Not the first movement I've taken apart but the first one I've decided to go forth and finish the job.

I just have to order some lubrication and I'll be good to go. Waiting for OneDip so using diluted simple green and 3 rinse jars of 91% iso. (Not ideal, yes, but for now, I'm getting used to handing and maintaining order.)

 

I think I used the presto puller once or twice but never really successfully. Lol Once I used the hand levers as Al recommended, all right right in the universe. I needed them to pull the minute gear off anyway.

 

A simple cleaning solution can be made from Murphy's oil soap (oxolic acid) acetone, alcohol and distilled water. The recipie is online. Most people do not know that the oxolic acid is the oil soap and find that the raw stuff is sold in large quantities.
IMO a cleaning machine is a must. All the people who taught me back in the 1990s seemed have had strong opinions on this. There are two types of cleaning machines. Spin and ultrasonic. I see most of the modern you tubers using spin machines. Ultrasonics are more used for jewelry. The cleaning solutions are different formulas. I have used simple green in the Ultrasonic.
One dip was something called benzene, which is different than benzine. Basically this is a light weight petroleum distillate that evaporates quickly displacing any residual moisture, Naptha, Acetone, Xylene and Tuoliine are other solvents. The one I like is Heptain, which is rubber cement solvent. This however no longer seems to be in the HW store. Goo gone, dry-cleaning fluid, is Naptha, usually strongly scented. I forget what lighter fluid is. There was also something called Vm&p which was paint stripper.
Between working for the computer retailer and working for Apple, I worked for a company (running plotters which made pert charts and other graphs) which got a Superfund cleanup contract. They would measure these substances in the parts per billion or trillion in water and wastewater. I could never figure out if they were actually bad, or if some graduate student invented the machine and was looking for a commercial use for it.
Using the wrong solvent can dissolve the shellac which holds the roller jewel and pallet stones. One of the landerons I have has a stone at about 30 degrees out of plane ( would never hit an escape tooth.) When I was active in the 1990s there was a lot of talks and opinion on setting the pallet stone angles. I find I have a tool for using this. Requires an alcohol lamp. (alcohol unlike kerosene/paraffin alchol burns with low soot.) Over the counter pure alcohol ( even denatured) is no longer allowed in this state. One can not even purchase everclear. 'Kitchen solvents,' on the other hand can be ordered online.
Pure alcohol is also used to dissolve shellac, which is why commercial solutions are recommended. The downside is these are sold in bulk and have to be sent ground (slow.)
Kerosene/paraffin aka 'jet fuel.' is an oil, so probably not recommended. Octain/petrol called 'gas' in the US, is highly volatile (as are other solvents mentioned above.) Back when I was a kid, 'white gas' was used to wash out small engine parts by friends. Sometimes it is amazing we made it this far.

Of course, I could be wrong about this. I am often wrong. But such is what I have used for years.
-j

 

I just checked my shipping after typing the above. I ordered a used Bergeon Presto 30638-3Purchases made through these links may earn this site a commission from the eBay Partner Network from the UK last week. The tracking has stated "Deliveries may take longer than usual due to Royal Mail industrial action." Have been using the hand levers on the landerons. they work, but the chronograph bridge has to be removed first.
30638-3 has been on back order for a year.

 

Nice project

I like the groovy typography for the numerals on the dial.

 

I used to work in my dad's print shop when I was younger. Touline and 99% were very common and cleaned everything there.

After looking on some of the other watch repair forums, yes lighter fluid is naphtha and has been recommended but doesn't really strike me as something I want to use. My local watchmaker told me to use onedip and I've seen Archer's setup.

I might get an ultrasonic as they seem fairly useful for most parts. I was just brushing and shaking to clean and rinse. I'll keep on eye out on the stones though and keep them away from the alcohol.

 

Used L&R machines can be found easily. Although like everything else I am astonished at the prices. The shipping can be a bit of a haste. I broke the jars, but cut down masons jars seem to work, There must be a reason the spin cyclers are still used. Could be the drying, the parts come out quite warm due to the heater. Not sure brushing and shaking can get the flows that seem to be required.
There is a star shaped piece of metal which seems to do something with the flow vortexes. Also notice someone replaced the motor on mine with a fan motor.

I have also read on the other forms that Ultrasonic is not recommended for the actual parts. Not sure why. So I stick with the spin washer.
I was also taught to do the last rinse with distilled/di water. And if hand cleaning (a clock) to boil in in the microwave first. Which creates a sort of steam cleaning effect.

One of the most satisfying steps in watchmaking is when the warm shiny parts come out of the cleaner. Almost like cookies from an oven.

