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Help with Black Dial Constellation

johnk22
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Hi everyone,

I am considering this black dial pie pan constellation. I was hoping to get feedback on the authenticity of the dial. One thing I noticed is the serial number is in the 20 million range and the case is dated 61. Is this a sign that the movement was installed into the case later? The photos aren’t great quality either
IMG_5116.jpeg IMG_5112.jpeg IMG_5111.jpeg IMG_5113.jpeg IMG_5114.jpeg IMG_5115.jpeg IMG_5117.jpeg
 
Zman4eva
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Lots of red flags with this one. The minute and seconds hand extends past the minute track. Lugs are soft and the stars were polished too much.

Easy pass for me.
 
johnk22
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Thank you. I appreciate you pointing those things out.
 
Noddyman
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The hands are correct for this reference although both hands and dial are missing lume. The dial is original but highly degraded and not very attractive imo. I’m not sure about the serial no. (20 mil seems a little high) as usually these 14393’s range from 17-19 million. Finally the case (especially the lugs) has been polished to death. Not a great example, it would need to be cheap.
 
sgk
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Given the state of the dial, I would pass on this
 
kaplan
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Out of curiosity how much are you intending to pay this one?

Recently there was a better conditioned one with different lugs sold on auction for $1500 - I fell in love with it but don't buy diverse models so passed, curious about the price on this one
 
johnk22
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They are asking around $1700 or best offer. I have decided not to pursue this one and wait for a better example.
 
Peemacgee
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Noddyman Noddyman
The hands are correct for this reference although both hands and dial are missing lume. .

Whilst I've also seen quite a few pie pans like this with the hour hand overlapping the pie pan edge, the original design should see the tip of the hour hand just inside the dial facet.
Whether Omegas changed the design principle or stopped producing hands of the correct length, I don't know.
Given that some early and late 14381s/14393s can be seen with this hand arrangement leads me to believe it is likely that, IMHO, the incorrect hands were fitted at service.
 
Noddyman
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Peemacgee Peemacgee
Given that some early and late 14381s/14393s can be seen with this hand arrangement leads me to believe it is likely that, IMHO, the incorrect hands were fitted at service.
That could definitely be the case.
Mine certainly has replacement hands as I sourced them and had them fitted by my watchmaker.
IMG_1472.jpeg
 
peatnick
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Peemacgee Peemacgee
Whilst I've also seen quite a few pie pans like this with the hour hand overlapping the pie pan edge, the original design should see the tip of the hour hand just inside the dial facet.
Whether Omegas changed the design principle or stopped producing hands of the correct length, I don't know.
Given that some early and late 14381s/14393s can be seen with this hand arrangement leads me to believe it is likely that, IMHO, the incorrect hands were fitted at service.

my 14381 pie pan has correct hands, my dome dial has longer minutes hand so it’s possible replacement supply for 14381 had both and could be fitted during service

IMG_0630.jpeg
 
Peemacgee
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peatnick peatnick
my 14381 pie pan has correct hands, my dome dial has longer minutes hand so it’s possible replacement supply for 14381 had both and could be fitted during service

IMG_0630.jpeg

The dome dial minute hands are too long for the only-slightly too long pie pan minute hands.
It's possible the slightly longer pie-pan hand originally was intended for something like a dogleg or an 168.004/.010 pie pan dial
 
hoipolloi
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These are the hands of my 14393. They are not too long and look fit with the dial. Second hand is original because there is no big hole at the center.
Maybe that dial style is a bit larger?
Screenshot_20231016_162017_Gallery.jpg
 
Sa Calobra
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The state of the dial and the fact that lugs are so polished will start annoying you the longer you have it. I highly suggest to pass and wait a bit longer.
 
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