Just curious...
On new pieces....?
Because Alligator mississippiensis is (still) on the EU endangered wildlife list...
Is it not?

 

Depends on the market. I believe those sold in US have alligator or crocodile straps. It's easy enough to install the strap at their NYC office when they arrive from Switzerland.

 

Sure. Interesting. So what straps do they use in the EU?

I mean PP HQ is a mere few KM from France

Do they seriously think it’s appropriate to use alligator if the EU has them on the endangered list?

Do Alligators get farmed like crocs for their hide (for example)? Maybe they do and thats ok, just curious if PP have a sustainable wildlife policy on this.....

 

I doubt they care very much and they just follow the letter of the law

 

Yes but it's the era of "the responsible corporate" - a company ignores this to its detriment... just my opinion...

 

They are farmed. I’d be more comfortable with US sourced hide. Questionable practices elsewhere including live skinning, one shudders.

 

Omega does, so I don't see why PP wouldn't. Straps like these are subject to CITES requirements and documentation, so would come from verifiably sustainable sources. They would be farmed hides most likely.

 

^where does that label say it's sourced/subject to CITES? Or comes from farmed hide?

 

It doesn't.

 

Alligators are definitely farmed in Louisiana. The meat is sold everywhere (to tourists, mostly), and the hide made into wallets, belts, boots, straps, etc. When I lived there I frequently took visitors on swamp tours out of Houma, and the explanation of the alligator farming industry was always a major topic of the tour. It's actually pretty interesting. They harvest eggs out of nests and incubate them at the desired temperature to influence the gender (higher temperature gives more males). Then the young ones are raised in enclosed areas. I also recall going to a big alligator festival during the summer in St. Charles Parish IIRC.

I don't know about the PP straps.

 

Point I am making is this. We really don't know where the leather is sourced. Or how. Still - In 2021. In the age of accurate digital supply chains. Food is source labeled. Meat free range etc Organic etc. Why not leather? We just continue to have to "guess". We really have zero idea don't we? A ban remains and exists into the EU. And everywhere else is "just ok"???.. And the Swiss are turning a blind eye to this?... when Geneva is like 5km (sometimes less) from the EU border?

 

I'd be shocked if they were doing anything illegal or distasteful. As many have pointed out, there are alligators farms in the USA that can supply what they need trouble-free.
Some luxury conglomerates have even purchased their own farms: https://www.oaklins.com/us/en/deals/41537/
Now the Asian strap sellers on Etsy and eBay... I dont dabble.

 

This is a confusing thread...

Where did you get the idea that there is a ban on this hide in the EU? Why would the EU ban this hide?

The American alligator is not an endangered species - hasn't been for decades. France imports large quantities of this hide as there are many high end strap makers and makers of other leather goods there. APB and Camille Fornet are the two big strap makers that I am aware of, who makes straps for watch brands. The EU imported over 1/2 a million hides in 2017 according to this analysis, again mostly to France:

https://ec.europa.eu/environment/cites/pdf/EU Wildlife Trade 2017_Analysis of the EU Annual Reports to CITES.pdf

The strap I showed above is made in France - see origin at the bottom of the label:



And yes, it is fully certified by CITES:



Materials that are regulated by CITES are not necessarily endangered. In the case of American alligator, it is regulated and taken from documented sources to ensure it is what it says it is, instead of being something that actually is endangered.

I believe you have started this thread on a faulty assumption...

 

The vast majority of 'Alligator' straps are actually South American Caimans, a smaller and very plentiful variety, well suited for small and pliable things like straps and shoes.

But while we're on the topic, living in Florida has its advantages....13ft finished belly skin from 15+ft Florida Alligator. This size would have been about 1,000lbs. As big as it gets in Florida, and that's plenty big...see comparison chart to humans.
(Note: live pic is example of equivalent 15+ft size, not of actual alligator used for my skin.)

The bodies of water in my neighborhood are too small for the big ones, though the adult females come here to lay eggs in privacy away from males that, believe it or not, would eat their eggs. Babies grow to about 6ft before they move on to bigger waters. Bottom photo is a fellow I came across riding my bike around the neighborhood. About 6ft or a little more. Pretty docile, actually, you just shoo them away.....

 

California tried banning all alligator/crocodile products but it’s being challenged

https://apnews.com/article/global-t...ornia-courts-29c07e3faff3817c9b68c30a83e30612

ABP in Paris still sells every animal skin available

 

i dont see kangaroo and sturgeon and stingray and toad.

 

Yeah I don’t see sturgeon but they do have salmon and not many people have hippo these days