-j

 

Yes I see the spin machines used often. I do have a place over in Trenton where I can get a used machine but it's about a 3 hour roundtrip. Soon! That will certainly save on shipping.

I'm at Walmart right now getting myself some distilled water for just what your are saying, no impurities.

So just the case and bracelets in the ultrasonic? No little parts? Check.

 

Check out the other thread on dissolving loctight. Something I never considered.

(getting ahead of myself, But taking a break from the Landerons, I got a few more parts removed from the rusted Heuer valjoux 72. The Kano is working to loosen things. Then it will be tea and evap-O-rust. Followed by a normal cleaning.)

-j (who should be out picking up the lemons and limes to make lemonade.)

 

I don't recommend using most of the solvents mentioned above in the absence of a fume hood. Definitely not on a regular basis. If you have a question about safety and exposure to a particular chemical compound, search for the MSDS (material safety data sheet) associated with that compound, and google will find it for you on various free sites, including OSHA, university safety offices, and some of the major chemical suppliers.

You do need to spell the compound correctly, e.g. benzene, toluene, heptane, etc. (Although obviously google is pretty forgiving of misspellings, you could end up finding the wrong compound by mistake, because many compounds have similar spellings, but are different chemically). Don't hesitate to reach out to me by PM if you have a question about chemicals.

 

Right there with ya. That's why I was ok with simple green for now, I'll dilute with distilled water now. And then rinse in it. I used to use it to clean gun parts as well but then a little CLP afterwards and they were good to go.

 

Personally, I would not use one-dip as a main cleaner. A solvent containing ammonia is best for removing dried oils and dirt, with at least two rinses in a non-ammoniated solution.

I don't use on-dip at all...ever...

 

That is a glowing negative review for OneDip, I will take it out of my cart for sure. I will check your threads for recommendations.

The place close to me has this 4 jar machine I was thinking about.

Being able to pick it up would help a ton. Obviously it's a bit pricey but I'm sure worth the investment.

Thanks for the insight as always.

 

I use L&R Extra Fine watch cleaning solution for cleaning, and then #3 rinse in subsequent jars.

 

Are there any less harsh cleaners you would recommend for someone doing it at their kitchen table for now? Do you think simple green is a bad idea?

 

One Dip!

 

This is why I asked here.

 

I guess I was not clear. I am not a fan of one dip, which probably contains one or more of the solvents I was speculating about. Back in the day of the regular watch and clock club meetings, some of the members who worked for the national labs where rather suspicious of one dip that it was a fairly nasty chemical. Could be that at one point one dip was one of the tri-clorine de-greasing solvents. (which are now banned.) Also note that spelling is not one of my strong points. I do not have time to be pedantic about it.

I also left the ammonia out of the homemade cleaner. The ammonia is what gives it the distinct odor. L&R would be my recommendation as well, apart from that one has to get so much of it, then most of it goes bad after a while. The only reason I use home made is that I only need to mix up as much as I need to for small jobs. There is plenty written about cleaning solutions online and in the old trade publications.

It was not my intention to get into a discussion about chemicals. My point was to recommend using the spin cycle machine.
-j

 

The guide to practical watchmaking says to use cyanide of potassium at one point. Says to use benzine and a brush. Or says to use "cleaning solution" then "rinse solution" without ever explains what those solutions are. It's always something.

But yeah I think machines and chemicals go hand in hand at this point in my startup phase.

 

I think simple green is citric acid. Which comes from things like lemons.
Probably the best cleaner is pegwood. Whittle the sticks down to shape them to get into the crevices. What is wanted is to clean the gear teeth and bearing surfaces. Especially the pinions, where the gunk resides. There is no substitute for elbow grease. The teeth and leaves need to be absolutely clean and dry. It is the interaction of brass and steel with reduces the friction. Fiber brushes, which were for erasing typewriter strokes can be a bit harsh, they also leave bits of glass dust, I would not recommend using one. I used one on the 'timecraft' watch to remove corrosion which stripped some of the plating.
I personally like rodico, but Art states this is now banned by Omega and can lead to loss of certification. Probably due to miss use. The wheel edges were rolled into the putty which in theory removes the loose dust. On the other hand this dust and oil gets into the rodico and probably transferred back to other surfaces. I though will give up rodico, only when Omega sells parts to anyone :wink:
The bearing also need to be hand cleaned. The jewels need to be pegged out. Pithwood is used to clean the pivots. I have a lot of attachments for pivot polishing. Also have the turns and depthing tools. The pivots need to be as polished as possible. Can get quite tricky as these are glass hard and will snap off with the least bit of pressure. Probably why there are so many holder/attachments.
-j