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Recent Omega Negativity
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerI’m also not sure what “misinformation” I’m supposed to have fallen for. The problem is that if someone reads this thread or the other one, the picture they get is all over the place "Omega says 50m = 50m, some say I swim with mine all the time, others say don’t take it near water, some ADs say surface swimming is fine, others say only splash‑proof, some owners say "salt water is dangerous and you are stupid if you swim with it”
So what does that do? It creates ambiguity. There is no exact line which you need to cross "if you follow these steps, you will be fine, but this is forbidden". I’m confused because people here say it should be fine, yet my watch literally fogged on a rainy day. I’m not a watchmaker, I haven’t seen hundreds of these, so I have no baseline. If there was no ambiguity, I would have pushed Omega hard the first time it happened. But because there is ambiguity, I’m only asking questions five years later - when Omega suddenly discovers “crown stem tube damage.”
Again, the AD is not Omega. People here are not Omega. People on other forums are not Omega. Omega is clear on what their watches are rated for, regardless if you believe it or not.
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Jakeys
·When do the senior members usually start deploying the cats?
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ErichPryde
··Seamasters ForeverWhen do the senior members usually start deploying the cats?
Make it so
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Linas
·This exact misinformation. It's pretty clear that all you want is people to argue with or to agree with you. You still cannot separate the individual defective watch, from the design.
Again, the AD is not Omega. People here are not Omega. People on other forums are not Omega. Omega is clear on what their watches are rated for, regardless if you believe it or not.
All the other wet Speedmasters out there - the hundreds of threads about wet Speedies - are those all defective too? All user error? Or is it possible that a “no‑dive” 50m rating just isn’t quite enough in real‑world use?
So when you say obviously defective... it’s really not that obvious....
You can accept that omega's website is the actual information and that people are fallible and some watches are faulty, or you can keep arguing that there is absolutely no possible answer because it's too confusing for you.
To both of you... Omega is not some holy entity that can't be wrong. I’m not saying they are lying, but you are treating their marketing as if it’s devine truth and must be taken literally. Brands exaggerate, owners have mixed experiences and service centres miss defects. That is reality...
The issue I’m describing is simple. If you buy a Submariner, you can jump into the sea, dive off a 10m cliff, swim however you like, as long as the crown is screwed down, it just works. If it fogs, it is a defect. There is no ambiguity, no AD would ever advise not to swim with it or not to jump off a cliff... as long as the jump is not high enough that crystal (and you mug splits in half) go for it! The same applies to dive-rated Omegas. Am I exaggerating anything here?
You can’t say the same about the Speedmaster. Yes, it’s not a dive watch, but the practical limits are unclear. That’s the ambiguity I’m talking about. One AD explained it like this: "jumping from 5 metres creates a pressure spike that exceeds the WR rating" (I think he said equivalent to 500 m depth at the crown, which is nonsense, but that is not the point). A screw‑down crown handles that, a push‑down crown doesn’t. Fine, but what they didn’t explain is what a push‑down crown can actually handle. How gently do you need to enter the water for a 50 m rating to be meaningful?
You keep saying Omega tests to 50m and that it’s fine for "normal use". I’m not disputing that I’m asking what "normal use" actually means in practice. Is jumping from a 3m platform "normal" (obviously not)? Is pushing off a pool wall "normal"? Is swimming front crawl "normal"? Is an awkward arm movement that hits the surface at an angle still "normal"? If the watch can theoretically survive 50m depth, how carefully does someone have to enter the water for that to be true? Be slowly lowered in the cage, while standing still?
The fact that nobody can answer that with a clear, practical guideline is exactly the ambiguity - it sort of is waterproof, but only if you carefull enough? How much is enough?
I mean we can argue of why it is, crown designs, seal materials etc. But you not really suggesting and "non-defective" Speedmaster can survive 50m depth in real body of water... no matter how you got to that depth. I am not even disputing it can survive 50m depth (debatable), but I think there is a dynamic-pressure/sealing question, before we even get under the surface.
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Linas
·Only two possibilities? Surely you are not asserting that a Rolex watch is simply incapable of having a seal wear out? That would be.... psychotic.
So, yes that makes it two - defect or user error.
I guess you are arguing - wear and tear should be the third category... fine, but I was talking about a brand new and theoretically perfect watch. Not a vintage watch or some unpredictable wear and tear.
Classic Strawman...
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ErichPryde
··Seamasters Forever
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Linas
·Yes, I am suggesting it based upon what I already shared from Omega's site.
This isn't ambiguous; but, you're free to keep trying.
You not defined what "normal use" is, nor how exactly one gets to that 50m depth without doing something "abnormal"... that is 2.
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texasmade
·Does Omega say anything about wearing a Speedmaster while operating a lawnmower?
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Vinz Clortho
·Does Omega say anything about wearing a Speedmaster while operating a lawnmower?
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Linas
·Omega doesn't market the Speedmaster as a swimming watch. It's not advertised (and I'll define that just so you can't be disengenous about it: advertised: obviously displayed in a way to attract sales or be a selling point; promoted) at all- Omega tucks it away in the FAQ section. Why? Because they don't want to sell everyone a Speedmaster- they want to sell everyone a Speedmaster and a Seamaster for swimming. Which is exactly why you get the nonsense answers from Sales associates at ADs.
