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Wouldn't it be cool if Omega re-released exact reproductions of all their trilogy watches?

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bananapeanut bananapeanut
I'm not sure the analogy between watches and bikes works all that well.

Modern bikes offer better performance but their frames have a limited lifespan. The steel frames of vintage bikes can last forever. The only downside is weight.

When it comes to watches. I'm pretty sure a modern Omega is just as durable as a vintage one.

As an avid cyclist not trying to correct you but... nearly every modern bike manufacturer is still offering steel frames. And fortunately at that as well because they last longer, are repairable and offer a better ride over long miles than carbon.
 
rudagger
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bananapeanut bananapeanut
I'm not sure the analogy between watches and bikes works all that well.

Modern bikes offer better performance but their frames have a limited lifespan. The steel frames of vintage bikes can last forever. The only downside is weight.

When it comes to watches. I'm pretty sure a modern Omega is just as durable as a vintage one.

Not to digress too much, but my understanding is that for almost all users, aluminium and carbon fibre bike frames will last a "lifetime" of use. For a pro, putting on 10,000-20,000 km, that may not be the case.

Physically, the big difference I have seen over the years is steel is much sturdier. I had seen so many dented AL frames and gouged carbon frames when looking used.

So upon reflection, maybe the analogy is that a newer watch is sturdier and can withstand more (shock, magnetism, water).
 
rudagger
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As an avid cyclist not trying to correct you but... nearly every modern bike manufacturer is still offering steel frames. And fortunately at that as well because they last longer, are repairable and offer a better ride over long miles than carbon.
No, feel free to correct me! You got me thinking .. I don't see steel frames from big names like Specialized and Cannondale, but upon reflection Trek does have a steel touring bike.
 
bananapeanut
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rudagger rudagger
No, feel free to correct me! You got me thinking .. I don't see steel frames from big names like Specialized and Cannondale, but upon reflection Trek does have a steel touring bike.

My impression is that steel mountain bikes are a thing of the past. BMX are still pretty much all steel. Touring can be steel. Basically, if you need strength and extreme endurance, steel is the way to go. If you need speed, nothing is lighter than carbon. Titanium was experimental. As for aluminum, it is now just for cheap bikes. Also one thing I love about steel frames is that the tubes are thinner, which makes it more comfortable when you are striding the bike with both feet on the ground.
 
THFan346
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As an avid cyclist not trying to correct you but... nearly every modern bike manufacturer is still offering steel frames. And fortunately at that as well because they last longer, are repairable and offer a better ride over long miles than carbon.
Also not wanting to come across in a negative manner, but that is a sweeping statement that is factually incorrect. You simply cannot say that ALL steel frames last longer and offer a better ride comfort over longer rides. It totally depends on what the frame was actually designed for.

There are a large number of endurance carbon frames that are superb over longer distances, some with tech within the composition that are more comfortable than even the best steel frames. Equally, there are steel frames that are very poor over longer distances as that wasn’t what they were designed for. Furthermore, carbon frames are not irreparable, despite what people seem to assume and continue to tell others.

As for bikes not lasting for Pro’s that’s because the sponsored brands replace the bikes every year for the top teams and nobody is encouraged to look after them other than to keep them on the road for the length of the event or until they are close enough to replace.
 
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THFan346 bpsmith
Also not wanting to come across in a negative manner, but that is a sweeping statement that is factually incorrect. You simply cannot say that ALL steel frames last longer and offer a better ride comfort over longer rides. It totally depends on what the frame was actually designed for.

There are a large number of endurance carbon frames that are superb over longer distances, some with tech within the composition that are more comfortable than even the best steel frames. Equally, there are steel frames that are very poor over longer distances as that wasn’t what they were designed for. Furthermore, carbon frames are not irreparable, despite what people seem to assume and continue to tell others.

As for bikes not lasting for Pro’s that’s because the sponsored brands replace the bikes every year for the top teams and nobody is encouraged to look after them other than to keep them on the road for the length of the event or until they are close enough to replace.

Again, no bummer energy intended...

