Longines 12L Estate Sale Find

knafel1983 · Mar 31, 2018

I recently found this one at a local estate sale for a few bucks. Serial number dates it to 1944. It needs a complete overhaul, as it keeps some time and stops. I'm contemplating selling it as is, or paying $125 for a complete service. Any Longines experts that can tell me more about this piece, does it look serviceable? Where can I find a crown for this?

Thanks,
Matt

Canuck · Mar 31, 2018

Sell it, and in three months you’ll have neither the watch or the money. Looks like it has great potential to be an accurate and reliable timekeeper, and could be a pleasure to wear and show off. Price for a service sounds decent, provided it is a complete service by someone experienced in servicing vintage watches. and not just a lick and a promise. You decide.

Volcan · Mar 31, 2018

It's a very nice Longines! What is the diameter? 32 mm ??
For me this watch deserves a complete service by a good watchmaker 😉

knafel1983 · Mar 31, 2018

It's about 31mm in diameter. I would like a nicer example, but I won't find one for the $150 I would have invested in it. These military Longines are fascinating and excellent quality. I guess I'll keep my eyes open for one at the next NAWCC show.

argonbeam · Mar 31, 2018

I’d happily take it off your hands!

TropicConnie · Apr 11, 2018

It lacks any form of military engraving on the dial or caseback so it's impossible to say if it truly is a military piece. Manufacturers made this style of watch during the War so that soldiers who were not issued a wristwatch as standard equipment could own a reliable timekeeper, but the same style would have found its way into general retail too. Of course, given the style and period of production, we can speculate it was owned and used by a soldier, but that's all. You should contact Longines and ask for their archive extract, if they say it was delivered to a military base then you have your answer. However, their records are quite scant for their watches sold in the USA like yours.

Syrte · Apr 11, 2018

TropicConnie
It lacks any form of military engraving on the dial or caseback so it's impossible to say if it truly is a military piece. Manufacturers made this style of watch during the War so that soldiers who were not issued a wristwatch as standard equipment could own a reliable timekeeper, but the same style would have found its way into general retail too. Of course, given the style and period of production, we can speculate it was owned and used by a soldier, but that's all. You should contact Longines and ask for their archive extract, if they say it was delivered to a military base then you have your answer. However, their records are quite scant for their watches sold in the USA like yours.

Hi there, it’s a lovely watch, but in the 1940s and as a general rule a watch without givernement markings is not an issued watch. Watches purchased privately by soldiers have military “provenance” or “connections”, but they’re not government supplied and therefore not considered military.

The red double numerals are not “military. My watchmaker tells me they were introduced in 1911 to avoid ambiguity in time keeping. In his shop he had a wooden country style living room clock that’s over 2 meters high and with the double red numerals.

Also steel cases were not developed for the military, they were developed in large part for the outdoors and sporting uses— as illustrated for example by those pictures below from the 1936 Longines catalog— postsd on Instagram by a Japanese dealer.

bubba48 · Apr 11, 2018

My "sei tacche" have a similar dial but with 23M caliber

Here a true military watch

Syrte · Apr 11, 2018

bubba48
My "sei tacche" have a similar dial but with 23M caliber

Here a true military watch

Both are really nice. 👍

knafel1983 · Apr 11, 2018

I could care less if it's actual military or not. I just love the style of it. I've been on the search for a nicer example since I got this one, but the prices are steep online.

knafel1983 · Apr 11, 2018

bubba48
My "sei tacche" have a similar dial but with 23M caliber

Here a true military watch

I bought that exact same style in the first picture at a NAWCC show in January for two bills, and flipped it for a profit, because it had a few flaws I couldn't overlook. I would love to find a nice example like that.

Syrte · Apr 12, 2018

knafel1983
I could care less if it's actual military or not. I just love the style of it. I've been on the search for a nicer example since I got this one, but the prices are steep online.

Completely agree the only thing that matters
is that you like it. Many have ugly refinished dials. This one has aged nicely IMO.

The crown may be like the model seen on the picture below, found on snap back 12L models.
Hard to source as they also equipped Royal Air Force issued watches from the early 40s and are sought after for restorations.
A collector has made a batch of reproductions, about 50 euros a piece IIRC.
But the watch would still be nice with a suitable vintage replacement crown.

TropicConnie · Apr 12, 2018

knafel1983
I could care less if it's actual military or not. I just love the style of it. I've been on the search for a nicer example since I got this one, but the prices are steep online.

I was only debunking @knafel1983 on calling it a military watch by explaining that it is more than likely not, even if it's styled after one. It's a beautiful watch and one that (m)any vintage Longines collector would be happy to own. I like the patina, you can't fake that even if Longines has tried to come close.

knafel1983 · Apr 12, 2018

Here's the one I'm referring to that I paid two bills for at a show. I believe the dial was refinished, as it was actually about a minute crooked. And the second hand looked like it was missing a part. Because of that, I sold it.

Radiumpassion · Apr 15, 2018

Simular watch sold at a local Auction house some time ago. Looks to have the same dial and hands.

knafel1983 · Apr 17, 2018

So I've been itching to buy a nicer example of this model 12L. The only decent one I could find was on Ebay in Russia, and he just accepted my offer. Yes, it has a scratch and what looks like a finger print on the lower right side of the dial. But overall, the condition looks good. Maybe I will use the other for spare parts. Can anyone tell me if this one from Russia looks legit? Anyone else purchase anything from Russia?

DirtyDozen12 · Apr 17, 2018

Looks okay apart from the second hand, which is short. I have bought from Russia without issue.

Gruen_JackW · Dec 23, 2021

knafel1983
So I've been itching to buy a nicer example of this model 12L. The only decent one I could find was on Ebay in Russia, and he just accepted my offer. Yes, it has a scratch and what looks like a finger print on the lower right side of the dial. But overall, the condition looks good. Maybe I will use the other for spare parts. Can anyone tell me if this one from Russia looks legit? Anyone else purchase anything from Russia?

But the watch would still be nice with a suitable vintage replacement crown.[/QUOTE]
Bring this one back up, because I have a watch with the same reference number as the knafel's:

BlueHands · Dec 24, 2021

It has a redial unfortunately, but hands and crown look OK. The 5-digit-number is an order number, not a reference.

Gruen_JackW · Dec 29, 2021

BlueHands
It has a redial unfortunately, but hands and crown look OK. The 5-digit-number is an order number, not a reference.

Yes... I mistyped what I meant. Same order number. I'm not 100% convinced that this is a redial.... I think that Wittenour had a different dial made to add the 24-hour. The lume was redone.

Longines 12L Estate Sale Find

knafel1983

Canuck

Volcan

knafel1983

argonbeam

TropicConnie

Syrte

bubba48

Syrte

knafel1983

knafel1983

Syrte

TropicConnie

knafel1983

Radiumpassion

knafel1983

DirtyDozen12

Gruen_JackW

BlueHands

Gruen_JackW

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