I like Rolex. I really do. But enough already!

[Rasputin]

Rolex is in such demand that apparently all the models on display at the local AD are only "shell" watches without movements.

 

[eugeneandresson]

When you have non-watch-people manage to get watches (like Subs) at retail, with the sole intention of flipping them within the year for 2x (and not wearing or enjoying) then you know something is off.

I have a buddy like this. He asked me if I could sell his watch for him, but I politely declined and explained about collector values and reputation that is worth more to me. To his credit he has a single Omega that’s been on his wrist for the better part of the last decade 👍 But still, there is that rotten weed that seems to have invaded everywhere…

 

[harrymai86]

So just dont chase after the modern pieces, for me those 80s 90s Rolexes are still nice to have. Looking for a 16750 now 😁

 

[gbesq]

I’ve never been a Rolex fan. Candidly, I don’t care for their designs and I am offended by the company’s business practices. Shortage of Rolexes due to unprecedented demand? Bullshit. Shortage of Rolexes because that’s what Rolex wants and therefore limits production? Bingo. That being said, I’m the first to admit that Rolex marketing is second to none. As for Omega ever becoming the new Rolex, God forbid.

 

[Rman]

Rolex’s star is tied to “steel sports,” and they build a great watch, but there will be a saturation point (supply or brand fatigue).

(kid’s voice) “Are we there yet?!”

 

[Widows Son]

Simple, supply and demand. I have several Rolex's and love them, totally dependable. All were either gifts or bought pre loved. Would I pay 2X MSRP for a new one today, not a chance. Remember Rolex is a non profit. They could crank out millions more but then people would scream that this would devalue their Rolex. There are some people that have an insane amount of disposable income, there is also a huge demand for Rolex's in China. This all drives up the prices. I don't think Rolex is being sneaky. I wont even get into greys and flippers!!!

 

[flw]

gbesq

As for Omega ever becoming the new Rolex, God forbid.

I couldn't agree more. I don't think any Omega fan wants to enter an AD or boutique to find empty displays, arrogant salespeople, and their favorite watches vacuumed up by Instagram "influencers" and the grey market, at 2 or 3 times MSRP. Madness.

 

[Davidt]

gbesq

I’ve never been a Rolex fan. Candidly, I don’t care for their designs and I am offended by the company’s business practices. Shortage of Rolexes due to unprecedented demand? Bullshit. Shortage of Rolexes because that’s what Rolex wants and therefore limits production? Bingo. That being said, I’m the first to admit that Rolex marketing is second to none. As for Omega ever becoming the new Rolex, God forbid.

Do you have any evidence (production numbers, COSC or anything similar) backing up the claim that Rolex have purposely limited production?

This claim gets wheeled out every few days at the minute without anyone ever backing it up.

My view is that COVID issues aside, Rolex is producing as many watches as they ever have done. It’s simply the allure of a quick buck/flip combined with insta popularity and douche bags ‘investing in watches’ that’s has driven up the demand side of the equation.

The only part that may ring true is perhaps they’ve swayed production more to precious metals away from steel. This wouldn’t necessarily have anything to do with influencing the secondary market, rather the margins are larger here. No evidence to back this up though 😉.

Do Rolex mind the fact their secondary values are higher than RRP? Of course not.
Would I pay over RRP for a current reference? Of course not.

 

[gbesq]

Davidt

Do you have any evidence (production numbers, COSC or anything similar) backing up the claim that Rolex have purposely limited production?

This claim gets wheeled out every few days at the minute without anyone ever backing it up.

No, I don’t have any hard evidence to prove that Rolex is intentionally limiting production. But let me answer your question with a question. Do you honestly believe that Rolex, a company that has been around since 1905, that prides itself on the quality of its products, that has its own foundry, that uses a special type of steel, etc., etc., etc., cannot legitimately figure out how to produce enough of its product to meet demand as all other companies in various industries are expected to do for their customers? If you truly believe that, then I submit to you that Rolex is one of the most poorly run companies in the world and not the darling of the Swiss luxury watch industry.

 

[Davidt]

gbesq

No, I don’t have any hard evidence to prove that Rolex is intentionally limiting production. But let me answer your question with a question. Do you honestly believe that Rolex, a company that has been around since 1905, that prides itself on the quality of its products, that has its own foundry, that uses a special type of steel, etc., etc., etc., cannot legitimately figure out how to produce enough of its product to meet demand as all other companies in various industries are expected to do for their customers? If you truly believe that, then I submit to you that Rolex is one of the most poorly run companies in the world and not the darling of the Swiss luxury watch industry.

They’re two very different things.

Choosing to consciously reduce production/supply to drive up demand is very different to choosing to not ramp up to meet an increase in demand. Surely that’s obvious?

Your initial comment was they’re they are artificially limiting production. There’s no evidence for this and I say this isn’t happening.

