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1980s Vintage Tudor Submariner Snowflake ref: 9411/0

A
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Hello,

I just won an auction for a Tudor Sub ref 9411/0. I have not received the item yet but I reviewed the details quite closely but then after winning the auction I noticed some details I missed.

Specifically, the 2 in 200 = 660ft is positioned above the S in Submariner. The t in ft is positioned in between the E and R in Submariner. Also the T's in T SWISS T under the 6 are positioned away from SWISS on both sides. In addition the O in Tudor is round. The = sign is positioned above A in Submariner which from research online indicates is correct.

When I compare these details with most of the 9411/0 references online, they are different. The 2 in 200 = 660ft is positioned above the U in Submariner and the t in ft is positioned above the E in Submariner. The O in Tudor seems to be an oval shape. The T's under the 6 seem to vary in position across the watches of that reference. Furthermore the numbers on the bezel of the watch I won seems to be different to the same in some of the same reference online. The movement checks out ok from the photos. I also did a search of the serial number and that came out ok as well.

There seems to be two to three different configurations especially with the T's below the 6, the 200 = 660ft and the O in Tudor. Does anyone know whether this is the case and can someone urgently help me to understand if what I won on auction is a fake or authentic.

Thanks in advance. I attach photos of the item I won on auction - the photos are from the listing.
Edited:
 
EDEA445E-4A3B-43A5-84A4-81B3E727F225.jpeg 3F363BAB-5C19-4C43-8BC3-DB3C0FEEBCCE.jpeg 0FF7CAED-B230-4D75-95D1-F2D27CD50DD3.jpeg 8992096C-896A-4D6B-8D1F-0B487ECAFBA5.jpeg
Dan S
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Calling @Linesiders. In the meantime, please post a high quality straight-on photo in good lighting. All the photos are weird.
 
Chris75
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I am very sorry but it's not original.

Case and insert aren't original either.
 
Chris75
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Yeah that's because they (very poorly) copied another watch's serial number.

Engravings are naively fake, so are insert, dial and movement.

It would be interesting to know who was the seller.

I really hope that you are going to have your money back.
 
Darlinboy
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It’s a bust… what auction platform or auction house did you use for the purchase?
 
Walrus
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Well gee that’s terrible to read. I bet you were quite happy to win. I know these things aren’t cheap either. Just a bummer all around. It’s very disappointing seeing these things happen. I went through it with a vintage GS fortunately the seller was not trying to pull a fast one and bought it himself thinking it was ok, he took it back with many apologies and no problems and we have had a watch nerd get together since then. I’m not comparing a vintage GS to your Tudor of course just saying I hope if things aren’t correct you can straighten it out without much fuss. Good luck.
 
A
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Chris75 Chris75
Yeah that's because they (very poorly) copied another watch's serial number.

Engravings are naively fake, so are insert, dial and movement.

It would be interesting to know who was the seller.

I really hope that you are going to have your money back.

I hope so too! Thank you appreciate your feedback and taking a look. The seller is on a platform based in Asia. It's like eBay but for that part of the world.
 
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Darlinboy Darlinboy
It’s a bust… what auction platform or auction house did you use for the purchase?

Thanks. The platform is Asian based. It's like eBay but for that part of the world.
 
A
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Walrus Walrus
Well gee that’s terrible to read. I bet you were quite happy to win. I know these things aren’t cheap either. Just a bummer all around. It’s very disappointing seeing these things happen. I went through it with a vintage GS fortunately the seller was not trying to pull a fast one and bought it himself thinking it was ok, he took it back with many apologies and no problems and we have had a watch nerd get together since then. I’m not comparing a vintage GS to your Tudor of course just saying I hope if things aren’t correct you can straighten it out without much fuss. Good luck.

Yes agreed it's unfortunate and a hassle - first time this had happened to me however. Thank you for your sympathies - hopefully will get e refund as I have informed the company managing the laptop.
 
A
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So unfortunately the policy of the company is that no returns or cancellations are accepted after the auction has ended. For info the auction site is Buyee.jp based in Japan and they're customer service and rules are quite obscure and strict. I transacted through PayPal with buyer protection so hopefully that will prevent me from losing my money.

I hope this post will help others avoid the same scenario.
Edited:
 
Darlinboy
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With PayPal, you have a good chance, and if you used a credit card through PayPal, that route can be pursued as well. Good luck with it!
 
A
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Darlinboy Darlinboy
With PayPal, you have a good chance, and if you used a credit card through PayPal, that route can be pursued as well. Good luck with it!

Thanks for the comfort. I used Paypal Credit as the method of payment not a credit card and the transaction is protected through the buyer protection program. Fingers crossed.
 
M
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I am Japanese and can read Japanese.
It was probably a Yahoo auction item, so I checked it out and found a sold item with the same photo.
The item description on the auction page said that the dial had been redialed.

In the product description, "[リダン]" means that the dial has been redialed in Japanese.
Edited:
 
vibe
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The movement is very obviously not a Tudor ETA. Look for a kif shock absorber or a triovis regulator. Sometimes there is an etachron regulator, but always a Kif.


A07D41F4-4408-4439-BF31-F9DE84F7EADC.jpeg 1FD92C36-AB11-4B67-99B8-FEDCF2801F8B.jpeg
 
A
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vibe vibe
The movement is very obviously not a Tudor ETA. Look for a kif shock absorber or a triovis regulator. Sometimes there is an etachron regulator, but always a Kif.


A07D41F4-4408-4439-BF31-F9DE84F7EADC.jpeg 1FD92C36-AB11-4B67-99B8-FEDCF2801F8B.jpeg
Thanks - appreciate the photos and good to know.
 
A
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M mountainunder
I am Japanese and can read Japanese.
It was probably a Yahoo auction item, so I checked it out and found a sold item with the same photo.
The item description on the auction page said that the dial had been redialed.

In the product description, "[リダン]" means that the dial has been redialed in Japanese.

Hi. Yes you are correct this was a yahoo auction item on Buyee. I purchased a few vintage Universal Geneve watches from Buyee over the last 6 months and there were no problems. It's a strange situation to be honest.

The key details of the watch aren't consistent with genuine examples of the same watch and it was stupid of me to rush the decision but I didn't think this would happen from a Japanese seller to be honest.
 
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