I like Rolex. I really do. But enough already!

[JwRosenthal]

blufinz52

I think the confusion about Rolex being a non-profit, is that as a charitable trust, they don't pay taxes. I'm not sure how Rolex has convinced anyone that they are a non-profit. It's more that people don't understand Swiss laws concerning charitable trusts.

People don’t understand non-profit status in the US either. Only a small percentage (I’m sure @gatorcpa can provide the exact percentage) is required to go to the actual “mission” of the organization, the rest is part of “overhead”.
Where I live, Johns Hopkins University and Hospital is the largest employer, the largest land owner and most profitable organization in the city (second is the Catholic Church- also highly profitable due to property income and they are not for profit). They pay no taxes and every time they expand their land holdings they remove properties from the tax income of the city. Because they hold so much influence (largest employer) they have had the courts rule in their favor in imminent domain cases and taken property from tax paying land owners….they are not a civic agency, how can eminent domain be applied!!!
They are slum lords of properties they own and lease and again, pay no tax on them.
Not for profit organizations are big business. They have the lobbying power to get away with it.

 

[SpeedyPhill]

End-of-year 2021... might be the peak time ☕
.

 

[WhatYourWatchSay]

There's a guy where I live here in Cambridge, ON who always seems to have a supply of vintage Rolex watches. Not the desirable ones but rather the models most collectors passed over. He is able to sell every one he gets at ridiculous prices because people just want a dial with a crown and the name Rolex.

Edited: Dec 12, 2021

 

[jaguar11]

JwRosenthal

Forget Rolex, far more fun to be had out there- let the influencers take the hit and burn out the market.



La Centrale Boites case, Singer dial, in-house movement, JB Champion bracelets, still readily available for under $1k on the open used market. The hunt for perfection is the fun with these- far more challenging and gratifying than any Rolex hunt.

Absolutely spot on!!!

 

[noelekal]

The Rolex vibe with which I became acquainted years ago wasn't appealing to me, being in banking where all I saw of the brand were the Datejusts and Presidents in bank board rooms or else worn by commercial loan customers who wanted to impress at the loan interview. With these encounters it didn't seem that the wearers had much regard for the watch or the brand and only a shallow outward regard for themselves.

I had considered acquiring a no-date 14060 or 5513 Sub in 2016, the year I retired, primarily because of the influence of Omega Forums WRUW and those who were exhibiting their neato examples. These could be had for $4500 to $5500 in good conditioning at that time. I procrastinated and didn't get "a round tuit" and those subs kept rising in price. Just this year I determined to finally gather in a Sub before the 14060 reached a point were it'd take more than $10,000 to acquire a good one. But, here we are at year end of 2021 and I reached the conclusion that they weren't worth that kind of money to me and I'd be annoyed wearing one at such a price. Instead I've indulged myself in a couple of vintage Omega models that I admire and have played fast and loose in American railroad grade pocket watches with much fun and frolic. Omega Forums is also an influence for me in the pocket watch yen. I'm open to picking up a Sub in future, but they will have to come down considerably. I don't see that happening so I don't see me with a Sub on the wrist any time soon.

The current Rolex market and the supposed dearth of Rolex watches is offputting. So are some aspects of the styling. Endless repetitions of "Rolex" on the rehaut encircling the dials and the Cyclops are both unappealing as are some of the newest case dimensional configurations. I'll content myself with admiring the best of Omega Forum members' older Rolex offerings in WRUW.

 

[cvalue13]

It’s weird the discussions around whether Rolex is “limiting production” vs “not increasing production.” Seems pretty obvious those are the same things stated differently, if neither version is simultaneously addressing also the demand side of the equation.

But the - by far - strangest thing is the implication that a company like Rolex should be producing enough units to meet demand. That is the opposite of the business of luxury products. The business of luxury products is instead to ensure that demand outstrips supply. The more demand outstrips supply the better.

So as for “limiting production” vs “not increasing production” it all depends on demand, all else equal: if demand we’re going down, a luxury brand would reduce production to keep demand outstripping supply; if demand we’re instead going up, a luxury brand may either maintain production numbers (allowing demand to further outstrip supply), or instead chase demand with increased production but only to a point, still seeking demand to always outstrip supply.

Anyone chasing their tails with the idea that “if more people want Rolex then obviously Rolex should make more watches” has missed the plot of luxury goods.

Edited: Dec 12, 2021

 

[M'Bob]

noelekal

The current Rolex market and the supposed dearth of Rolex watches is offputting. So are some aspects of the styling. Endless repetitions of "Rolex" on the rehaut encircling the dials and the Cyclops are both unappealing as are some of the newest case dimensional configurations. I'll content myself with admiring the best of Omega Forum members' older Rolex offerings in WRUW.

Yes. They are way too shiny, too busy, too discordant. I’ll stick with their old:

 

[noelekal]

Ok, those two are appealing M'Bob.

Don't hit me for asking this though. Is it possible to use a non-Cyclops crystal on a Rolex having a date feature with Cyclops? I've long wondered about that, but was reluctant to ask.

The date model Rolexes are probably better off with me just leaving them be and hunting a nice no-date model. A date feature is not my favorite watch complication anyway and the Cyclops renders it an offense to the eye. I'd probably be trying to scrape it off the crystal or contriving some other fool notion to "improve" the appearance.

 

[M'Bob]

noelekal

Ok, those two are appealing M'Bob.

Don't hit me for asking this though. Is it possible to use a non-Cyclops crystal on a Rolex having a date feature with Cyclops? I've long wondered about that, but was reluctant to ask.

