Community Stories

How to tell if a WatchCo is a 'genuine' WatchCo i.e. built by them, or if it's WatchCo 'like'?

JwRosenthal
Posts
16,307
Likes
44,918
padders padders
I'd trust an Archer or STS as much as I'd trust a Watchco but that is just me.
I would actually trust an Archer or STS more, at least you would know it was serviced and have an itemized receipt of the work. I understand that watchco said their watches were serviced, but the receipt I have just notes the sale of the watch and not any details on the service done to the movement.
 
Archer
Posts
27,725
Likes
70,457
JwRosenthal JwRosenthal
I understand that watchco said their watches were serviced, but the receipt I have just notes the sale of the watch and not any details on the service done to the movement.

The one I bought from them was definitely not serviced...I had to service it immediately on receipt.
 
hoipolloi
Posts
3,641
Likes
6,139
I brought mine to Vietnam for service last year. 😁

20230422_183229.jpg
 
khangct
Posts
250
Likes
651
Since we’re talking about WatchCo I just want to show off my new purchase from a fellow OF member. Superb condition
 
5ABB8792-7DED-4FFF-9095-8FB1A821DA1D.jpeg EEAAC19C-8DE5-4C9F-A377-A0CE5268C03F.jpeg 968FFEC9-8D85-437F-B452-229A764A0AEF.jpeg
pdxleaf
Posts
5,148
Likes
17,891
I assume Omega would service a Watchco or otherwise built watch, which would mean it's real enough?
 
JwRosenthal
Posts
16,307
Likes
44,918
pdxleaf pdxleaf
I assume Omega would service a Watchco or otherwise built watch, which would mean it's real enough?
Or they could revert it back to “like new” by the serial number and send you back a gold plated Geneve.
 
Tony C.
Posts
7,707
Likes
26,748
pdxleaf pdxleaf
I assume Omega would service a Watchco or otherwise built watch, which would mean it's real enough?

I would actually assume the opposite. Why would they service a watch that they neither sold, nor assembled?
 
pdxleaf
Posts
5,148
Likes
17,891
Tony C. Tony C.
I would actually assume the opposite. Why would they service a watch that they neither sold, nor assembled?

Agreed, provided that there's a way to distinguish between a WatchCo built watch and a factory built watch. However, the consensus here is that a WatchCo watch is made up of all Omega service parts and indistinguishable from a factory built or previously serviced watch. If so, then it seems that Omega would service it. If Omega won't service it, then there must be a way to distinguish between the two.

Is it the movement serial number? Maybe if a watch was built with a movement from a different reference. (I don't know what other references used the same movement.) But if it was built with a service replacement movement, then it could have previously been serviced when it received the replacement parts. The only way they'd know that it wasn't previously serviced by an authorized Omega watchmaker is if they kept records of which watchmakers had ordered parts and used them for which watches. Otherwise they'd have to assume it's an Omega and service it.

Just curious. I have no experience with these and am trying to follow the discussion.
 
Tony C.
Posts
7,707
Likes
26,748
pdxleaf pdxleaf
Agreed, provided that there's a way to distinguish between a WatchCo built watch and a factory built watch. However, the consensus here is that a WatchCo watch is made up of all Omega service parts and indistinguishable from a factory built or previously serviced watch

I have zero expertise on the topic, but surely Omega would have records of the matching case and movement numbers that left the factory in fully assembled watches, no?
 
JwRosenthal
Posts
16,307
Likes
44,918
Tony C. Tony C.
I have zero expertise on the topic, but surely Omega would have records of the matching case and movement numbers that left the factory in fully assembled watches, no?
There will be no records on these watches. An extract will bring up whatever info pertains to the donor movement- and we can assume watchco was buying up cheap Geneve’s and ratty Seamasters to get the movements.
We are at the point where these Watchco’s will be heading in for service. Even if they were totally serviced by Watchco during the early days (to which Archer confirmed his wasn’t), we are at the 6-10 year mark since they were rolling out.

It will be interesting to see how Omega would handle one of these coming in for service (anyone have experience sending one back to the factory?). I don’t think they will fuss actually; these watches are made with factory parts that had to be obtained by an authorized parts account holder (at the time), using older Omega movements. Watchco didn’t violate any rules as far as I know- Omega changed their policies after they realized what watchco was doing (which is no different than what Ofrei or Cousins was doing other than watchco was assembling whole watches and not just selling the parts). Regardless of who assembled them, they are genuine Omegas. Now if someone sent in one of the Etsy/eBay fake kit 300’s with an old 552/565 in it, then they would be within their right to send it back, fake is fake.
 
Tony C.
Posts
7,707
Likes
26,748
JwRosenthal JwRosenthal
It will be interesting to see how Omega would handle one of these coming in for service (anyone have experience sending one back to the factory?). I don’t think they will fuss actually; these watches are made with factory parts that had to be obtained by an authorized parts account holder (at the time), using older Omega movements. Watchco didn’t violate any rules as far as I know- Omega changed their policies after they realized what watchco was doing (which is no different than what Ofrei or Cousins was doing other than watchco was assembling whole watches and not just selling the parts). Regardless of who assembled them, they are genuine Omegas. Now if someone sent in one of the Etsy/eBay fake kit 300’s with an old 552/565 in it, then they would be within their right to send it back, fake is fake.

