Is my watch a redial or original?

[norb1967]

Hello,

I’ve posted a thread based on this watch already but want to get more opinions on the dial. The consensus from one or two in my thread seems to be (and I agree) an original dial which has been cleaned a bit in the past (slightly hard in some areas to cause some minute markers to be rubbed off).
Thanks!

Edited: Jun 20, 2022

 

[Tony C.]

The quality of the OMEGA printing appears dubious to my eye. A likely redial, I'd say.

 

[norb1967]

Tony C.

The quality of the OMEGA printing appears dubious to my eye. A likely redial, I'd say.

Anything to focus on in particular?

 

[Tony C.]

norb1967

Anything to focus on in particular?

This does not look like factory quality:



Also, look at the 12:00 index. That does not look like a problem related to dial cleaning, but rather poor execution after the cleaning.

 

[Spruce]

Tony C.

This does not look like factory quality:



Also, look at the 12:00 index. That does not look like a problem related to dial cleaning, but rather poor execution after the cleaning.

+1

 

[norb1967]

Perhaps an old redial? As this is my first vintage Omega it is difficult to know what to expect/look for. Most examples I have seen have some degree of patination on the dial etc.

Edited: Jun 20, 2022

 

[Tony C.]

Doesn't matter when the dial was refinished – it is what it is. But for $1000-1500, I'd expect an original dial on a model such as that one.

Patina is a different matter altogether. A dial having been cleaned insensitively would not be considered "patina", and a refinished dial would certainly not fall into that category. On the other hand, changes of color from chemical reactions in lacquer and/or lume would be considered patina.

 

[norb1967]

Tony C.

Doesn't matter when the dial was refinished – it is what it is. But for $1000-1500, I'd expect an original dial on a model such as that one.

Patina is a different matter altogether. A dial having been cleaned insensitively would not be considered "patina", and a refinished dial would certainly not fall into that category. On the other hand, changes of color from chemical reactions in lacquer and/or lume would be considered patina.

So what sort of ballpark would you put this watch in?

Edited: Jun 20, 2022

 

[Tony C.]

norb1967

So what sort of ballpark would you put this watch in? $750-1000?

I haven't seen enough of it to make a fine judgment. If you have images of the case back and movement, I could answer the question.

 

[dmtowl]

Tony C.

This does not look like factory quality:



Also, look at the 12:00 index. That does not look like a problem related to dial cleaning, but rather poor execution after the cleaning.

With this new photo I do agree, this does look at least partially redialed. Like I mentioned in the other thread I do believe you overpaid if you in the camp that cares a lot about dial originality and condition.

 

[Vintage Lemania]

Refinished I would say, but most likely done long ago.

 

[norb1967]

Tony C.

I haven't seen enough of it to make a fine judgment. If you have images of the case back and movement, I could answer the question.

Attached

Edited: Jun 20, 2022

 

[georgeszaslavsky]

Vintage Lemania

Refinished I would say, but most likely done long ago.

Agreed , that is an old redone dial

 

[norb1967]

georgeszaslavsky

Agreed , that is an old redone dial

So potentially redone at some point by Omega… say when it was 20 years old? Who knows

 

[Tony C.]

Not the best photos, but from what I can see:

The case appears to have been polished. Not over-polished, perhaps, but it does degrade the value somewhat. Presumably it measures 36mm, which is a plus.

The dial has been discussed. And as for this:

norb1967

So potentially redone at some point by Omega

No, very unlikely.

The movement appears to be in "good" condition. Some might argue "very good", but I prefer to be conservative, and cannot see all of the parts. I am unsure on the originality of the crown, but that is a relatively minor issue in any case.

In my view, if presented honestly, it is a ~$600-700 watch at best. I say that partly because the current market is different than even a mere one or two years ago. The values of vintage watches without original dials, and/or not in excellent or better condition, have been falling. Collectors with money continue to buy really good examples of desirable watches, but the much larger "middle market", which was for years arguably inflated (along with many other markets), is now deflating fairly rapidly.

Anyone buying vintage watches these days who is concerned about near/mid-term value retention would be well-advised to emphasize both condition and originality. In other words, pay more for a really good, original example, unless you are comfortable wearing a watch with issues, and are not concerned about resale value.

 

[norb1967]

Tony C.

Not the best photos, but from what I can see:

The case appears to have been polished. Not over-polished, perhaps, but it does degrade the value somewhat. Presumably it measures 36mm, which is a plus.

The dial has been discussed. And as for this:



No, very unlikely.

The movement appears to be in "good" condition. Some might argue "very good", but I prefer to be conservative, and cannot see all of the parts. I am unsure on the originality of the crown, but that is a relatively minor issue in any case.

In my view, if presented honestly, it is a ~$600-700 watch at best. I say that partly because the current market is different than even a mere one or two years ago. The values of vintage watches without original dials, and/or not in excellent or better condition, have been falling. Collectors with money continue to buy really good examples of desirable watches, but the much larger "middle market", which was for years arguably inflated (along with many other markets), is now deflating fairly rapidly.

Anyone buying vintage watches these days who is concerned about near/mid-term value retention would be well-advised to emphasize both condition and originality. In other words, pay more for a really good, original example, unless you are comfortable wearing a watch with issues, and are not concerned about resale value.

Thanks for your detailed reply. All very useful. For what it's worth, I am quite sure the crown is original; at the very least it is a correct clover crown.

 

[Tony C.]

You're welcome, and good luck.

 

[norb1967]

Tony C.

You're welcome, and good luck.

Can I ask for your thoughts on this?

https://watchesoflancashire.com/product/1951-omega-oversize-2505-20/

 

[Tony C.]

My only thought is that you will find much better value if you carefully choose from the offerings of reliable, private sellers.