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tyrantlizardrex
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M'Bob M'Bob
You are likely right on the money, yet I can't help thinking maybe they know something we don't: like maybe the entire "luxury" watch segment is incrementally moving towards being within reach only to the deep-pocketed, and they intend to cater to that population.

I can't help thinking that it's much easier, and makes better business sense for most companies to sell 10,000 VW Golfs, that 10 Buggati Veyrons...

And I have no problem buying a VW Golf, just as long as I'm not being charged more so that the company can pretend that I'm buying a watered down Veyron.
 
Niloticus
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tyrantlizardrex tyrantlizardrex
It's like being at DisneyLand... you're 3,000 from the front... now watch these animatronic racoons.
Hahaha...
On a different note, this limited edition business is lazy on Omega's part. To keep the Speedmaster line live and animated its makes more business sense to add new limited editions. More profitable than trying to to tie it in to new projects/ adverizing campaigns/events. Its just one flanker after the other. The risk being dilution of the brand image. On top of that, I would guess that Omega needs to anniversarize its yearly launches to get the wholesale in.
 
tyrantlizardrex
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Niloticus Edantony
Hahaha...
On a different note, this limited edition business is lazy on Omega's part. To keep the Speedmaster line live and animated its makes more business sense to add new limited editions. More profitable than trying to to tie it in to new projects/ adverizing campaigns/events. Its just one flanker after the other. The risk being dilution of the brand image. On top of that, I would guess that Omega needs to anniversarize its yearly launches to get the wholesale in.

The seemingly endless Bond, and Speedmaster LE's paint a very vivid picture of what sells well from the sports watch lines... 😉

I've heard numerous staff say that people come in and ask for "The Bond Watch", or the "NASA watch".

So if these are the bread and butter, it doesn't seem to make sense to price them as Steak and Lobster.
 
DLT222
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tyrantlizardrex tyrantlizardrex
No.

The particular bee I have in my bonnet is around the ongoing price increases of steel, 1861 equipped Speedmasters.

In 2015 the list was £2695... now we're at £4100... and the watch is the same... sure it comes with a big box and some tools, but not £1450 worth.

Would be nice if they stopped trying to be Rolex, and just got on with being Omega...

2015 the new ref speedy in the uk was £2960 it is now £3520. The reference before (3570.50) was £2880 new.
 
tyrantlizardrex
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Ahh I was off by a few hundred, apologies Darren - Still an utter piss take to keep pumping the prices if anything those Chineese made bracelets should be dropping the price... 😉
 
Niloticus
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tyrantlizardrex tyrantlizardrex
The seemingly endless Bond, and Speedmaster LE's paint a very vivid picture of what sells well from the sports watch lines... 😉

I've heard numerous staff say that people come in and ask for "The Bond Watch", or the "NASA watch".

So if these are the bread and butter, it doesn't seem to make sense to price them as Steak and Lobster.
Yes theoretically in that price segment you're competing with Rolex I'd guess - average Joe who wants a nice watch will probably choose from 2 or 3 "popular" options, one of them being a submariner, the other one a speedmaster and the third one being a Tank.
The "lobster"-priced LEs are a totally different animal - catered to collectors like us I would guess, hence the premium.
 
tyrantlizardrex
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Even the non “lobster prices” models are heading distinctly in that direction.

I get that Onega want to push into the “luxury” segment, but they do so at the risk of alienating long term, loyal customers - those of us who can’t afford every new release, and LE, but would like to buy something new every once in a while.
 
Riviera Paradise
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I would certainly love for Omega to offer more competitive pricing on the Speedy Pro and LEs (why pay more for a product?), but I can't really see why they should as a business, some points for consideration outlined below:

1) Follow the money trail. Omega's biggest uptake in growth in 2017 has been in Asia and I can't see any other region offering that opportunity for continued growth in the coming years. In the US the grey, pre-owned and vintage market has reduced new luxury watch sales in the +US$5K range, and I don't see that changing any time soon.

If Asia can tolerate +US$5k luxury watches and still grow as a market I honestly don't think Omega will care about keeping the Speedy price at a coherent level with historical pricing. Recently in November, when passing through Vancouver, BC the JLC boutique manager told me that the Tiffany store next to him had outsold Tiffany in New York, essentially with Chinese tourists/customers. Perhaps Omega are putting all their eggs in one Asian basket? Perhaps, but I honestly don't think US$5K for a Speedy Pro is going to generate any reduction in global sales for them.

