1963 or 64 Speedmaster help

heller792 · Mar 29, 2023

Davidt
Shame it’s gone as I assume the jeweller will charge an admin fee.m and you could have sent it direct to STS.

STS charge £550 for an 861 service, a 321 will be more (and actually may have to go to Switzerland now?).

Do not replace the bezel.
Try and not replace the hands.
Ask if the existing crystal can be polished and preserved but a replacement isn’t the end of the world.

In answer to your question, I wouldn’t spend £2k on a service as I think it can be done for around £500-800 depending on work/parts required.

The Jewler charged me £40 to have it sent off for a STS quote, that includes returning it to me without any work.

Davidt · Mar 29, 2023

Ah that’s not bad at all then.

I’d see what the estimate comes back like and go from there. STS are really good at discussing the various elements and working with you to converge on the best way forward.

watchyouwant · Mar 29, 2023

Whatever you do, call STS direct. And tell them, what you want. Don't argue, tell them what was said here. If they can not accommodate your, the owner's, wishes, have them send it back to the jeweller and collect it yourself. Many UK members will help you with the best possible outcome.

padders · Mar 29, 2023

I doubt STS will deal with you direct since it is not you who submitted the watch and therefore you are not the customer. Don't worry though, STS are a talented and reputable operation that I use myself regularly with no complaints. They wont change anything you don't want them to (unlike the official service facilities). Hopefully the jeweller will pass on the full customer copy of the quote so you get the full picture. Unless there are vintage parts being replaced I doubt it will be over a grand. Yes it will be worth it, unless you intend selling immediately in which case it wont. Be aware that the jeweller aren't being all that altruistic as they will probably get charged the trade rate and pass you the full retail quote so will likely make £200+ on the process.

heller792 · Mar 29, 2023

I emailed STS just as a chance, at least I have expressed my wishes, email below what was sent.

"Good Morning,

I recently took my late father in laws old speedmaster into my local jewlers to have it sent in for a quote to service, this was dispatched to you on Monday so should be with you now.

I am nervous about this watch as it has great importance to our family and I want to keep it in working condition and as original as possible, could I be kept up to date with any possible work that will be required and I am not sure if you do this but could you please bear in mind that I do not want anything replacing that would cause it to devalue?

There is a dent in the bezzel, this is because my father in law used to work as a civils engineer and as such he wore the watch every day, we would not like the bezzle replaced if possible

Could we have the cyrystal cleaned and not replaced?

The fingers are suffering with decay, could these be treated and the decay stopped or would they need to be replaced?

We would like all the movment parts serviced as normal please.

The following is what has been reccomented to me by a collector,
"Movement: yes, a service. Case: leave as is, just clean the dirt and grime. Dial and hands: if possible, don't let them touch them. If they can, have them stabilize the existing Lume from behind, but keep the Lume. It blends perfectly in with the rest . Everything, that looks like new, destroy's the value for a collector later.
Crystal: keep the one and have it polished. For the time being: tell them to keep the crown and pushers as is. If they offer to replace the rubber seals inside the existing crown and pushers: yes. Otherwise, keep as is. And then : Wear it."

Wile I understand that I should of sent it directly to you and I am not your customer, my jewlers are I just wanted to express my wishes as the end user of the watch. I have attached a picture of the watch and my recipt from the jewlers for proof of ownership.

Many thanks,
Dave

hansaboy · Mar 29, 2023

H heller792
The Jewler charged me £40 to have it sent off for a STS quote, that includes returning it to me without any work.

You could let the Forum know about the outcome, and then take it from there?

There are other watchmakers in UK that are skilled with your typ of watch...😀

Spacefruit · Mar 29, 2023

You could just send it to Simon Freese who has been sympathetically restoring speedmasters like this for years.
simonfreesewatchmakers.com

he used to run the workshop at STS

heller792 · Mar 29, 2023

Spacefruit
You could just send it to Simon Freese who has been sympathetically restoring speedmasters like this for years.
simonfreesewatchmakers.com

he used to run the workshop at STS

I think that's the plan, I only became aware of Simon lastnight, I have emailed him. It had already been sent off to STS before I was aware of him.

