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Steve1haggart
·if I'm in the market to buy a case back opener I'll be purchasing it from Pahawi ...keep it in the family as they say . really sore to hear that someone has stolen you idea .
Pahawi's Custom Made Speedie Caseback Opener......Highly Recommended
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Pahawi
·To be fair, I have one in nylon (hard plastic), made by an Irish chap, bought from TZ-UK a few years ago, so our own Pahari is not the first to make these.
I’m not and have never claimed to be - someone here also stated he has something similar from Omega, so the Irish chap might not be the first either. I didn’t know of any similar openers, when I made one for a stock caseback on one of my speedies. I showed it here, and the rest is well known….
I believe there’s a big difference between what I did, and a guy buying one from me and then start selling exact copies….
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Bill Sohne
··Bill @ ΩFI’m not and have never claimed to be - someone here also stated he has something similar from Omega, so the Irish chap might not be the first either. I didn’t know of any similar openers, when I made one for a stock caseback on one of my speedies. I showed it here, and the rest is well known….
I believe there’s a big difference between what I did, and a guy buying one from me and then start selling exact copies….
So the new seller actually bought one from you? Then reproduced it ? Nice... is he or she still a member here? if they are for how long?
Just really bad form. Does this member sell on this forum as well? I would just clearly post who this member is and let the community decided to patronize his "online store" or listings...
Good Hunting
Bill Sohne
Edited:
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MSNWatch
··Vintage Omega AficionadoI’m not and have never claimed to be - someone here also stated he has something similar from Omega, so the Irish chap might not be the first either. I didn’t know of any similar openers, when I made one for a stock caseback on one of my speedies. I showed it here, and the rest is well known….
I believe there’s a big difference between what I did, and a guy buying one from me and then start selling exact copies….
A crook plain and simple who ripped you off.
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Bill Sohne
··Bill @ ΩFA crook plain and simple who ripped you off.
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MSNWatch
··Vintage Omega Aficionado
And this member is indeed the crook in question. He posts this watch on our site and on the lunaroyster site as well: https://omegaforums.net/threads/1958-omega-seamaster-300-ck2913-3-w-extract.44542/#post-531565
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Bill Sohne
··Bill @ ΩFAnd this member is indeed the crook in question. He posts this watch on our site and on the lunaroyster site as well: https://omegaforums.net/threads/1958-omega-seamaster-300-ck2913-3-w-extract.44542/#post-531565
Wow
Ok. Let me first say I am NOT a moderator on this forum . But if I was I would make it a Very Public thread on this user full name and his Instagram account and new of his business and fully document what he has done here . So everyone can read and politely ask him NOT TO POST HERE EVER AGAIN . And allow other users to reply to the post with there opinion and lock it after a day or two and keep it as a stickly on top of the vintage omega forum and sales corner.
Just a thought . The one thing I never liked about some forums moderators things like banning was done in a vacuum and later on no one rem era why .
Good Hunting
Bill Sohne
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toddle321
·While I agree that it would have been better form for Kirill to further alter the design, I think offering it in aluminum is a distinction large enough to call it a different product. I own one of @Pahawi's openers and love it, but it's a little heavy to carry around when traveling. I purchased one of Kirill's last night in aluminum for that very purpose. It should be noted that I haven't tried Kiril's yet - but assuming it operates as @Pahawi's does but is lighter, I think it'll be a great addition to my tool chest.
Just my 2 cents but I think calling for an outright ban is a bit much - I own a similar very old Omega tool and have seen others in different materials, so the overall design isn't new.
Just my 2 cents but I think calling for an outright ban is a bit much - I own a similar very old Omega tool and have seen others in different materials, so the overall design isn't new.
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MSNWatch
··Vintage Omega AficionadoWhile I agree that it would have been better form for Kirill to further alter the design, I think offering it in aluminum is a distinction large enough to call it a different product. I own one of @Pahawi's openers and love it, but it's a little heavy to carry around when traveling. I purchased one of Kirill's last night in aluminum for that very purpose. It should be noted that I haven't tried Kiril's yet - but assuming it operates as @Pahawi's does but is lighter, I think it'll be a great addition to my tool chest.