Well, I would be surprised if Omega were to be willing to service watches that did not leave the factory fully assembled, even if they were subsequently assembled from genuine parts. Of course there would be the exception of those which were officially cased in other countries, but this would be very different, in my view.

I also find it a bit odd that you assert that they are "genuine Omegas", as by that dubious standard, so would a watch that was assembled from parts stripped from disparate donor watches. I mean yes, in a loose sense, if all the parts are "correct" for the model, then the watch would be "genuine". But being far from original, that would arguably strain the meaning of the word.

An associated question would be: would Omega service a non-original watch (e.g. mismatched case and movement numbers), but assembled from otherwise correct parts?
 
Archer
Posts
27,725
Likes
70,457
pdxleaf pdxleaf
I assume Omega would service a Watchco or otherwise built watch, which would mean it's real enough?

Yes, they will service them. People on forums have reported having it done.

The local factory service centers don't obtain an extract of the archives for every watch they service, so the chances of them even knowing that the watch is assembled from parts (as opposed to one that was "restored" by Omega at some point) is very slim. As long as the correct movement has been used, there's really not much chance Omega is going to know either way, or care.

Having said that, why you would choose Omega is another question - these are very serviceable movements by ay competent watchmaker.
 
JwRosenthal
Posts
16,307
Likes
44,918
Tony C. Tony C.
I also find it a bit odd that you assert that they are "genuine Omegas", as by that dubious standard, so would a watch that was assembled from parts stripped from disparate donor watches. I mean yes, in a loose sense, if all the parts are "correct" for the model, then the watch would be "genuine".
It’s why I used the word “genuine” as opposed to “original”. The parts are indeed genuine factory parts- but the watch as you assert is far from original.
 
SXP
Posts
109
Likes
105
Dan S Dan S
As long as the parts are authentic, why would you care who assembled it?
I guess it's some kind of perverse sense of authenticity, and more so provenance.. Also taking some comfort in they seem to know what they were doing; and doing it very well by all accounts, rather than any Tom Dick or Harry I've never heard of..
Apart from Hanks, Cavett and Dirty, that is to say 😉
 
JwRosenthal
Posts
16,307
Likes
44,918
SXP SXP
I guess it's some kind of perverse sense of authenticity, and more so provenance.. Also taking some comfort in they seem to know what they were doing; and doing it very well by all accounts, rather than any Tom Dick or Harry I've never heard of..
Apart from Hanks, Cavett and Dirty, that is to say 😉
I think due to the lore, people put a premium on a watchco build 300. I don’t think people care that they weren’t serviced or how they were handled- they were built by “the Watchco” so they are special. Same goes with Türler or Tiffany dialed watches- they weren’t special in any way nor subject to an extra level of quality control- they were just sold through those stores and branded as such. It’s not based in logic- nor is anything in this hobby really.
 
SXP
Posts
109
Likes
105
By the sounds of it, it's another minefield::facepalm1::
but I guess as long as it's been put together with genuine parts, by an appropriate adult (professional watchmaker),
then I have no qualms about it being non-WatchCo, although it does seem as if the WatchCo moniker is used as a euphemism to describe this kind of watch that's been put together outside of the factory..
It also seems that a WatchCo 'provenance' is more desirable and seems to command a bit of a premium in terms of price over others..
 
JwRosenthal
Posts
16,307
Likes
44,918
SXP SXP
By the sounds of it, it's another minefield::facepalm1::
but I guess as long as it's been put together with genuine parts, by an appropriate adult (professional watchmaker),
then I have no qualms about it being non-WatchCo, although it does seem as if the WatchCo moniker is used as a euphemism to describe this kind of watch that's been put together outside of the factory..
It also seems that a WatchCo 'provenance' is more desirable and seems to command a bit of a premium in terms of price over others..
It has become a minefield. I have seen fake 300 kits (with vintage movements) listed as “Watchco’s”. That is a serious problem as the term has shifted from genuine parts with old movement, assembled to make a complete watch, to fake parts with a genuine movement to make a complete fake watch. They are not the same and the devil is in the details when shopping for one of these.
 
Dan S
Posts
21,266
Likes
48,428
SXP SXP
It also seems that a WatchCo 'provenance' is more desirable and seems to command a bit of a premium in terms of price over others..

If there is no documentation, there is no provenance, and one would be foolish to pay a premium. Anyone can claim that their watch was assembled by Watchco.
 
12 More Posts...
Sign up or log in to reply...

Similar threads

A

How to tell if a seller is trustworthy?

Akkad Open Discussion
Eve
Eve
Posts
16
Views
1K
250scr

How to tell if a speedmaster dial is original?

250scr Vintage Omega Watches Help, Discussion and Advice
250scr
250scr
Posts
14
Views
2K