The date model Rolexes are probably better off with me just leaving them be and hunting a nice no-date model. A date feature is not my favorite watch complication anyway and the Cyclops renders it an offense to the eye. I'd probably be trying to scrape it off the crystal or contriving some other fool notion to "improve" the appearance.

Yes, many feel the way you do and retrofit a non-cyclops crystal. From a completely aesthetic standpoint, I agree with you - it’s kinda ugly. I keep mine this way because that’s how it was originally.


Generally, I also prefer a non-date model…much cleaner design.

 

[JwRosenthal]

M'Bob

Yes, many feel the way you do and retrofit a non-cyclops crystal. From a completely aesthetic standpoint, I agree with you - it’s kinda ugly. I keep mine this way because that’s how it was originally.


Generally, I also prefer a non-date model…much cleaner design.

That just lovely- nothing to hate about that

 

[pdxleaf]

noelekal

...

Don't hit me for asking this though. Is it possible to use a non-Cyclops crystal on a Rolex having a date feature with Cyclops? I've long wondered about that, but was reluctant to ask...

Check out Sea-Dwellers if you want a date without a cyclops.

 

[JwRosenthal]

pdxleaf

Check out Sea-Dwellers if you want a date without a cyclops.

Or try a 14060 if you don’t want the date at all


Swap out the flat sapphire for a super dome and throw it on a Tropic…now we’re talking! I think Rolex took a hit out on me for this.

 

[pdxleaf]

M'Bob

Just perusing the popular watch dealer sites, and 90% of what they are offering are Subs, Daytonas, GMTs, etc. Hulk this, Pepsi that. I’m mean, really - my eyes are glazing over. How much of these iterations can you push on the buying public before they reach a tipping point, and they find out that everyone else in their social strata has one who wants one, and therefore it’s not that exciting anymore? Is there no end to this?

I remember in the 1980’s, everyone wanted a Mercedes. Then BMW got popular. Years later, everyone wanted a Land Rover.

What’s your prediction: does the Rolex madness continue, or will it be supplanted by another brand? Will Omega fill the void?

I think you're asking two questions. Will Rolex still be a highly desired brand, well-known by the general public that otherwise knows nothing about watches? Yes. Marketing and branding is pretty mature and widespread. They'd have to screw up really badly and often to change the narrative.

Second question, will people still be able to sell a Rolex for 2 to 3 times msrp right after they walk out of a dealership? This is doubtful long term, but is it unrelated to the prices of houses, the stock market, the cost of used cars, vintage speedmasters even? Rolex seems to get a bad rap simply based on everyone in the world thinking easy money. At least with Rolex you get a decent watch as compared to bitcoin.

Will Omega take over Rolex? No, and I can't imagine they would want to. One nice side impact might be that the interest in Rolex has people interested in watches. It doesn't take much looking to find out that there are many other fantastic brands with interesting stories. If people are curious and learn about Omega, i do think they'll see a great watch at a great value. Depends how far down the road they are with the Rolex branding.

Regardless, it would be nice if the air can be left out of the balloon without it popping. Scary to think of.

One man's opinion, since you asked 😉

 

[jaguar11]

pdxleaf

Check out Sea-Dwellers if you want a date without a cyclops.

Yes indeed and still underrated. A lot of watch for the money if you shop around with some now weighing in at less than a 14060....

 

[jaguar11]

JwRosenthal

Or try a 14060 if you don’t want the date at all


Swap out the flat sapphire for a super dome and throw it on a Tropic…now we’re talking! I think Rolex took a hit out on me for this.

Once again Sir I can only say this looks so nice🥰

 

[Archer]

pdxleaf

Regardless, it would be nice if the air can be left out of the balloon without it popping. Scary to think of.

Is this the Rolex "balloon" (since we don't apparently want to call it a bubble) you are speaking of specifically?

If so, then I couldn't care less if it deflates slowly or pops. If people bought these things at 3X the list price, and the price goes through the floor, it's their own fault. I have little sympathy, because if they bought it because they truly loved the watch it won't matter, and if they bought it as an "investment" well...tough shit.

If you are talking about the wider "balloon" then I get it...

 

[dsio]

There are bubbles in the Omega world that need popping too like the Silver Snoopy one, which is in a ridiculous state at the moment.

Anyone who is genuinely stupid enough to be hoarding those as a speculator I have no sympathy for when they get their fingers burned.

 

[M'Bob]

Archer

I have little sympathy

dsio

I have no sympathy

Okay, maybe I have just a wee bit of sympathy for those who can’t think for themselves, get caught up in the wave of status-seeking, and have no inherent aesthetic filter which allows them to make a unilateral decision regarding quality vs fad…

 

[dsio]

M'Bob

Okay, maybe I have just a wee bit of sympathy for those who can’t think for themselves, get caught up in the wave of status-seeking, and have no inherent aesthetic filter which allows them to make a unilateral decision regarding quality vs fad…

The thing that bothers me with it is there are large numbers of Silver Snoopys, and other LEs sitting in vaults rather than getting dented up on wrists, so it squeezes passionate collectors out of the market due to the watches becoming a wealth vehicle.

Our position has always been that of a consumer / collector focused community of people that just love cool watches and take pleasure from them and that doesn’t happen when they’re in vaults, or when people can’t afford them because they’re getting scalped hard, or when some AD sells someone an allocation then when the watch arrives refunds it and lists it above msrp on eBay which happened with the white dial Snoopy. So from my perspective the speculators can get stuffed, if they lose money great, and if I can help them lose money by putting my finger on the scales that’s great.

 

[Archer]

M'Bob

Okay, maybe I have just a wee bit of sympathy for those who can’t think for themselves, get caught up in the wave of status-seeking, and have no inherent aesthetic filter which allows them to make a unilateral decision regarding quality vs fad…

That makes one of us. 😉