Just my 2 cents but I think calling for an outright ban is a bit much - I own a similar very old Omega tool and have seen others in different materials, so the overall design isn't new.
Do you think if Rolex built a speedmaster using a different case material that Omega has used for the watch would qualify for not being a rip-off?
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toddle321
·If omega had an original design with patent, I agree it would be a ripoff
Edited to be clear
Edited to be clear
Edited:
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gemini4
··Hoarder Of Speed et aliaWhile I agree that it would have been better form for Kirill to further alter the design, I think offering it in aluminum is a distinction large enough to call it a different product. I own one of @Pahawi's openers and love it, but it's a little heavy to carry around when traveling. I purchased one of Kirill's last night in aluminum for that very purpose. It should be noted that I haven't tried Kiril's yet - but assuming it operates as @Pahawi's does but is lighter, I think it'll be a great addition to my tool chest.
Just my 2 cents but I think calling for an outright ban is a bit much - I own a similar very old Omega tool and have seen others in different materials, so the overall design isn't new.
FYI. Before I started this thread, in my initial conversations with Paul (@Pahawi ) he explained to me that his tool was available, and had been produced in, BRASS OR ALUMINUM.
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Pahawi
·While I agree that it would have been better form for Kirill to further alter the design, I think offering it in aluminum is a distinction large enough to call it a different product. I own one of @Pahawi's openers and love it, but it's a little heavy to carry around when traveling. I purchased one of Kirill's last night in aluminum for that very purpose. It should be noted that I haven't tried Kiril's yet - but assuming it operates as @Pahawi's does but is lighter, I think it'll be a great addition to my tool chest.
Just my 2 cents but I think calling for an outright ban is a bit much - I own a similar very old Omega tool and have seen others in different materials, so the overall design isn't new.
I have made them in aluminum too:
https://omegaforums.net/threads/sal...ebay-a-nice-donation.25815/page-3#post-295146
Most want them in brass, though.
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toddle321
·I have made them in aluminum too:
https://omegaforums.net/threads/sal...ebay-a-nice-donation.25815/page-3#post-295146
Most want them in brass, though.
I was unaware that @Pahawi made them in aluminum, certainly would have shopped there first if I knew.
This is a hobby for most (me included), business for some and something in between for others. As a hobbyist (or even if I were a businessman operating in a luxury/hobby heavy market), It's not good form and certainly not the path I would have taken - but I don't think what Kirill did was illegal assuming @Pahawi hasn't protected his IP (if it's able to be protected).
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Bill Sohne
··Bill @ ΩFI was unaware that @Pahawi made them in aluminum, certainly would have shopped there first if I knew.
This is a hobby for most (me included), business for some and something in between for others. As a hobbyist (or even if I were a businessman operating in a luxury/hobby heavy market), It's not good form and certainly not the path I would have taken - but I don't think what Kirill did was illegal assuming @Pahawi hasn't protected his IP (if it's able to be protected).
Hi
It's not illegal , but as you say this is a hobby among gentleman and ladies. It's bad form plain and simple .
This guy is acting badly and I think it should be visible to all and let everyone know with full disclosure how he acted . If this was your pet project and someone "lifted " it how would you feel?
Let his actions dictate how you act towards him.
Then you as a buyer, hobbiest etc make a decision to do any type of transaction with him .
Or better yet would you do the same ? If so maybe I should just leave the hobby all together.
Good Hunting
Bill Sohne
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Spacefruit
··Prolific Speedmaster HoarderOf course it's not illegal
But I expect higher standards of behavior from members of this forum, especially to each other. Particularly anyone hoping to make a living selling watches to members.
It was also a stupid decision and will make little financial gain in the long run, compared to the massive window into this members moral behavior, that certainly makes me not want to work with him. After all, if he thinks that is ok, when I don't, what else does he think is ok? Non disclosure of a dial swap?
It could also be averted by a simple message to @Pahawi.
As the wise Mrs Fruit pointed out, the Chinese factories have been doing this to US manufacturers for years.
I just didn't expect one member to do it to another.
But I expect higher standards of behavior from members of this forum, especially to each other. Particularly anyone hoping to make a living selling watches to members.