2) It should be noted that although Omega have increased pricing on the Speedy they are offering with the new Railmaster non-LE a competitive in-house movement product at US$5K. My perception is that they seem to be readjusting their product range above >US$+5K pricing and the Speedy has been priced too low compared with the rest of their product range. The new Speedy Racing was also launched with competitive pricing and the new AT as well. So clearly Omega are aware of the need for competitive pricing and we should not use the Speedy Pro price increase as a general indicator of where they are going.

3) Omega can afford to raise pricing on the Speedy Pro as they are fully aware of the huge legacy / following the watch has. Heck when someone like Wei Koh goes on a Speedy LE binge in 2017 (Speedy Tuesday, CK2998 and Snoopy)...you know that Omega have succeed in re-positioning the Speedy upmarket.

4) Omega need to leave space at the lower end of the market for Longines to offer higher value/margin products at the US$3-5K range such as the Longines Avigation BigEye, competing against Oris, Tag-Heuer, Tudor, Breitling etc.

5) For me the real "villains" in terms of "greedy" Omega pricing in 2017 were the 60th Speedy LE and the Railmaster LE...and both seem to have been successful. Both watches are simply too beautiful and I am sure the emotional drive to pull the trigger kicked in when many of us saw these watches live. I might still purchase a Railmaster LE in Jan 2018, although at US$6.800 for a 3 hand watch with no applied indices it seems absurd value compared with something like a Grand Seiko Snowflake or even Omega's new AT.

6) Omega will never go back to being the working man's / middle class daily beater watch. That space has been taken by the smartwatch in the 21st century. We watch lovers indulge in luxury items that make no sense from a rational purchasing perspective (value vs product functionality). I would argue that a Speedy Pro at US$3-4K is just as "absurd" as a Speedy Pro at US$5K.
 
tyrantlizardrex
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A product that’s seen no development in... 17(?) years and arguable costs less to make now than ever before sees price increases to justify Omega wanting to be Rolex.

Hmm... and I’m out.
 
Riviera Paradise
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tyrantlizardrex tyrantlizardrex
A product that’s seen no development in... 17(?) years and arguable costs less to make now than ever before sees price increases to justify Omega wanting to be Rolex.

Hmm... and I’m out.
I don't think Omega is increasing Speedy pricing because they want to be Rolex. They are doing it because they can.

I would also add that IMO no luxury watch can be compared to a "Golf". The "Golf" is an excellent car within its price range and clearly offers value in terms of functionality (drive, safety, comfort etc.). No modern luxury watch offers real world "features" to justify its price point. Some would argue the vintage luxury watch market is now even more absurd in terms of actual product functionality vs value.

Luxury watches are seductive lovers, expensive to acquire and maintain, and can easily spoil marriages.🙄
 
tyrantlizardrex
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That’s the problem right there “luxury”.

Like “exclusive”, “limited”, and “rare”, a whore of a word, available for hire by any brand that needs to sell water as wine.

😉
 
Riviera Paradise
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tyrantlizardrex tyrantlizardrex
That’s the problem right there “luxury”.

Like “exclusive”, “limited”, and “rare”, a whore of a word, available for hire by any brand that needs to sell water as wine.

😉
Or selling water as "luxury" water😉
82.png


Sorry Chris, but I can't understand your train of thought. A Speedmaster "should" cost around US$500-US$1000,00 in terms of real product value with no luxury brand overhead, right? But you would buy one at US$2K, right? So is it the amount of "whoring" that Omega are doing that rubs you the wrong way? In other words the fact that they have priced themselves above what you personally believe should be the limit of their "luxury" brand overhead?
 
tyrantlizardrex
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It irritates me that they have, in the time that I have been into watches, trebled the retail price of a Speedmaster.

They’ve done it to “remain competitive”. That’s what senior people within the brand have told me.

And that’s fine.

I’m not saying I think the price should be $2k. I’m saying that upping the price of a product that is low cost to produce, and hadn’t seen development in years, to create parity with the rest of the industries pricing, or the new expensive products within Omega’s own range is nothing more than a cynical money grab.

It’s not that the Speedmaster needed to go up in price to create pricing cosistancy, it’s that the new models introduced should have been retailed for less to start with.

Solid evidence of this is the sheer volume of ceramic Speedmasters available in the grey market at knock down prices.

It irritates me that my money is longer good enough for the folks in Bienne.

Families like mine, who have bought watches from them fairly consistently over the last 50 years helped them to be the business they are today... it would be nice if they remembered that, instead of just laughing into their Bollinger.

I realise I’m asking a lot of a corporation, but there you have it.
 
