A bit of help with 2 watches please.

OmegaRookie · Dec 28, 2019

Let me start this by saying, I know absolutely nothing about vintage watches. My 84 year old mother handed me an Avon plastic container full of watch parts that used to be either my grandfather’s or my great Uncle’s. There were 2 watches that when I wound them, they ran. The one is an Elgin which I’ve heard of and I see it’s Swiss made. The other is called a Commander and is made in the USA.
I was hoping someone could give me a guess on the age of them and a bit of history if possible.
Thanks,
Don

Canuck · Dec 28, 2019

Mikrolisk list seven watch companies that used the name Commander on watches. Among them, the Illinois Watch Co., Bulova, and Gruen. I’m going to take a flier on the Commander being by Gruen, and likely mid 1950s. We would know best if we could see what is in the case. Your Elgin might be late 1950s. There is a symbol beneath the Elgin name. That is the copyrighted symbol of the patented Elgin Durapower mainspring which I had thought was used only on U S made Elgin movements. This one being Swiss might indicate it was produced at about the time the U S factory was closing down. Again, we might be able to tell more if we could see what is inside the case.

OmegaRookie · Dec 29, 2019

Thanks for the help! I can open the Commander as it has a snap on case back. The Elgin has a threaded case back and I don’t have the tools for that. I’d just make a mess of it trying. I’ll get on it and post some pictures.

janice&fred · Dec 29, 2019

the commander looks like pure 40's to 50's snazz!

popping the back is relatively easy but bear in mind and be prepared as the movement and dial assembly is probably going to stay inside the case back when you do this. watch that you don't scrape the dial with the upper case half when popping it apart. some of these oldies of this style need a very gentle touch to finesse the movement out of the case back. once opened, try to pull the crown out to the time-setting position so as to gain a bit of "wiggle room" and then by slightly rocking the crown the movement will probably lift out of the case back. it has to basically be lifted out straight so if it's canted it will bind. be gentle and be prepared to be handling the bare movement and dial once you get it separated from the case back! 😀

OmegaRookie · Dec 29, 2019

janice&fred
the commander looks like pure 40's to 50's snazz!

popping the back is relatively easy but bear in mind and be prepared as the movement and dial assembly is probably going to stay inside the case back when you do this. watch that you don't scrape the dial with the upper case half when popping it apart. some of these oldies of this style need a very gentle touch to finesse the movement out of the case back. once opened, try to pull the crown out to the time-setting position so as to gain a bit of "wiggle room" and then by slightly rocking the crown the movement will probably lift out of the care back. it has to basically be lifted out straight so if it's canted it will bind. be gentle and be prepared to be handling the bare movement and dial once you get it separated from the case back! 😀

Thanks for the advice. I‘ll be very cautious.

OmegaRookie · Dec 29, 2019

Ok. I actually got the backs off of both of them as well as a Caravelle that was in the box that has no crystal but actually still runs. I’m sure it’s nothing special but I took it apart for the experience. My photos of the Commander movement are terrible. If no one recognizes it from my bad photos, I’ll take it apart again and re-take them. Here are my pictures of them.

Commander:

Elgin:

Caravelle:

Canuck · Dec 29, 2019

The Commander looks like a Gruen based on style. But I don’t recognize the movement as being Gruen. There were 6 other outfits that used the Commander name, so it could be one of those. The case was made by Pioneer which was not the name of a watch company.

The Elgin is definitely Swiss. The movement is a Swiss made Font. Calibre 28, not made by Elgin. A very common movement from the 1950s. See image from the Ranfft archive.

The Caravelle movement is a Japanese copy of the Eta 1080 movement. Bulova used this movement a lot in Caravelle and Arday brand watches. see image from the Ranfft archive.

FHF 28

Eta 1080

OmegaRookie · Dec 29, 2019

Canuck
The Commander looks like a Gruen based on style. But I don’t recognize the movement as being Gruen. There were 6 other outfits that used the Commander name, so it could be one of those. The case was made by Pioneer which was not the name of a watch company.

The Elgin is definitely Swiss. The movement is a Swiss made Font. Calibre 28, not made by Elgin. A very common movement from the 1950s. See image from the Ranfft archive.

The Caravelle movement is a Japanese copy of the Eta 1080 movement. Bulova used this movement a lot in Caravelle and Arday brand watches. see image from the Ranfft archive.

FHF 28

Eta 1080

Thanks again for your help!

A bit of help with 2 watches please.

OmegaRookie

Canuck

OmegaRookie

janice&fred

OmegaRookie

OmegaRookie

Canuck

OmegaRookie

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