On the bench. Baumgartner 866.

sheepdoll · Oct 2, 2022

RevZMan123
The guide to practical watchmaking says to use cyanide of potassium at one point. Says to use benzine and a brush. Or says to use "cleaning solution" then "rinse solution" without ever explains what those solutions are. It's always something.

But yeah I think machines and chemicals go hand in hand at this point in my startup phase.

The old books also state to leave an open can of kerosene/paraffin and a candle inside the clock. (one would hope the candel was not lit. ::facepalm1::

)

Also look closely at the spelling of benzine as I and @Dan S said the spelling can make a difference benzine is not benzene. When in doubt always look up the MSDS. A lot of chemicals which are branded are 'trade secrets.' as the right blend of chemicals can be worth a fortune. Cola is a mixture of Citric acid, vanilla, and sugar. This creates a fantasia of taste which are like a musical chord. Back in the days of custom drug store soda fountains phosphate drinks were popular as in cherry or strawberry phosphates. Cola is effectively vanilla phosphate. It is said that the difference between coke and pepsi was whether lemons or limes were used. Pepsi also used corn sugars, Coke used cane sugars (rum) In our era the formulas are pretty much the same. Also note that how these mix is not linear. Mixing stuff in a cup verses mixing stuff in a vat produces different results.

The old guys had to get their stuff from nature. Cyanide comes from the seeds of stone fruits like apricots peaches or seeds like apple seeds. Ammonia comes from pee or piss. Which is basically what watch cleaner is synthetic pee. In the old days the poor would save their piss and sell it to the fullers who would use it for cleaning cloth (and other things.) If one could not afford a pot, then they "Would not have a pot to piss in" and be piss poor. Pee is also considered to be sterile and has been used as an antiseptic.

You really do not want to know what is in the stuff you consume.

-j

Archer · Oct 2, 2022

RevZMan123
Are there any less harsh cleaners you would recommend for someone doing it at their kitchen table for now? Do you think simple green is a bad idea?

I've never looked into it for use as a cleaner for watch parts. My concern would be that it likely contains water, so rust is going to be an issue. There are water based cleaners out there, but not something I would use - for those final rinse is alcohol, which is very hygroscopic. That also means that you need to renew it often. But with alcohol, you also need to be aware of the shellac - it will soften shellac.

Peg wood and pith wood are both very helpful - you use peg wood for the jewels, and pith wood for the pivots of all the wheels. If you don't have any machine at all and are doing this by hand, then pick a solvent that you can live with the smell, and be very thorough, and see how you go. It won't be the same as using a machine with proper solutions, but you have to work with the limitations you have.

Cheers, Al

Archer · Oct 2, 2022

sheepdoll
I guess I was not clear. I am not a fan of one dip,

I wasn't responding based on anything you said...

RevZMan123 · Oct 2, 2022

Archer
I've never looked into it for use as a cleaner for watch parts. My concern would be that it likely contains water, so rust is going to be an issue. There are water based cleaners out there, but not something I would use - for those final rinse is alcohol, which is very hygroscopic. That also means that you need to renew it often. But with alcohol, you also need to be aware of the shellac - it will soften shellac.

Peg wood and pith wood are both very helpful - you use peg wood for the jewels, and pith wood for the pivots of all the wheels. If you don't have any machine at all and are doing this by hand, then pick a solvent that you can live with the smell, and be very thorough, and see how you go. It won't be the same as using a machine with proper solutions, but you have to work with the limitations you have.

Cheers, Al

I got a couple of the sticks but have a tough time cutting them the way you recommend with such a clean tip. I'm sure it's just practice and they get better each time.

Thanks again! I'll post more when I get some lubrication, which is were I'm stuck now.

noless · Oct 3, 2022

I really like the shape of that balance wheel, never seen one like that before.

As someone who is still in the early stages of learning too, I have gone with the ultrasonic route for now.
I am using an ammonia based cleaning solution but mine is one of the ones that is designed for use with ultrasonic systems.

Availability of commercial cleaning solutions is very region dependent, and I have also noticed that depending on where someone was trained the choice of solvents varies a lot, and I suspect this is at least part of the cause of many the online argument about which is the "right one"
Setting aside improvements in chemical safety knowledge, and technology anyway.

For the balance and the pallet fork I use the same cleaning solution but hand agitated as I have concerns about putting the extremely delicate parts in the ultrasonic cleaner. I have been pleased with the results, this is of course with manual pegging of jewels and cleaning of pivots.

Looking forward to seeing this one when you are done!

RevZMan123 · Feb 1, 2023

I am going to order some Zenith 251NA non-ammoniated cleaning solution concentrate. It's an 8 to 1 mix with distilled water that you can rinse in distilled water then dry. I was going to get some drizebrite for a rinse as Merritt supply has them both in stock and is the cheapest combo after shipping costs.

RevZMan123 · Feb 1, 2023

That being said -- I found a good video on rebuilding the movement which helped me get things back where thy needed to go.

Since it's been ... oh, 4 months of obtaining the tools, dexterity, and knowledge I needed to get my first watch back together. It was kind of disappointing at first when the train wasn't going anywhere but after I got some oil in the right places, it actually started running! Then it wouldn't run when I turned it over, which reminded me that I didn't lube the ONE JEWEL in the whole movement. LOL So took it apart again this morning, got a very smol drop in there and buttoned it back up once more. It's been running solid since then but I know it's best to let everything settle down for a few hours at the very least before getting a reading on the timegrapher.

RevZMan123 · Feb 2, 2023

For better or for worse, it's back together. Hands and all. No movement ring or caseback, so this one is called done. Hands lined up at 9 o clock and then set for the pic.

It's not great but it's something. The timegrapher was like -600 seconds and then it would go down as I went up. Who knows. Considering what it looked like when I started, I'm amazed it came this far in my hands.

I'm moving onto a cheap Waltham next.

sheepdoll · Feb 2, 2023

RevZMan123
For better or for worse, it's back together. Hands and all. No movement ring or caseback, so this one is called done. Hands lined up at 9 o clock and then set for the pic.

It's not great but it's something. The timegrapher was like -600 seconds and then it would go down as I went up. Who knows. Considering what it looked like when I started, I'm amazed it came this far in my hands.

I'm moving onto a cheap Waltham next.

A little Evap-O-Rust might clear those dial stains a bit. One has to be careful as often the corrosion will remove the plating.

You never know what one will find inside a Waltham. I have an A Schild, which has Waltham on the bridge. I think I have also seen UT. Problem when there is no one to consider the brand. Back in the day of Railroads Waltham made some pretty good watches. Since the 1980s though they are just a name stamped on a dial. I have a book which discusses the failure. After WWII the pension fund was larger than the production. So the assets were sold off to fulfill the pension obligations to the surviving workers. (But we hashed that out last week.)

At least we still have the good stuff to play with.

On the bench. Baumgartner 866.

sheepdoll

Archer

Archer

RevZMan123

noless

RevZMan123

RevZMan123

RevZMan123

sheepdoll

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