Patching a run flat? Advice needed...

duc · Jul 24, 2021

Just to dial it back from the "replace it." crowd; Al's wife was able to safely negotiate to a safe place when the initial flat occurred. Why is the risk of a plug or patch worse than that?. Most driving is done at speeds and conditions far less than the 95% (those that push it to 95% of a tire or cars capability) crowd that races. I've had plugs and patches over the past 20 years, in multiple vehicles, including a BMW X3 (admittedly not high performance). None caused problems after the fact, and lasted until the next required tire replacement.

dsio · Jul 24, 2021

MTROIS
Just for my info, were these also “run flat” tires?

In any case, back to @Archer : as much as it sucks, I would not chance it.

No they were regular, runflats on the 3 series only started on the e90 and many owners tend to ditch them anyway for the poor ride and performance

dsio · Jul 24, 2021

Foo2rama

spinning an e46 is part of the ownership experience.

It’s pretty rare really, like the e30s liked to swap ends but the ASC / DSC on e46 is pretty good and the non-Ms are biased towards understeer quite significantly to keep them behaving, even in the wet I’ve never had an issue in 15 years of driving them until I lost a tyre

Toishome · Jul 24, 2021

That's nowhere close to the sidewall. I would patch it. Also not that risky if is on the rear.

ScubaPro · Jul 24, 2021

Just replace it. And asking a watch forum about runflats ls like asking a lawnmower forum how to lubricate a coaxial Omega. Talk to BMW about it if you want the straight dope, but just replace the tire and problem solved.

DoctorEvil · Jul 24, 2021

Just take your car to a reputable tyre place and they can tell you if it's repairable or not. Over the past 10 years I've experienced 3 punctures with my run flats and 2 were repairable. No problems with those.

MtV · Jul 24, 2021

Walrus
Dude you got that set up at home. I am truly amazed and bow before you. There is so much I can do but don’t because I hate climbing under the car up on jacks. That is a thing of wonder, now I got that McCartney song “maybe I’m amazed” stuck in my head and may be developing feelings for you.

Before you wrote this I didn’t even consider it might be a home set up. Holy smokes that’s awesome. Your E46 M3s make me miss my E85 Z4M. What an engine…

FWIW @Archer I’ve known quite a few BMW mechanics who would’ve patched this on their own cars and happily drive Vmax with it. Have a tire shop have a look at it and see what they say. Also, if it lets go at some point it’s still a run flat…

Darlinboy · Jul 24, 2021

Archer
So, my wife was out today getting some groceries, and about 5kms from home the light went on. I checked it and found this in the left rear:

We replaced these last fall, so not really wanting to replace it again (only 4400 kms on them). I checked the pressure to make sure she hadn't stressed the side walls too much - first test was 28.5 and the second was 27.5...

My gut tells me this is too close to the side wall to fix. Thoughts?

No way I'm sending Mrs. @Archer (or anyone else) out on that tire - get a new one.👎

Deafcon · Jul 24, 2021

Archer
So, my wife was out today getting some groceries, and about 5kms from home the light went on. I checked it and found this in the left rear:

We replaced these last fall, so not really wanting to replace it again (only 4400 kms on them). I checked the pressure to make sure she hadn't stressed the side walls too much - first test was 28.5 and the second was 27.5...

My gut tells me this is too close to the side wall to fix. Thoughts?

As this tire wasn't actually driven on completely flat, the sidewall integrity will be fine, but generally the industry stance is run flats can not be repaired. I worked for a competing German car manufacture for quite a while, their stance was a repair to any type of tire was only temporary and it must be replaced. That said, a properly installed patch plug is a good repair, the issue you may run into is the proximity to the sidewall giving enough room for that repair.

redpcar · Jul 24, 2021

It's a close call. I've done many patches and plugs over the years. My car, I would plug it in the driveway. Are you going to do this yourself? I'm pretty sure no mainstream tire place will patch it. Too close to the edge and liability is too high.
BTW, do shops even patch run flats?
Why not plug it yourself and offer to swap cars for a week to make sure it holds?

perks713 · Jul 24, 2021

Nope, sell the car. 😉

BlackTalon · Jul 24, 2021

I would pull the wheel, remove the screw and plug the hole. And since it's the wife's, if the plug seems to be holding air and there do not appear to be any other leaks I'd then take it to a repair shop you have good experience with (as opposed to a Firestone tire shop, etc. who's business is to sell new tires) and have them pull the tire off and install a patch. If they look at the inside of the tire and declare it too dicey to fix then spring for a new tire. But I suspect this one is very repairable.

I've had to install many plugs over the years, and I've driven on the track with tires that I plugged and that mechanics plugged knowing full well the car was being driven on a track. And I have seen many others drive at speed on plugged tires.

As with anything, some common sense is needed such as monitoring the tire pressure periodically. Since this car is only street driven a tire pressure check every day or two for the first week should be okay to know the repair seems successful, and follow that up with checks at increasingly long intervals.

Evitzee · Jul 24, 2021

Punctures that were routinely patched in the past are now 'unpatchable', it's due to the litigious nature of our societies now. Motorcycle tires that were routinely patched are now considered toast, almost no dealer or repairer will even attempt to patch even a small puncture in the center of the tread on a m/c tire. It's just a sign of the times. Just put a new tire on and call it a day.

wagudc · Jul 24, 2021

Had a similar run flat. I took it to a well-known tire shop with locations across the US, and they said they had to be replaced. Then took it to a respected mom and tire shop. They fixed it free of charge and has given me no problems. I am now a loyal customer of the mom and pop shop. There is an incentive to say tires are not fixable and must be replaced.