I am not appealing to a false authority, I am pulling directly from the manufacturer's website- which should be the authority. If you genuinely, honestly, cannot see the difference, then- there is simply no answer that could possibly convince you because there is no authority you accept. And if there is no authority or answer you can accept then you are engaging in a sort of "Invincible Ignorance" Fallacy. It's one of my favorites and typically crops up when science topics (like water pressure, although more often when I'm discussing biology or evolution or in the few instances I idiotically decided to argue with a Moon landing conspiracy theorist, Flat earther, or YEC) come up.
Normal use- Omega defines this as swimming at depths up to the rating. pushing off the pool wall is not going to exert more pressure at 6 feet of depth, than swimming at 150 feet of depth. Jumping off of a 10 foot high dive? Probably not going to be a problem. Your example of the cage? Probably not how most people get in the water- Most probably jump in, no? But certainly, that's not going to cause an issue, unless you fall against the cage and damage your watch. Normal swimming activities are just that- things you might find normal people doing at your normal, average swimming pool. Or maybe at the beach.
But you know what might do it? I bet if you jumped off a championship high dive with a Speedmaster, that'd probably damage your watch- and ouch, probably your wrist! But that would be championship diving- not swimming, right? Or maybe you could try jetskiing.... but that wouldn't be a swimming activity, would it?
You can wind this up to whatever level of irreducible complexity/keep appealing to complexity as much as you please, but it's really not that complicated. The answer you have received multiple times- is that you (unfortunately) had a watch with faulty seals. It sometimes happens, and it's never fun.
That's it.
Thanks for the conversation. It was fun, but, I feel satisfied with how well your question has been answered and I'm finished answering you.
"They want to sell everyone a Speedmaster and a Seamaster for swimming." Exactly, where do we disagree then? And exactly my point, why Submariner is such an issue for Omega's line-up. It is a watch that is as iconic as Speedmaster and as durable as Seamaster in one case, yet cheaper than a combo of the two. If one has to have one watch for their life (the majority of luxury watch buyers), then which one will they choose?
I am honestly not trying to be disingenuous about it, but I truly don't believe that Speedmaster can survive a dive from 10 foot (I actually said 10m, but I don't even believe it can survive 10 foot), nowhere does Omega say that is alright to do and hide behind thsi "normal" use. Cage was just an example, my point - if the watch is carefully lowered to 50m depth, maybe it would survive (I highly doubt it, but I would be impressed if it did). However, I don't believe that you can run up to the sea, jump headfirst, even without any cliff, just when running up to the hips in the water, then dive to 50m depth, and the watch will be alright.
Well obviously, I would not be able to dive so deep, I probably could do 10m tops, but I have no hope that even a perfectly functioning Speedmaster would survive that. I don't think it can survive the normal swimming activity you mentioned.
You can call me pesimist, perhaps my defective Speedy shattered my optimism (I still note nobody is willing to accept it in writing that it was actually defective or even discuss possibilities of how that happened). Only now you are saying - "The answer you have received multiple times - is that you (unfortunately) had a watch with faulty seals". Seriously - faulty seals, 3 times in a row on a brand new watch? Or more likely that the damaged crown stem?
By the way I am not mocking you - I just find it surprising that nobody on that thread said "if what you are telling is true, then speak with your AD, raise it to Omega HQ, this is definitely not expected from your watch". And yet here you are claiming diving, jumping into sea, just doing whatever all the way up to 50m is no problem. Don't you see a disconnect?
Threads about issues get ignored, but when a discussion starts about WR suddenly everyone is claiming that Speedmaster not only safe to swim in sea, you can literally dive from the jump all the way to 50m no problem... just be "normal". Wrong observation?
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hen
·This is Alexander, unfortunatly he is as dead as the water resistance debate.
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ErichKeane
·This thread is so much past the need for this, we should all be banned for not doing it yet. Ya'll are all on notice.
@hen: Am I a joke to you?
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerThese depth ratings are not marketing. This information from the web site is all mirrored in all of Omega's technical information, which I have access to a watchmaker certified by Omega. So there are standards and procedures for pressure testing that reflect the exact same thing - Omega's watches are capable of passing whatever test you give it for the rated depth. I do this nearly every day in my work.
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ErichKeane
·I'll note a damaged crown tube is going to leak, no matter if you're in a DeepSea or a 1m swatch. ANY depth rating is erased if you have that sort of damaged.
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DSotW
·I think it comes from different angles.
They have raised prices a lot recently.
Their design choices as of late are challenging to many Omega fans.
The Omega X Swatch Moonswatch Speedmaster went from something niche and "cool" to the typical over-released / too many models that the regular Speedmaster suffers from.
They have raised prices a lot recently.
Their design choices as of late are challenging to many Omega fans.
The Omega X Swatch Moonswatch Speedmaster went from something niche and "cool" to the typical over-released / too many models that the regular Speedmaster suffers from.
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