If you’re now saying that they purposefully aren’t increasing production to meet an increase in demand, I agree. They probably aren’t doing this and I can see why. There’d be a huge capital investment required to do this and what if the increase in demand is temporary, they may spend millions to meet a demand that is fleeting.

 

[gbesq]

Davidt

They’re two very different things.

Choosing to consciously reduce production/supply to drive up demand is very different to choosing to not ramp up to meet an increase in demand. Surely that’s obvious?

Your initial comment was they’re they are artificially limiting production. There’s no evidence for this and I say this isn’t happening.

If you’re now saying that they purposefully aren’t increasing production to meet an increase in demand, I agree. They probably aren’t doing this and I can see why. There’d be a huge capital investment required to do this and what if the increase in demand is temporary, they may spend millions to meet a demand that is fleeting.

I am saying the former, not the latter, and I stand by it, no hard evidence notwithstanding. To me, it’s common sense. It’s not like Rolex is going to highlight that strategy in their annual report. Oh, I forgot, they are a Swiss charitable trust (read “cryptic at best”), so they don’t have an annual report. 🙄

 

[Davidt]

So no evidence or data to confirm or suggest that they’re limiting production, just an opinion.
Thanks for clarifying

 

[Tuna Cowboy]

I think Rolex like many other companies are having some legit issues getting product out. I was in my local AD last week and was surprised to see not one Rolex in the case? Not even a ladies DJ! So now everything Rolex makes including a 28mm DJ is I don't think so. Seems to me like Rolex is having similar issues as other companies in other industries.

 

[gbesq]

Davidt

So no evidence or data to confirm or suggest that they’re limiting production, just an opinion.
Thanks for clarifying

Confirmed, just an opinion, but one shared by many on this forum as I’m sure that yours is as well.

 

[Barnaby'sDad]

Tuna Cowboy

I think Rolex like many other companies are having some legit issues getting product out. I was in my local AD last week and was surprised to see not one Rolex in the case? Not even a ladies DJ! So now everything Rolex makes including a 28mm DJ is I don't think so. Seems to me like Rolex is having similar issues as other companies in other industries.

Look around online. Even models that pretty much no one cared about a few years ago (I.e. OP and DJ) are pulling a premium now. I.e. Over on WUS…folks talking about going into a Rolex AD looking for ‘X’ and feeling lucky being able to “score” an OP or DJ.

Wrap your head around that one…spending $5k+ for a watch that you weren’t even interested in so that the AD will put you in a “list” to maybe give you a call in 6+ months when something similar to what you want comes in. Lol.

And back to the flipping. That’s likely where the 28mm DJ went. I.e. Flipper agreed to take one or more watches that the AD couldn’t unload to work a deal on one or more in demand models.

 

[Davidt]

gbesq

Confirmed, just an opinion, but one shared by many on this forum as I’m sure that yours is as well.

Agreed. I just think the opinion that Rolex is limiting supply by reducing production is clearly just that, an opinion, but it’s slowly becoming an unchallenged ‘fact’ on this an other forums.

To be clear, I have no skin in the game, I don’t sell or flip Rolex, and the few modern Rolex I have were bought at RRP from an AD and I have no thoughts on selling them. But I do like Rolex, just like I like Omega and several other brands and secondary pricing or fleeting interest from the insta crowd won’t change that.

 

[Braindrain]

gbesq

Oh, I forgot, they are a Swiss charitable trust (read “cryptic at best”), so they don’t have an annual report. 🙄

On that, I spoke to a Swiss exec from another watch brand, who also is registered as a trust. I asked a few casual Qs around that.

Let's just say his answers are definitely NOT what most people think of when they see "charity".

 

[JwRosenthal]

Forget Rolex, far more fun to be had out there- let the influencers take the hit and burn out the market.



La Centrale Boites case, Singer dial, in-house movement, JB Champion bracelets, still readily available for under $1k on the open used market. The hunt for perfection is the fun with these- far more challenging and gratifying than any Rolex hunt.

 

[Archer]

Braindrain

On that, I spoke to a Swiss exec from another watch brand, who also is registered as a trust. I asked a few casual Qs around that.

Let's just say his answers are definitely NOT what most people think of when they see "charity".

Yes, indeed. But Rolex has convinced people that they are, as one poster here put it, a "non-profit" which is about the furthest thing from the truth that one could imagine.

 

[blufinz52]

Archer

Yes, indeed. But Rolex has convinced people that they are, as one poster here put it, a "non-profit" which is about the furthest thing from the truth that one could imagine.

I think the confusion about Rolex being a non-profit, is that as a charitable trust, they don't pay taxes. I'm not sure how Rolex has convinced anyone that they are a non-profit. It's more that people don't understand Swiss laws concerning charitable trusts.