Dan S · Mar 29, 2023

H heller792
Hi, just a little update, I returned to the jewlers today to see if the watch was still with them as I wanted to get some more pictures, turns out it was dispatched to sts on Monday. However, the jewlers had taken about 40 pics of the watch which he showed me, in his opinion they are all original parts except the strap obviously. Here are some points raised,
1, He thinks the fingers wont be able to be saved (obviously he is not an expert and that was his opinion), there is a hole in the tachymeter finger.
2, The bezel has quite a dent in it, I like it and it tells the story of how the watch was used everyday while digging holes. The jewler said that sts may say that it must be replaced to warrently their work.
3, He said as standard sts will replace the crystal, is this true in everyones opinion.
4, STS will prob cost me between £1000 and £2000, could I ask if it was your find would you be willing to spend that kind of money on this watch please?

I am really excited about this and having watch become a wearable item again, what strap would you put with it? It has a smaller face than newer models so not sure the big metal strap would fit the or match the watch.

Many thanks,
Dave

You are not getting good information or advice from your jeweler, they are not treating your watch like the vintage collectible that it is. I seriously doubt that the jeweler is qualified to determine whether the parts are original, especially the crown and pushers. You need to post good photos of crown/pushers on the forum, this is probably the major unresolved issue and will impact your decision.

The sweep hand (not finger) can be re-lumed if you would prefer that to the hole, as I mentioned on watchuseek. I would definitely not have it or any of the hands replaced. That's terrible advice.

I would also not have the bezel replaced, a new service bezel would be a waste of money.

If STS requires replacing hands and/or bezel, just have them return it and send the watch to Simon Freese directly. In fact, why not just do that right now. The idea that you will have to communicate indirectly through your jeweler is a total dealbreaker.

Regarding your email to STS, respectfully, I think it's somewhat TLDR and a bit confused with incorrect terminology. If I were reading that at STS, I'm really not sure what I would make of it. It would be best to slow down, gather your thoughts and compose something clear, concise, and accurate.

heller792 · Mar 29, 2023

Dan S
You are not getting good information or advice from your jeweler, they are not treating your watch like the vintage collectible that it is. I seriously doubt that the jeweler is qualified to determine whether the parts are original, especially the crown and pushers. You need to post good photos of crown/pushers on the forum, this is probably the major unresolved issue and will impact your decision.

The sweep hand (not finger) can be re-lumed if you would prefer that to the hole, as I mentioned on watchuseek. I would definitely not have it or any of the hands replaced. That's terrible advice.

I would also not have the bezel replaced, a new service bezel would be a waste of money.

If STS requires replacing hands and/or bezel, just have them return it and send the watch to Simon Freese directly. In fact, why not just do that right now. The idea that you will have to communicate indirectly through your jeweler is a total dealbreaker.

Regarding your email to STS, respectfully, I think it's somewhat TLDR and a bit confused with incorrect terminology. If I were reading that at STS, I'm really not sure what I would make of it. It would be best to slow down, gather your thoughts and compose something clear, concise, and accurate.

You are right Dan, I need to get the watch to Simon but STS have it now so I will at least let them send me a quote prior to having it returned.

Tubber · Mar 29, 2023

Davidt
Shame it’s gone as I assume the jeweller will charge an admin fee.m and you could have sent it direct to STS.

STS charge £550 for an 861 service, a 321 will be more (and actually may have to go to Switzerland now?).

Do not replace the bezel.
Try and not replace the hands.
Ask if the existing crystal can be polished and preserved but a replacement isn’t the end of the world.

In answer to your question, I wouldn’t spend £2k on a service as I think it can be done for around £500-800 depending on work/parts required.

Part of the reply I received from STS regarding service of a Cal. 321.
"Unfortunately, this particular watch would need to be sent to Omega for the repair requested because it is a reserve calibre and certified Omega Service Centres such as Swiss Time Services Ltd are no longer able to maintain these watches."
I sent it to Simon Freese instead who has been mentioned in this thread already.

Davidt · Mar 29, 2023

Don’t be too hasty. Simon would do a great job, but STS are perfectly capable of doing an equally good job.