MaiLollo
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tyrantlizardrex tyrantlizardrex
It irritates me that they have, in the time that I have been into watches, trebled the retail price of a Speedmaster.

They’ve done it to “remain competitive”. That’s what senior people within the brand have told me.

And that’s fine.

I’m not saying I think the price should be $2k. I’m saying that upping the price of a product that is low cost to produce, and hadn’t seen development in years, to create parity with the rest of the industries pricing, or the new expensive products within Omega’s own range is nothing more than a cynical money grab.

It’s not that the Speedmaster needed to go up in price to create pricing cosistancy, it’s that the new models introduced should have been retailed for less to start with.

Solid evidence of this is the sheer volume of ceramic Speedmasters available in the grey market at knock down prices.

It irritates me that my money is longer good enough for the folks in Bienne.

Families like mine, who have bought watches from them fairly consistently over the last 50 years helped them to be the business they are today... it would be nice if they remembered that, instead of just laughing into their Bollinger.

I realise I’m asking a lot of a corporation, but there you have it.
I also think that OMega needs to "milk" the moon watch in order to finance models with lower margins or much lower sales volumes, and the only two watches that sell really well are the speedy and the Seamaster...
 
M'Bob
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Maybe significantly under priced for years, and now where they should be? Or put another way: if you are a long-time customer, maybe your loyalty gets re-paid by decent appreciation?
 
Riviera Paradise
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tyrantlizardrex tyrantlizardrex
It irritates me that they have, in the time that I have been into watches, trebled the retail price of a Speedmaster.

It’s not that the Speedmaster needed to go up in price to create pricing cosistancy, it’s that the new models introduced should have been retailed for less to start with.

Solid evidence of this is the sheer volume of ceramic Speedmasters available in the grey market at knock down prices.

It irritates me that my money is longer good enough for the folks in Bienne.

Families like mine, who have bought watches from them fairly consistently over the last 50 years helped them to be the business they are today... it would be nice if they remembered that, instead of just laughing into their Bollinger.

I realise I’m asking a lot of a corporation, but there you have it.

Although I fully understand where you are coming from on the emotional side of things, you are indeed asking too much of a corporation with public listed stock. I are sure you would be pissed off if you owned Omega stock and received an analyst report stating that they had not maximized their profit value on their leading iconic product range.

As we have just seen recently with the downturn in 2015-2016 mechanical watch sales are cyclical. In the quartz / smartwatch era they are now completely superfluous products (something which was not true 50 yrs ago), so do you blame a company for maximizing profit value during an upswing period and hoard cash for the bad times?

Ref. your comment on the ceramic Speedys I think Omega's mistake was flooding the market with too many XOSTM variants. During the 2013 launch year when the DSOTM was hard to get, it retained value pretty well. Omega could have stuck just to the DSOTM/GSOTM, controlled distribution and created a true "Daytona" rival...desired etc.

Certainly in terms of product development cost I would imagine the DSOTM/GSOTM costs more to produce than the SS Daytona, so again the end value in this market is clearly generated by supply and demand/desire and not actual product development, manufacturing cost.

As you well know the key brands still offering true "value for money" in the mechanical watch industry are Seiko, Nomos, Longines and Oris. Omega simply cannot afford to carry on playing in that crowded space.
 
Riviera Paradise
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MaiLollo MaiLollo
I also think that OMega needs to "milk" the moon watch in order to finance models with lower margins or much lower sales volumes, and the only two watches that sell really well are the speedy and the Seamaster...
It varies globally. Apparently in Asia the Constellation is their no. 1 seller.
 
tyrantlizardrex
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These are emotive products... and I strongly believe that if you don’t treat your existing customers with the same respect, that you do the money of your new customers, then you don’t deserve any customers at all.
 
tyrantlizardrex
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And at the same time, I’m no longer a customer, and likely to never be again... so what I think matters not one jot.
 
kov
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tyrantlizardrex tyrantlizardrex
I got a slight variant on the message:

"There's an upside to waiting for your watch to arrive… how sweet it feels when it's finally yours!

Almost all of the #SpeedyTuesday watches have now been sent and the remaining watches will be on the wrists of their owners in January.

We can also tell you that 2018 is definitely going to be another Speedy year. You'll be among the first to know."

Which I'm taking as "We're going to tell you about it, but since you complained so much about the delivery process with the Speedy Tuesday, and won't back down about the price increases, we guess you probably don't want to buy a watch from us anyway". 😁

Got the same email as you, Chris. Shall I be worried about my reputation? 😵‍💫
 
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