

I was unable to find a single other example of a Ref. 2943/2954 caseback with a domed arrowhead dial (as opposed to a pie-pan arrowhead dial). So I would lean towards the cal. 505 movement and a replaced polished caseback on this one.
gatorcpa

jantjewgm · Dec 21, 2022

Thanks for this information guys, very helpful. Knowing this, it is definitely not worth his money. I think it is also weird to not mention all this important information in the lot description..

new_heuer · Dec 21, 2022

jantjewgm
Thanks for this information guys, very helpful. Knowing this, it is definitely not worth his money. I think it is also weird to not mention all this important information in the lot description..

Welcome to buying from auction houses, a place for the most experienced collectors unless you want to get burnt. Ebay is a safer place to buy

Refinished dial on this 18k Constellation?

jantjewgm

TheGreekPhysique

Dan S

Kraal90

140dave

akshayluc420

BarbVl

jantjewgm

X350 XJR

jantjewgm

MtV

mondodec

Olhenry56

gatorcpa

jantjewgm

MtV

Olhenry56

gatorcpa

jantjewgm

new_heuer

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