Calling all Pocket Watch Buffs

Bernhard J · Dec 23, 2022

Triggered by "Liverpool", here is a watch with the so-called Liverpool windows from 1849.

The case style is evidently very different.

Cheers, Bernhard

DirtyDozen12 · Dec 23, 2022

Bernhard J
Triggered by "Liverpool", here is a watch with the so-called Liverpool windows from 1849.
The case style is evidently very different.
Cheers, Bernhard

Beautiful movement, and neat dial with "VI" instead of "30" in the sub-dial. Thanks for sharing!

Waltesefalcon · Dec 23, 2022

Wow! I'm surprised this watch generated any interest. The last time I posted it, it didn't.

That info about Jos. Johnson is the same I found on him. The case maker is one I have not been able to find though.

It is a lever escapement, it does still have an original bullseye crystal. Here's a clear photo of the hallmarks. Lion passant (sterling), anchor (Birmingham), and "A" (1849, the other option for this style A is 1773, and that is too early).

Bernhard J · Dec 23, 2022

I agree, indeed it looks like 1849, which is really late for this pair case design.

Regarding the casemaker, I would say either James Heales or Joseph Harris, both casemakers in Coventry in the first half of the 19th century. Both sponsors marks are nearly identical, with the letter for Joseph Harris a little bit closer to each other, like in your watch, so that I nwould tend to him. Anyway, both would be consistent with the date letter. Perhaps other cases of both can be researched?

Cheers, Bernhard

Waltesefalcon · Dec 23, 2022

Okay, this one I'm a little excited for, it and the other Model 1 I showed off a day or two ago are my Christmas gift to myself.

This is an 1874 Illinois 15j Model 1, Miller. It's got the old style "Illinois Springfield Watch Co." dial on it, which is in exceptional shape, with only two very small hairlines just below 12:00 and at 6:00. It also has a nice "J.H. Grove" coin silver case, and I really like coin silver cases. Sadly, the movement has had a parts robbed off of it, and it is broken, sounds like the main spring.

My original idea was to cannibalize the other movement for parts and get this one running. After seeing that the other one is actually running, that's changed. What will probably happen now is this: I'll clean the other Model 1 and house it in this case for the time being. Down the road I'll find the parts I need for this Miller and a hunting case for the other Model 1. As of right now I've sourced and bought hand sets for each, one fleur-de-lis, and one spade.

Bernhard J · Dec 23, 2022

Both definitely worth restoring to old glory and keeping/refitting the first one in the long term in it´s original coin silver case 😀

Waltesefalcon · Dec 23, 2022

Just for fun, I went ahead and put my other new Model 1, an 1887 grade 99 by the way, in the Miller's case. I think it looks handsome, and I am once again impressed by this movement. The moment I took it out of its tin it started running and continued to run until I was done fiddling with it, it then ran for nearly thirty more seconds. The last photo shows it next to my other Model 1, an 1883 grade 101, that I bought from our very own @TexOmega a couple of years ago now.

Bernhard J · Dec 23, 2022

Bernhard J
I agree, indeed it looks like 1849, which is really late for this pair case design.

Regarding the casemaker, I would say either James Heales or Joseph Harris, both casemakers in Coventry in the first half of the 19th century. Both sponsors marks are nearly identical, with the letter for Joseph Harris a little bit closer to each other, like in your watch, so that I nwould tend to him. Anyway, both would be consistent with the date letter. Perhaps other cases of both can be researched?

Cheers, Bernhard

Here is an other case, made by Joseph Harris just a few years earlier. Looks as if yours indeed was made by Harris 😀

Waltesefalcon · Dec 23, 2022

Bernhard J
Here is an other case, made by Joseph Harris just a few years earlier. Looks as if yours indeed was made by Harris 😀

Thank you for that information. I genuinely appreciate it and am adding it to my little information card now.