MTROIS · Jul 24, 2021

BlackTalon
I would pull the wheel, remove the screw and plug the hole. And since it's the wife's, if the plug seems to be holding air and there do not appear to be any other leaks I'd then take it to a repair shop you have good experience with (as opposed to a Firestone tire shop, etc. who's business is to sell new tires) and have them pull the tire off and install a patch. If they look at the inside of the tire and declare it too dicey to fix then spring for a new tire. But I suspect this one is very repairable.

I've had to install many plugs over the years, and I've driven on the track with tires that I plugged and that mechanics plugged knowing full well the car was being driven on a track. And I have seen many others drive at speed on plugged tires.

As with anything, some common sense is needed such as monitoring the tire pressure periodically. Since this car is only street driven a tire pressure check every day or two for the first week should be okay to know the repair seems successful, and follow that up with checks at increasingly long intervals.

Are you for real!?
It is already borderline for street driving, but driving on a racetrack with a plugged tire!?! 😲 🤪

Foo2rama · Jul 24, 2021

Walrus
Dude you got that set up at home. I am truly amazed and bow before you. There is so much I can do but don’t because I hate climbing under the car up on jacks. That is a thing of wonder, now I got that McCartney song “maybe I’m amazed” stuck in my head and may be developing feelings for you.

Not my shop… just prepping before a track day.

dsio
It’s pretty rare really, like the e30s liked to swap ends but the ASC / DSC on e46 is pretty good and the non-Ms are biased towards understeer quite significantly to keep them behaving, even in the wet I’ve never had an issue in 15 years of driving them until I lost a tyre

Your right the dsc in the e46 is really good. Although almost everyone I know wanted to see how good it was off…. Most only did it once…

Thunder Dump · Jul 24, 2021

MSNWatch

This. I had a E93 for 10 years with the runflats and successfully patched one with a screw straight in much closer to the middle. On the shoulder like that I can't imagine you will find a reputable tire shop that would even consider patching it. And even if they did, I wouldn't risk it.

MTROIS · Jul 24, 2021

I am quite astounded by the amount of suggestions that it would be ok to plug this tire and keep driving on it.
I know how aggravating it must feel that this happened to a relatively new tire, the waste, the money to be spent, etc.... but the peace of mind of knowing that you are driving a safe car is priceless IMO.
Can some tires be plugged? Sure! But the reality is that the integrity of the tire is somewhat compromised so additional risk is already introduced.
And it one thing to plug a tire on a 2CV that is driven at sub 50km/h speeds and one that is mounted on a performance German car that is driven at speeds in excess of 130km/h, with high speed cornering, etc.... let alone on a race track!! 🤦

I am sure many will disagree, and tell us how many times they have done it and yadi yadi yada... but the reality is that you are putting your safety at risk AND the one of others.

This is the equivalent of a "hey, my watch is losing two minutes a day, can you do a quick lube on it so that it "works again" and only charge me $50 for this (hack) job", or something around these lines. 🙄

Rado63 · Jul 25, 2021

If your run flat tire can be repaired then today we use the plug patch to service a tire. The plug by itself has been proven to work in millions of repairs. I have actually seen photographs of plugs in any surface of a tire. The problem with a plug is that it must be seated completely to seal completely. If there is a slow leak in a plug repair, the repair could fail because the driver is thinking the leak was fixed and the pressure gets low and the tire blows out. In a properly seated plug the repair will be fine. In a modern car that may monitor tire pressure, the indicator panel displays the tire psi at all four corners so the driver can see the pressure decreasing if there was a leak after repair. If the car only has a warning light when low pressure is observed in a tire, then driver will still know that the repair is failing, so pull off and add air and go to repair shop. Have placed maybe 100 plugs myself and only one failed because not seated correctly through the steel and fiber belts of the tire. The failure only resulted in a slow leak not a blow out. The plug was removed and replaced and lasted the life of the tire. So I plug every leak. The run flat tire manufacturer may suggest that any tire driven while flat needs to be replaced, not that it can not be repaired. I would repair this tire if possible. Also if the car is all wheel drive differences in tread height can affect the differentials and you may need at least two tires and possibly all four. tires to be replaced when a replacement tire is needed. My current car is an all wheel drive and when selected, four wheel drive, Jeep drivetrain. Not recommended to replace one tire. The Jeep, it does have two plugs, in two different tires, and no problems, but these are not run flat tires.

padders · Jul 25, 2021

I’ve got an M240i with plugs in 2 of my winter tyres. Those are rfts and most tyre chains here won’t touch them at all due to the risks of the customer lying about whether the tyre was driven on flat (which destroys them). Mine were slow punctures like here so were not trashed. One chain will plug them if the hole is in the safe zone as already discussed. I do think the photo of Archer’s puncture suggests it is too close to the sidewall unfortunately. There is nothing more complicated about plugging an rft vs a go flat other than the damage caused by flat running. If you are happy to plug a go-flat, you should be happy to plug a (partially inflated) RFT.

I use non rft summer tyres. There are no issues with getting those repaired if necessary, so far it hasn’t been.

Am I right in assuming this isn't the Archer M2? I wouldn't have thought that S001 RFTs were an appropriate tyre choice for that anyhow, more a sporting touring tyre rather than SuperSports design. They work fine on lower power models though, I had them on a 125d.

Patching a run flat? Advice needed...

duc

dsio

dsio

Toishome

ScubaPro

DoctorEvil

MtV

Darlinboy

Deafcon

redpcar

perks713

BlackTalon

Evitzee

wagudc

MTROIS

Foo2rama

Thunder Dump

MTROIS

Rado63

padders

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