Your opinions on a 68 Transitional please

blubarb · Sep 3, 2015

[QUOTE="...Seems there isn't a way to verify if the T SM T is present or not at this point, so I'd be taking a leap of faith there, but I also seem to have hit an impasse with the seller as well. He does seem to have a steady history as a seller on WUS and eBay but doesn't take PayPal. I'm waiting to see if he will take a credit card, but I'm a little weary of doing a wire transfer from the USA to Romania...[/QUOTE]

As I would be and quite rightly so. Not wanting to just throw a wet towel, but you are highly exposed as a buyer without PayPal and unless he is a business I can't see how he can accept a CC, but there maybe a way of doing so that I am not aware of. To be honest, and cynical (sorry) but I don't know if Romania is one of those places that breeds confidence.

gophishin · Sep 3, 2015

I'll have to go back and review the thread regarding forms of payment from a few weeks ago, but how safe is it to pay with CC? It seems that it would probably be second best after PayPal, and I think the seller has a watch dealing business in Romania, since he is now reluctantly willing to accept a CC.

blubarb · Sep 3, 2015

gophishin
I'll have to go back and review the thread regarding forms of payment from a few weeks ago, but how safe is it to pay with CC? It seems that it would probably be second best after PayPal, and I think the seller has a watch dealing business in Romania, since he is now reluctantly willing to accept a CC.

Probably, I suspect, because that exposes the seller to charge back? As far as I know, it is not possible to use a CC with a non merchant. I am only hypothesising but I don't believe this watch will be costing you chump change, my detectors are tingling, but then I am known to be hyper sensitive to handing over money. 😀

As always the battle between the spirit and the flesh rages on. ;-)

I just don't think you can use a CC with a non merchant seller. I am not certain, but most CC companies offer some kind of charge back but best to find out the banks rules and policy and if/how it would apply to this kind of transaction.

blubarb · Sep 3, 2015

Direct bank deposits to Romania probably deserves a new thread on its own.

gophishin · Sep 3, 2015

I agree, he sounds like he will take CC now, I do believe he runs a legit watch dealing business, or at least it seems that way based on the research and digging I have done.

Now, I'm just trying to figure out how "safe" a CC transaction will be.

blubarb · Sep 3, 2015

That's probably best discussed with your CC company. I know that CC that allow for charge back are a sellers biggest concern outside of a PayPal dispute. But check your rights and duties with the CC company as different cc companies vary in policy. I aim to double my protection by buying with a CC through PayPal. I override Paypal's payment ranking system which puts their business account first, followed by your cheque/banking account. Just in case. Still, nothing's 100% fool proof when not dealing with OF members. ;-)

I meant to add that there are some countries they won't even consider charge back with due to no cross border bank arrangements.

gophishin · Sep 3, 2015

TNTwatch
The bezel alignment is nothing to worried about but the movement is a bigger concern financially. Swiss Made may have been worn out or scrubbed away by previous incorrect rehaut as this one doesn't appear to cover anywhere close to the hour/minute markers. Better pictures may verify it.

(I've seen this watch somewhere but can't recall at the moment.)

After studying the seller's photos, I think I agree with you. It would seem you should at least be able to see the top of that text. Now trying to determine how big of a detractor this is from the value.

Spacefruit · Sep 3, 2015

gophishin
After studying the seller's photos, I think I agree with you. It would seem you should at least be able to see the top of that text. Now trying to determine how big of a detractor this is from the value.

Well huge.

A transitional dial is the heart of the value - I suppose $1000?

gophishin · Sep 3, 2015

Thank you all for the input and help! I'm going to pass on this, the missing Swiss Made was the deal breaker, but if anyone is willing to take the risk you can find it here, http://forums.watchuseek.com/f29/fs...fessional-145-022-68st-cal-861-a-2320490.html. Just please let me get first dibs if it turns out to be good!

I am still intrigued by the few comments I received regarding service. I know it's understood to factor in service anytime when buying vintage, especially in this condition, and I would see to it being done properly, but were there any flags on this particular movement, or were you just making the comment in general?

Again, I appreciate that I'm able to learn something from all of you, and it will serve to better arm me for future opportunities, thanks!

blubarb · Sep 3, 2015

I think the comments when taken collectively by those who have greater knowledge of these things were only leading in one direction.

oddboy · Sep 3, 2015

In my humble experience, I there's a difference between a simple service and and potential rebuild. A watch in rough shape may need to be substantially rebuilt which requires a watchmaker with access to parts, and will cost more.

If the movement is in decent shape, it may just need clean, regulation, maybe a main spring or other commonly available parts like pushers, winding stem, crystal.

In the case of this watch, it's probably more the former case, hence the need to send it to STS or equivalent rather than the watchmaker down t street - who may be competent, but can't get all the parts they may need.

TNTwatch · Sep 3, 2015

gophishin
Thank you all for the input and help! I'm going to pass on this, the missing Swiss Made was the deal breaker, but if anyone is willing to take the risk you can find it here, http://forums.watchuseek.com/f29/fs...fessional-145-022-68st-cal-861-a-2320490.html. Just please let me get first dibs if it turns out to be good!

