Omega Speedmaster GSOTM chipped lug

BlackTalon · Mar 18, 2016

As far as the case cracking/ breaking is concerned, I really don't know what Omega could say about it. You can't really just test it by dropping it 3 feet onto a particular surface, as the angle it hits at, etc. will result in a wide variation in the actually stresses. The lugs stick out like cantilevered beams, plus they not only have a hole that results in a weak point, but they also have a springbar pressing into them. So I would think the lugs would be especially vulnerable, although I do not know enough about the wall thicknesses of the case in general versus the lug thicknesses. As far as robustness of the sides/ back of the case are concerned, hitting something that is fairly flat means less concentrated stresses then hitting the corner of the same object. Since the case is round, an impact to the side essentially gets supported by an arch, which is great in handling compression loads. Unless that load is extremely focused, in which case the arch action would not really help. And the caseback would be behaving similar to a slab, in that a perpendicular load would put one surface in tension and one in compression -- and brittle materials tend to be much weaker in tension. So an impact on the caseback could be more potentially damaging then a similar impact on the side of the case.

I'm sure the case 'structure; could be analyzed for different loads/ impacts using finite element analysis, although it would be an expensive undertaking. But with no real standards for watch cases in general, what would Omega test for? If a standard were developed by ISO, etc., then should all metal cases be tested as well?

I suspect the end result of al this is simply "It's an expensive watch -- don't bang it around or drop it"

STANDY · Mar 18, 2016

karalhoin
Obviously, agree.

By "I think people are not clearly informed about what should be acceptable or not" I meant that users are not fully aware of how scratch resistant the material is, how much force it takes to crack it and so on.

No, of course there is reasonable use and it is somewhat obvious that dropping a ceramic watch (or other ceramic object) on a hard surface from a considerable height (even knee-height) is a bad idea.

However, there are standards. Same as with a device that is sold as being "water resistant". The definition of it might vary, and that's why ISO standards and others are used as a reference so you know if the device was used within spec (and warranty covered if damaged) or used outside the acceptable range/abused.
Same as COSC, etc.

What I meant was that with these watches, there isn't any published data about their resistance, type of impacts that damage them, etc. We know how COSC and metas watches are tested (at least the main points) but we don't really know what a DSOTM is supposed to resist or not, so people just speculate. Some say a car door can't break one, others say a little impact shatters them.

Someone who - lets imagine - get one what came out of factory with a hairline fracture and then cracks it with a small impact on a door might not even know that the watch is supposed to sustain that.

What I meant was, how do you know when damage is due to abuse or manufacturing flaws, in cases when such is not totally obvious? you don't, at least if manufacturers don't release the data and no one wants do buy a few to test/damage in a lab. 😀

Heaps of data about you need a avatar.

What you think Omega didn't test in the making of ceramic. Yes they did plenty I bet. Dropping them on tiled floors, NASA didn't even test that for the speedmasters

Hairline cracks my arse, one more time. He admitted dropping it on a hard tiled floor. Abuse as this is not daily use..

They did release data. Ceramic is good we tested it and it holds up to daily use.

Really it's not Omega or ceramics fault. It's the guy that dropped it on the tiled floor

ctpete · Mar 20, 2016

Was the watch insured? Perhaps covered on your HO policy?

dalethorn · May 24, 2016

I looked at my GS for 6 months before I bought it, so I had plenty of time to research the ceramic issue. My impression, since I don't recall any warnings of fragility, was that the powdered ceramic process makes the final ceramic a lot less brittle than ceramics of old. High-value stainless steels for pocket knives (Benchmade, Spyderco....) are made from powders now, apparently to get more hardness with less brittleness. So just from my impressions, I'd guess that cases that chip might not have had their slurry blended and baked out as optimally as possible. Some insider who makes these cases probably knows the QC secrets. BTW, my dad was "let go" from a big tire company when he tried to fail a multi-million-dollar shipment of tire fabric rolls. That was one of my heads-up on working in QC.

Frunkinator · May 24, 2016

dalethorn
I looked at my GS for 6 months before I bought it, so I had plenty of time to research the ceramic issue. My impression, since I don't recall any warnings of fragility, was that the powdered ceramic process makes the final ceramic a lot less brittle than ceramics of old. High-value stainless steels for pocket knives (Benchmade, Spyderco....) are made from powders now, apparently to get more hardness with less brittleness. So just from my impressions, I'd guess that cases that chip might not have had their slurry blended and baked out as optimally as possible. Some insider who makes these cases probably knows the QC secrets. BTW, my dad was "let go" from a big tire company when he tried to fail a multi-million-dollar shipment of tire fabric rolls. That was one of my heads-up on working in QC.

