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  1. Cozmopak Jan 30, 2020

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    I was recently introduced to this watchmaker in the south of France, and I’m very impressed by his work. His first series of watches, a total of 60 I believe, was released in 2014 and the movement, all hand finished, was based on a Unitas. The watch at that time was something like 5000 Euros.

    He is currently starting his second series, based on the Omega 19 caliber movement. The finishing looks absolutely exquisite, all done by hand. I’m not sure where he sources his other materials like case, dial and hands. The price is no longer 5000 Euros, unfortunately.

    Here are some shamelessly pilfered images of the prototypes for the second series from the internet:

    414F7F50-8A31-4168-8866-24D0AB1F4F97.jpeg 69F45167-6477-4A1B-A9B4-5D489B39B42F.jpeg 9FA04D05-0781-4A91-9876-2D5F14FA7C84.jpeg 12D8DFFC-2CED-4CC4-AE74-6E885FCD00F3.jpeg
     
  2. zrleopold Jan 30, 2020

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    Those are stunning. What is the case size?
     
  3. Cozmopak Jan 30, 2020

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    I believe 39mm, but I’m not certain. I contacted Mr. Coyon and expect to get a lot more information shortly. I will report back.
     
  4. zrleopold Jan 30, 2020

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    Thanks! I think the first series was 42mm? Far too big for a dress watch in my opinion.
     
  5. Cozmopak Jan 30, 2020

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    I agree. Also, the first series was all in stainless steel, whereas now he is using precious metal. I also find the dial much more refined on the current series. Excited to learn more.
     
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  6. zrleopold Jan 30, 2020

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    Agreed. Looks like the second series is going to be around $30,000...which is a huge ask. At that price buyers will be looking at ALS, FPJ, etc.
     
  7. Cozmopak Jan 30, 2020

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    Yeah, we’ll have to see how kind the secondary market is for these watches a few years from now.

    The pre-owned first series is currently being sold on the secondary market for about 18k USD. I personally find the second series significantly more appealing.
     
    Edited Jan 30, 2020
  8. Cozmopak Jan 30, 2020

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    Just unearthed a bit more info: 39.8mm diameter, 8.8mm thickness.
     
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  9. zrleopold Jan 30, 2020

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    Probably an indication the first was priced too low and the second too high is my guess. Irrespective of price though they are definitely attractive!
     
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  10. MCC Jan 30, 2020

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    Not a name I am familiar with but the pictures look stunning,
     
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  11. SeanO Jan 31, 2020

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    30k is an awful lot of money for a non in-house movement.

    notwithstanding the amount of work in refinishing and decorating.

    30k would get you in on the ground floor with Lehtinen or another boutique manufacturer wouldn't it?
     
  12. NT931 Jan 31, 2020

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    Indeed! $30k gets you quite a lot of options, including some very nice indies.
     
  13. Deafboy His Holiness Puer Surdus Jan 31, 2020

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    The original Omega 19 movement was 19 lignes which corresponds to a diameter of 42.9 mm. Does someone know if the size of the reissue movement?

    From the pictures above the movement's balance wheel has timing screws, something you don't often see in contemporary movements.
     
  14. Cozmopak Jan 31, 2020

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    Ok, I received more information. The movement is indeed inspired by the Omega 19 calibre, but it is otherwise entirely made in house without any existing components. It beats at 18,000 bph. The gear wheel is a flat-shaped ogival wheel developed in-house and with hand-angled arms. The bridges are all finished by hand with thin cotes de Geneve.

    The balance is a variable inertia balance with a blue spiral.

    The hands are hand-made in gold.

    There will be two dial options: one in satin grey brushed with nails and applied numerals in white solid gold. The other will be pink with three combined textures with pink solid gold applied chapters.

    The dial and case are made in Switzerland, supplying other independent workshops. I’m going to try to get more details here. I know the cases will come in gold or platinum.

    They are also reducing their orders for this second series to 30 watches in order to keep the delivery times reasonable.

    In terms of price, it’s a lot of money, but honestly, for what you’re getting here, it seems well within the ballpark. For instance, Atelier de Chronometrie in Barcelona starts at 36,000 Euros and uses Omega movements as templates. When they first started out, I believe they were actually transforming old Omega movements to put into their watches. I think the outcry about Coyon’s prices largely stems from the ridiculously low prices of the first series.

    Here are some additional pictures:

    137C1EE0-CD68-4C08-9F61-182753F25EDA.jpeg 8F46BA59-44C9-4B9F-9901-96D715F92B0B.jpeg 7CAA7A25-8EBE-47A5-AB5E-D5D84D2E28F9.jpeg 3466FB11-8F08-43E5-9E42-DAC7C910D74F.jpeg FB547279-50A5-455E-92AF-FDAA27AC43AA.jpeg 82E6CA72-7537-45E6-82CA-FC7A4F5461DB.jpeg 3A8466FA-8C31-41CC-9346-7818739DEE8E.jpeg 6FC6C0FD-CB98-4C5E-9B0E-69F66264CAEE.jpeg
     
  15. Archer Omega Qualified Watchmaker Feb 1, 2020

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    The statement in bold above is somewhat misleading I think. Unless these guys are making their own jewels, drawing their own wire for balance springs, etc., they are certainly using some existing components. There's no shame in that by the way...for some parts like jewels, there's just no point in reinventing the wheel.