I am still intrigued by the few comments I received regarding service. I know it's understood to factor in service anytime when buying vintage, especially in this condition, and I would see to it being done properly, but were there any flags on this particular movement, or were you just making the comment in general?

Again, I appreciate that I'm able to learn something from all of you, and it will serve to better arm me for future opportunities, thanks!

The general appearance indicates a hard life for this watch. Add to that the rusty pushers and non-resetting hour recorder, I'd pray pivots are just slightly worn out. No Swiss Made on dial and apparently a couple of damage spots next to the 12 hour marker are the biggest detractor. But price seems low enough for someone on the hunt. Been on the market for a couple of months already.

alphasquare · Sep 4, 2015

I almost bought this watch. Seller sent the PayPal invoice, I was about to pay when I asked one last question about the missing T SWISS MADE T. The next day he cancelled the invoice and didn't reply to any of my messages.

Esmarch · Sep 4, 2015

Not that it matters much by now, but I don't think the chrono hand is correct either - lume looks way too green to be a '68..

TNTwatch · Sep 4, 2015

alphasquare
I almost bought this watch. Seller sent the PayPal invoice, I was about to pay when I asked one last question about the missing T SWISS MADE T. The next day he cancelled the invoice and didn't reply to any of my messages.

Seems like when price was close to too good to be true, you were not supposed to ask that many questions...😉

alphasquare · Sep 4, 2015

The seller actually made a thread about the dial

https://omegaforums.net/threads/help-identify-this-speedy.26789/

gophishin · Sep 4, 2015

oddboy
In my humble experience, I there's a difference between a simple service and and potential rebuild. A watch in rough shape may need to be substantially rebuilt which requires a watchmaker with access to parts, and will cost more.

If the movement is in decent shape, it may just need clean, regulation, maybe a main spring or other commonly available parts like pushers, winding stem, crystal.

In the case of this watch, it's probably more the former case, hence the need to send it to STS or equivalent rather than the watchmaker down t street - who may be competent, but can't get all the parts they may need.

Understood, and thank you all again for the replies and information. For future knowledge, was it just the numerous little things that tip off this inclination? To my untrained eye the movement looks fairly clean, but I guess there were enough (not singularly deal breaking) little flaws that it should have added up to bring me to this conclusion. Lesson learned, and at no cost to me. Thanks chaps!

@alphasquare it's interesting that the seller sent you an PP invoice, when was that? He was very adamant with me that he will not use PP. He did eventually agree to accept a CC, reluctantly, but the whole thing seemed odd.

Spacefruit · Sep 4, 2015

Why does it need a service?

For the most part, all new aquisitions do.
The dial, hands and movement show signs of ingress. While this may be old, I would prefer to be sure.
The chronograph hour recorder does not reset to zero.
The crystal, as well as the watch, looks freshly worn. (If that makes sense)
The screws show signs of being worked on, so someone has been in there, someone not as careful as I would want inside my watch.

It is true that many people buy watches and don't service them, using them quite happily.

If they are lucky, they won't need to touch it before they tire of it and sell it.

alphasquare · Sep 4, 2015

gophishin
Understood, and thank you all again for the replies and information. For future knowledge, was it just the numerous little things that tip off this inclination? To my untrained eye the movement looks fairly clean, but I guess there were enough (not singularly deal breaking) little flaws that it should have added up to bring me to this conclusion. Lesson learned, and at no cost to me. Thanks chaps!

@alphasquare it's interesting that the seller sent you an PP invoice, when was that? He was very adamant with me that he will not use PP. He did eventually agree to accept a CC, reluctantly, but the whole thing seemed odd.

Invoice was sent on July 13th, cancelled the same day. He later deleted the FS thread on WUS. I don't know why he backed out. Seems like a legit seller though.

gophishin · Sep 4, 2015

Spacefruit
Why does it need a service?

For the most part, all new aquisitions do.
The dial, hands and movement show signs of ingress. While this may be old, I would prefer to be sure.
The chronograph hour recorder does not reset to zero.
The crystal, as well as the watch, looks freshly worn. (If that makes sense)
The screws show signs of being worked on, so someone has been in there, someone not as careful as I would want inside my watch.

It is true that many people buy watches and don't service them, using them quite happily.

If they are lucky, they won't need to touch it before they tire of it and sell it.

Sorry, I should have been more specific. I factor in the need for service with every acquisition, I was asking more in reference to the tells of needing a basic "service" (clean/regulation) vs an entire rebuild with many parts replaced, as oddboy mentioned. So it seems if the watch is in overall very clean condition and seems well cared for you can hope that it's the basic clean/regulation type service. And that in the case of this watch, there were enough signs of wear and things being "off" that I should be thinking more along the lines of a full rebuild/more comprehensive service that will likely require parts and need to be sent off to the pros.

Your opinions on a 68 Transitional please

blubarb

gophishin

blubarb

blubarb

gophishin

blubarb

gophishin

Spacefruit

gophishin

blubarb

oddboy

TNTwatch

alphasquare

Esmarch

TNTwatch

alphasquare

gophishin

Spacefruit

alphasquare

gophishin

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