It was also a stupid decision and will make little financial gain in the long run, compared to the massive window into this members moral behavior, that certainly makes me not want to work with him. After all, if he thinks that is ok, when I don't, what else does he think is ok? Non disclosure of a dial swap?
It could also be averted by a simple message to @Pahawi.
As the wise Mrs Fruit pointed out, the Chinese factories have been doing this to US manufacturers for years.
I just didn't expect one member to do it to another.
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bazamu
·I saw it last night and was hoping that it was done in conjunction with @Pahawi...extremely unfortunate to hear otherwise. I rarely purchase from a dealer anyways, but as Fruit pointed out above, it says more about the way he does things than anything else could. It won't make more than a few thousand in the long-run and pisses off a forum where he's been a seller for years. Shame.
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DLT222
··Double D @ ΩFOh thats not nice...
As the saying goes
'Never piss in your own back garden'
As the saying goes
'Never piss in your own back garden'
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toddle321
·Hi
It's not illegal , but as you say this is a hobby among gentleman and ladies. It's bad form plain and simple .
This guy is acting badly and I think it should be visible to all and let everyone know with full disclosure how he acted . If this was your pet project and someone "lifted " it how would you feel?
Let his actions dictate how you act towards him.
Then you as a buyer, hobbiest etc make a decision to do any type of transaction with him .
Or better yet would you do the same ? If so maybe I should just leave the hobby all together.
Good Hunting
Bill Sohne
When I made my original statement I thought there was a distinction in the product as I wasn't aware that Pawahi made his in aluminum.
I agree that it's bad form, and not something I personally would have done. I agree with @Spacefruit that potential damage done to reputation is likely to outweigh whatever Kirill is making on the aluminum doodads.
That said, I still fail to see how this is different than many of the products people buy everyday that are not original designs of the seller. This one just hits a bit closer to home. For example, how many manufacturers are out there right now knocking off JPM's strap designs (assuming he was the first)? How many of you are wearing watches right now with leather straps that have one stitch on each side near the lugs that weren't manufactured at JPM's plant in Italy?
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Varnado
·Toddle321: I don't know you and I don't post often but, where is your head at to say "While I agree that it would have been better form for Kirill to further alter the design, I think offering it in aluminum is a distinction large enough to call it a different product."?
Forget for a moment that Paul did/does offer it in aluminum. If he made it out of steel or plastic or clay, it is IDENTICAL in design to Paul's. Paul designed it, modified it and made many many iterations of the tool until he got it right. Then Kirill flat out reproduces it and sells it for profit.
How is taking the exact design and changing the material a "distinction large enough to call it a different product"? If I take a Porsche 911 in steel and make the body out of Aluminum or Fiberglass would that be legal? Would it be considered a distinction large enough to be considered a different product? Absolutely not. Not in a court of law or in realm of common sense.
It matters not if the tool was patented, we know it wasn't. This isn't a courtroom it is a forum of collectors and enthusiasts. For one of us to do this to another member is disgusting. He didnt ask permission or offer him a cut or even give Paul the credit for the design. Not that it would matter because its still being done AFTER the fact.
Never liked Kirills attitude, Never bought any of his frankenwatches with mismatched parts, never liked looking at his flabby body at the watch shows either. Disgusting inside and out.
Forget for a moment that Paul did/does offer it in aluminum. If he made it out of steel or plastic or clay, it is IDENTICAL in design to Paul's. Paul designed it, modified it and made many many iterations of the tool until he got it right. Then Kirill flat out reproduces it and sells it for profit.
How is taking the exact design and changing the material a "distinction large enough to call it a different product"? If I take a Porsche 911 in steel and make the body out of Aluminum or Fiberglass would that be legal? Would it be considered a distinction large enough to be considered a different product? Absolutely not. Not in a court of law or in realm of common sense.
It matters not if the tool was patented, we know it wasn't. This isn't a courtroom it is a forum of collectors and enthusiasts. For one of us to do this to another member is disgusting. He didnt ask permission or offer him a cut or even give Paul the credit for the design. Not that it would matter because its still being done AFTER the fact.
Never liked Kirills attitude, Never bought any of his frankenwatches with mismatched parts, never liked looking at his flabby body at the watch shows either. Disgusting inside and out.