I don't think the chipped cases we are seeing are from bad batches... They're accidental drops, falls, and smashes. Every material has its downfall, ceramics has a big one no matter how it's treated in manufacturing. It's more about how it's treated onve it's on the wrist.

dalethorn · May 24, 2016

Frunkinator
I don't think the chipped cases we are seeing are from bad batches... They're accidental drops, falls, and smashes. Every material has its downfall, ceramics has a big one no matter how it's treated in manufacturing. It's more about how it's treated onve it's on the wrist.

I read the whole thread and didn't see any discussion of the powder/slurry processes, so I thought it might be good if someone in the know would offer their insights.

Frunkinator · May 24, 2016

dalethorn
I read the whole thread and didn't see any discussion of the powder/slurry processes, so I thought it might be good if someone in the know would offer their insights.

Oh def, thanks for the extra info. The process things are made is very cool. I love that show "how things are made". I was just responding to your notion of bad batches. I think it's more in the owner then it is Omega during manufacturing. Just my 2 cents

dalethorn · May 24, 2016

Frunkinator
Oh def, thanks for the extra info. The process things are made is very cool. I love that show "how things are made". I was just responding to your notion of bad batches. I think it's more in the owner then it is Omega during manufacturing. Just my 2 cents

Our family literally went hungry for a time after dad was fired from his QC job, so I find that aspect under-discussed. Maybe because it's too sensitive? I did a lot of QC work myself, and I've seen some things that would amaze people.

chirojared · May 24, 2016

I strongly believe especially after talking to structural engineers that in my particular watch there was most likely a point defect in the ceramic due to where the watch chipped. It chipped inside the lug right where the spring bar attaches. The fall was very mild and the watch movement was functioning perfectly. I am a watch collector and respect all of my watches and can guarantee you that there was no abuse involved in my situation. I have the watch back now with a new case and it is under my homeowners policy which I strongly advocate people with ceramic watches to do.

Unfortunately I do believe with time more situations like mine may arise due to the nature of ceramics. Upon receiving my watch back I also fitted a new leather omega oem grey band as well as the grey brushed ceramic/titanium deployment clasp. I am not a fan of tang buckles on ceramic watches. I believe that Omega did the right thing by replacing my watch as a one time courtesy. I feel comfortable wearing my watch knowing that it is insured.

VicLeChic · Jul 13, 2016

watchknut
Not much of tool watch if the case chips when dropped.

+1.
Using ceramic clearly defeats the whole purpose of owning a tool watch. We're in fragile jewlery territory, not exactly mi idea of what a luxury watch should be.

dalethorn · Jul 13, 2016

I feel confident about my ceramic watch, because it's not the brittle type of ceramic of the old days, it's the homogenous ceramic made from powder/slurry. Apparently there are some problems remaining in the process, but someone who makes these needs to clarify where the fragilities occur and why, in what should be a homogenous metal. I worked on a NDT program 32 years ago, so there should be economical scanners available today that can spot any internal weaknesses in the metal cases.

blubarb · Jul 13, 2016

Archer
Thank you for editing the inflammatory language. 😀

Anyway, I have no problem being called a "ceramic-avoider" (certainly much more appropriate than your first wording was) and I have to decide to avoid or not on 2 levels. As a buyer it's a no-brainer for me - they have zero appeal aesthetically for me, or based on the size and thickness, and lastly based on case material.

As watchmaker I also have to decide if I will take these in for servicing. When I logged on to the Omega Extranet yesterday, they had posted a "reminder" of how to properly remove the snap on case back from the ceramic watches to avoid chipping the cases. I've never seen them issue such a reminder before, so it makes me wonder if they are seeing damage at service. Leaning towards "send it to Omega" as my canned response to anyone who asks me to service one...risk (handling in the shop and shipping, etc.) is just not worth the reward...

Cheers, Al

Taking it on might end up as a case of "no good deed goes unpunished" (pun intended for what it's worth) 🙄

Omega Speedmaster GSOTM chipped lug

BlackTalon

STANDY

ctpete

dalethorn

Frunkinator

dalethorn

Frunkinator

dalethorn

chirojared

VicLeChic

dalethorn

blubarb

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