There are now some additional photos of the A384 mentioned above. Edges are probably within MMMD tolerances, but do they meet the LouS standard, i.e. can this watch do double-duty as a grater for your parmigiano reggiano?

 

Happiness is a case edge so crisp you can slice tomatoes with them. Same with the pleat in my slacks.

 

Not looking similar Lou but a silvered (albeit) guilloche sub-dial.

 

Here's another interesting question.

Let's say you own a G381 El Primero and the dial is faded or a bit tatty. If you were to but this......

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Zenith-El-Pr...rmbanduhren&hash=item1c2e3d103d#ht_5130wt_906Purchases made through these links may earn this site a commission from the eBay Partner Network

..... and use the dial on your movement in the original case - thus improving its value - nobody would ever know. It isn't a service dial, it isn't a franken and it isn't a refurbished dial. It looks like a nice example of a G381.

Come to think about it, if the movement works well, why even take the dial off - after all the movements don't have serial numbers.

Before anybody asks, I have a G582, not a G381 and they made 600 G582s against 700 G381s, but the cases are the same.

So the question is, would you do it and would you consider it cheating? Is it any different from using any other second hand part in the watch?

 

For me it's not cheating at all, as long as the parts are truly indistinguishable... no mucking with serial numbers, etc. Of course, I'm the guy who's assembling his own Espada, and more matchmaker than watchmaker, but I think this sort of thing is a fun part of the game. Recognizing that others might feel differently, I wouldn't misrepresent these exchanges when selling, but I suspect many collectors feel the same way I do.

 

I just put a NOS replacement dial on my late 50's Omega Genève. It had a bad redial, so I consider it making the watch correct to factory specs again - which is different than original, but just as good to me. If I ever sell it I'll disclose that the dial was replaced with an authentic Omega part identical to original. Better than a redial in my book!

Back in WWII broken Jeeps were cannibalized to make working ones. They were still all correct parts, just not original.

Cheating? No - unless you aren't honest about it when you go to sell it and attempt to pass it off as a watch with all the exact original parts as it came from the factory.

 

Please address the cheese-grating issue.

 

Yeesh. Wrong case back knocks it down a few pegs for me. Possibly a deal-breaker. What are the possibilities? Case back taken from another model? Dial and hands swapped into an A 385/3817/3818? Replacement case back from Zenith? Maybe the whole watch was a special order? Can I live with the uncertainty?

 

No, no, don't alarm the villagers. This watch means you no harm. It's really the RIGHT case back in all respects except perhaps the case serial number (not the reference number... I think...). I'm not ready to use the F-word here.

 

Pitchforks and torches retracted.

 

Something like a fraternal twin. This is the version of the Zenith Espada sold in the USA, branded Movado (the two companies were part of the same holding company in the early '70's) to circumvent trademark issues with the Zenith radio corporation. The Astronic is actually more rare than the Espada by production numbers but certainly seen more commonly than the Espada at auction, so clutched less firmly by collectors. The major difference is jewel count - the 3019 PHF's chronograph has been de-jeweled to bring the count down from 31 to 17 and thus save on American import duties (like the Movado Datron). The hour markers are different than the Espada (and to my eye better looking)... apart from these differences, it is a straight-up Espada. As is the case with many Astronics, the crown and clasp are replacements, but this otherwise looks like a pretty sweet example... probably will go between $3.5 - 4k.
I can see it's time to start a Movado-Zenith thread... will try to get this going later today.