Waltesefalcon · Dec 23, 2022

In keeping with the Illinois mood I've been in all week, I've been wearing my 1887 Model 2, Grade 5 since Monday. I just checked it against the atomic clock app I have and it seems to have lost 15 seconds since Monday, about 3 sec/ day, and well within railroad specs.

Canuck · Dec 23, 2022

The J H (incuse) trade mark shows up several times in Phillip Priestleys publication of English watch case makers. But the only two that appear to match the trade mark in the case back are:

-James Heales, Spon Street, Coventry.
-Joseph Harris, TheButts, Coventry.

@Waltesefalcon says he has posted this watch before, and there wasn’t much interest. Was it posted somewhere other than on the Pocket Watch forum.

Canuck · Dec 23, 2022

Bernhard J
Triggered by "Liverpool", here is a watch with the so-called Liverpool windows from 1849.

The case style is evidently very different.

Cheers, Bernhard

I too have a Liverpool watch. This one fro 1883-84. Coin silver case, sterling chain that weight 66 grams. Stewart Dawson was a retailer with numerous branches in the Commonwealth. The watch came with no hands, and needing a cannon pinion. I fabricated a cannon pinion, and fitted a pair of Waltham hands which will do until I find a pair of more suitable hands. This one has an English lever escapement, but no fusee.

I have one other English pocket watch. Sterling dial with 18-karat Roman numerals. This one is from circa 1863, has an English lever escapement, and fusee. But it is anonymous!

Waltesefalcon · Dec 23, 2022

Canuck
@Waltesefalcon says he has posted this watch before, and there wasn’t much interest. Was it posted somewhere other than on the Pocket Watch forum.

It was back in the early pages of this thread.

noelekal · Dec 23, 2022

Y'all are mean!

Now I'm thinking I "need" older 19th century American, English, and European pocket watches to add to the menagerie here.

DaveK · Dec 23, 2022

Waltesefalcon
In keeping with the Illinois mood I've been in all week, I've been wearing my 1887 Model 2, Grade 5 since Monday. I just checked it against the atomic clock app I have and it seems to have lost 15 seconds since Monday, about 3 sec/ day, and well within railroad specs.

what’s the story with that interesting fob?

DaveK · Dec 23, 2022

Interesting RR item up for auction

Nashville Chattanooga & St. Louis Railway Unused Pocket Watch Loaner Card
https://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/142210117

Waltesefalcon · Dec 24, 2022

DaveK
what’s the story with that interesting fob?

It's a piece of elephant ivory my grandmother brought back from South Africa back in the 70s. She gifted it to me on my 16th birthday, it was attached to a key chain at the time. I didn't like carrying it in my pocket with my keys, so took it off, put a small 10k ring on it and decided to use it as a watch fob.

SOG53 · Dec 26, 2022

Waltham presentation box similar to one I posted, but I dont think the watch came in this box
@Canuck

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2850249139...lj_rHn1RIK&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

Canuck · Dec 26, 2022

SOG53
Waltham presentation box similar to one I posted, but I dont think the watch came in this box
@Canuck

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2850249139...lj_rHn1RIK&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

The presentation case is a “fitted” case, designed to accommodate a pocket watch. Notice the socket the watch fits into. Beyond that, I know of no way to determine whether the watch in the case was original to the case, or not. But it seems to fit quite well. Since we prefer pictures to links, here is the item in question. The presentation case appears to me to be period correct. However, the watch appears to me to be rather tired looking. Note the badly yellowed plastic crystal.

SOG53 · Dec 26, 2022

I don’t think the watch is a premier Vanguard I think it’s an earlier era watch.

Canuck
The presentation case is a “fitted” case, designed to accommodate a pocket watch. Notice the socket the watch fits into. Beyond that, I know of no way to determine whether the watch in the case was original to the case, or not. But it seems to fit quite well. Since we prefer pictures to links, here is the item in question. The presentation case appears to me to be period correct. However, the watch appears to me to be rather tired looking. Note the badly yellowed plastic crystal.

I think the watch is an earlier era not a premier Vanguard. But the box is nice if you happen to have a Premier Vanguard lying around.