I’ve got a watch with Simon now (in fact I’m hoping it’s coming back this week) and I’ve had watches with STS in the last few months. Both places are great. I’d see what kind of estimate you get from STS and what work is mandatory. If things like the hands and bezel are mandatory (I’d be very surprised) then getting it back and going to Simon may be the best bet. Equally if it has to go to Switzerland I’d get it back and go to Simon.

if on the other hand STS are happy to retain the hands, bezel etc and their sister company SwissTec can service it, I’d have no concerns leaving it with them. Like I say, both STS and Simon are great at what they do. You don’t have to rush into a decision today.

watchyouwant · Mar 29, 2023

You know now. Get the Quote from STS. No matter what they state, get it back. No rush, you have not looked at it for 20 years. Just follow the advise, you get here . Many members here know more about Omega details than any jeweller, repairer, any Auction house , self appointed Specialists and some strange Influencers. Your uninteresting Aschenputtl turned out to be a Prince and you might get nervous about it's value. But it's still a Tool watch. Less changes are more in Collectors circles. So, slow down , listen and get it right the first time. And whatever will happen in the future, never tell anybody what it's worth.

heller792 · Mar 29, 2023

watchyouwant
You know now. Get the Quote from STS. No matter what they state, get it back. No rush, you have not looked at it for 20 years. Just follow the advise, you get here . Many members here know more about Omega details than any jeweller, repairer, any Auction house , self appointed Specialists and some strange Influencers. Your uninteresting Aschenputtl turned out to be a Prince and you might get nervous about it's value. But it's still a Tool watch. Less changes are more in Collectors circles. So, slow down , listen and get it right the first time. And whatever will happen in the future, never tell anybody what it's worth.

Thanks, you are right! I keep and grow corals for a hobby and every thing I learned came from forums, these are the best places to find good people with amazing knowledge, a tool i would not be without. I will update this thread when I have the quote from STS and hopefully the well informed people on here will have some suggestions for me.

Kind regards,
Dave

heller792 · Apr 9, 2023

While I am still waiting for STS to get back to me I found a pic I took of the watch which I had forgot about, as you can see, its seen better days

Davidt · Apr 9, 2023

You’ll be surprised how nice that will looks with a good deep clean and a polished/new crystal.

Speak to STS about hand choices. If the paint is flaking, getting the repainted in off white and resumes to match the dial might be the best option.

joe band · Apr 9, 2023

am i the only one who was thinking how cool it would've been for your son to wear his grandfather's vintage speedy to prom?

best wishes for a happy outcome

heller792 · Apr 9, 2023

J joe band
am i the only one who was thinking how cool it would've been for your son to wear his grandfather's vintage speedy to prom?

best wishes for a happy outcome

I do agree but unfortunately it's now been sent to STS and I don't think it will be back in time, prob is imagine if he lost it how upsetting it would be.

nonuffinkbloke · Apr 10, 2023

Spacefruit
You could just send it to Simon Freese who has been sympathetically restoring speedmasters like this for years.
simonfreesewatchmakers.com

he used to run the workshop at STS

Well I will definitely be taking mine to Simon again. I've left it in his capable hands twice now and am very happy with his work.

Re STS: I recently phoned Swiss Time Services to enquire about their service prices for an Omega Speedmaster 105.012-65. They told me they were no longer servicing vintage Omega Speedmasters, with a 321 movement, in the UK. They said my watch would need to be sent to Omega in Switzerland. That was a fairly recent phone call.

Arancio601 · Apr 10, 2023

nonuffinkbloke
Well I will definitely be taking mine to Simon again. I've left it in his capable hands twice now and am very happy with his work.

Re STS: I recently phoned Swiss Time Services to enquire about their service prices for an Omega Speedmaster 105.012-65. They told me they were no longer servicing vintage Omega Speedmasters, with a 321 movement, in the UK. They said my watch would need to be sent to Omega in Switzerland. That was a fairly recent phone call.

Did they say why? Too time consuming? No parts account?

1963 or 64 Speedmaster help

heller792

Davidt

watchyouwant

padders

heller792

hansaboy

Spacefruit

heller792

Dan S

heller792

Tubber

Davidt

watchyouwant

heller792

heller792

Davidt

joe band

heller792

nonuffinkbloke

Arancio601

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