    I also take some issue with the use of the phrase "by hand" in the context of the operations described. I'm quite fine with anglage on the spokes of train wheels being done by hand, but how exactly do you make Côtes de Genève by hand? It requires machine tools to make this finish...

    Also, I hope they have a very good supply of balance staffs. For this sort of cash, I would expect some kind of shock protection on the balance jewels. I understand they are "inspired" by older Omega movements, but shock protection would be a worthy upgrade for a watch like this. Using a large balance, small pivots, and no shock protection is a recipe for many broken balance staffs - all it would take is a knock walking through a doorway...

    The movement photos shown in the previous posts appear to be renderings rather than real photos, or they are highly processed. Does anyone have an actual real life photo of the movement?

    Cheers, Al
     
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  16. Cozmopak Feb 1, 2020

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    Al, you’re a treasure on this forum. All excellent questions and concerns. I will try to uncover more.

    As an aside, my exploration of independent watchmaking has led to a surprising discovery: a watchmaker in my own backyard in Oregon. I would never have expected it: a man by the name of Keaton Myrick. I like his design ethos. It shows more personality than Coyon, in my opinion, who is heavily borrowing (and some may argue mimicking) classical designs.

    Here is some of Mr. Myricks work:

    25393310-EC36-40CD-BB25-A7E9CAA8D427.jpeg 71CB29DA-8BF1-4DB4-AD3A-600671339B15.jpeg 3FECAC5E-5A2C-4C8A-B203-DD33CF785819.jpeg FC4F15C2-36B7-4309-8C1B-53F874CA2BE7.jpeg CB0AE089-277C-4098-B73E-A34460D57B07.jpeg 22F40168-C416-4FE4-B89F-18CDD6E4F6E2.jpeg

    http://www.keatonmyrick.com/
     
    Edited Feb 1, 2020
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  17. Archer Omega Qualified Watchmaker Feb 1, 2020

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    I've heard of this maker before, although I've not actually seen the watches or visited the web site previously. Regarding my comment in the previous post about "hand made" I saw this video of a refinish of a center wheel chaton on the site:



    As you will see, he mounts the chaton in a lathe collet, and uses the lathe to polish it (that starts at about 2:30 in). In the "ethos" page, he says this:

    "I take immense pride in the manufacturing of my watches and go to great lengths to use traditional watchmaking practices and tools in each and every timepiece that leaves my workshop. My atelier is outfitted with the same tooling that was used by watchmakers decades ago and still serves me in my craft today, a real testament to the precision toolmakers of the 19th and early 20th centuries. As a modern watchmaker I do take full advantage of modern CAD systems to aid in the design stages. My watches, however, are very much handmade and hand finished to the highest level I can achieve."

    Again the use of "hand made" in this context, and seeing that chaton polishing does sort of rub me the wrong way. Now to be clear both these makers have serious skills, so I am probably being overly nitpicky here, but to me polishing a chaton in a lathe is not really all that traditional. While this doesn't show the polishing of a chaton, this video does show the polishing of a countersink in bridge, done in the "traditional" way, and truly by hand in the most basic sense of that phrase:



    This is a video I took while in Mr. Dufour's atelier many years ago, and the bridge in question is the fourth wheel bridge for a Simplicity.

    In speaking with the watchmaker doing this work, he had spent all morning polishing the countersinks in just a few of bridges (going from memory he had done maybe 4 so far that day). Further conversations revolved around when he knew it was finished to a high enough level, and he indicated it was about the feel of the ebony polishing stick used as he rotated it with the bow, rather than a visual inspection of the countersink.

    I'm not suggesting that the makers here should adopt this way of finishing, but if you are headed down the road of looking at independent watchmakers, and trying to understand the subtleties in finishing techniques, just be aware that there are many ways to perform these tasks, and not all of them are equal.

    In my previous post I mentioned Côtes de Genève, and there are several ways of accomplishing this finish. The vast majority of makers use the least challenging and least pleasing methods (once you know how to spot it, you can't "unsee" it), while a few use methods that recreate a "proper" Côtes de Genève finish, but are in a way a shortcut. Only a very few use the most traditional methods. So if you are considering shelling out serious money on a watch from an independent maker, understanding that it's not just the result but how you get there, that is important.

    I would be interested to know the size of the movement he uses...my educated guess is that it's a 16.5 ligne movement, and is based on the ETA 6497, which is a popular movement used by makers like this. Not only because it's what watchmakers learn on in school (I did) but because parts are readily available for it. But for me it always begs the question of just how much ETA DNA is left in the movement like this. Is he also making his own train wheels, or is he using the ETA wheels for example. I could not find anything on the site that was definitive either way (for example video of photos of gear/pinion cutting).

    Cheers, Al

    PS - As an aside, I think Mr. Myrick and I share a case supplier, but that is another thing altogether...:)
     
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  18. Cozmopak Feb 1, 2020

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    You’re not being nitpicky at all. I really appreciate your insights.

    I love the discovery phase of this process.
     
  19. Cozmopak Feb 11, 2020

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    Mr. Myrick used to work with Fricker cases, but no longer. He now designs and finishes the cases himself.
     
  20. Cozmopak Jun 8, 2020

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    I’ve confirmed that the Pascal shock protection is underneath the jewel. They wanted to keep the jewel prominent.