1. I never said *all* steel frames last longer - because a poorly brazed steel frame wouldn't - but I did say steel frames last longer ~ because they do.
As a material under load steel and in general (after all there is a reason steel is used in, say, skyscrapers and not carbon) will outlast carbon as carbon degrades not only under UV light but significantly under, what would best be categorized as incidental stresses ~~ road debris dings/chips/dents/etc. Steel, for the most part, is unaffected by this.
And yes, while carbon is repairable - some carbon not all - all steel is repairable... and as most people in the bike biz (or biz of bike) would say, "Do you really want your plastic frame repaired, in particular something as critical as the fork, or do you want it replaced?"
Finally: fatigue... I'll assume you know how brutal a carbon failure is versus the "heads up" warning signs of steel.

2. Outside of weight savings and tech I personally have met no cyclist who, if they have nothing beyond experience and honesty invested in the statement (ie: nothing to gain or lose by saying it), hasn't said or admitted that carbon pales to steel in comfort. Comfort meaning ~ flex, torsion, planing, "kick" at the rear triangle through the bottom bracket when pedaling hard out of the saddle while climbing.

For a racing cyclist, just like in F1, carbon makes a lot of sense for the weight savings. It makes even greater sense if the person doing that racing is sponsored.
 
THFan346
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Again, no bummer energy intended...

1. I never said *all* steel frames last longer - because a poorly brazed steel frame wouldn't - but I did say steel frames last longer ~ because they do.
As a material under load steel and in general (after all there is a reason steel is used in, say, skyscrapers and not carbon) will outlast carbon as carbon degrades not only under UV light but significantly under, what would best be categorized as incidental stresses ~~ road debris dings/chips/dents/etc. Steel, for the most part, is unaffected by this.
And yes, while carbon is repairable - some carbon not all - all steel is repairable... and as most people in the bike biz (or biz of bike) would say, "Do you really want your plastic frame repaired, in particular something as critical as the fork, or do you want it replaced?"
Finally: fatigue... I'll assume you know how brutal a carbon failure is versus the "heads up" warning signs of steel.

2. Outside of weight savings and tech I personally have met no cyclist who, if they have nothing beyond experience and honesty invested in the statement (ie: nothing to gain or lose by saying it), hasn't said or admitted that carbon pales to steel in comfort. Comfort meaning ~ flex, torsion, planing, "kick" at the rear triangle through the bottom bracket when pedaling hard out of the saddle while climbing.

For a racing cyclist, just like in F1, carbon makes a lot of sense for the weight savings. It makes even greater sense if the person doing that racing is sponsored.
Discussion is all good. In fairness, you didn’t categorically say all steel frames last longer, but it was certainly heavily implied.

How many people do you know whose carbon frame is no longer rideable as it’s been UV damaged? How many have you seen that’s showing any signs of UV damage under normal use and storage? On the flip side how many steel frames do you regularly see corroded?

I hear you on the risk of a shattered carbon frame, in the absolute worst of circumstances, but it’s extremely rare. The type of accident where I wouldn’t ride the bike again, irrespective of the frame material.

I also hear you on the marketing element too.

My favourite response has to be when people call carbon “plastic”, as if that cheapens it somehow. Can’t remember the last time anybody refused to go on holiday as their plane has plastic wings, which of course forms a major part of the construction. 😀

We could spend all day selling our chosen material or rubbishing the other options, but there’s clearly good and bad in all options.

I have a few carbon frames and love their ride. My favourite bike happens to be titanium though, famed for its all day comfort, but it’s a racy geometry and has carbon components and wheels. 😀

There are no doubt countless carbon frames that are more comfortable. Steel for that matter too, obviously…
Edited:
 
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THFan346 bpsmith
How many people do you know whose carbon frame is no longer rideable as it’s been UV damaged? How many have you seen that’s showing any signs of UV damage under normal use and storage? On the flip side how many steel frames do you regularly see corroded?
Actually quite a few... I live in the Desert SW. UV eats much here.
Steel: very few ~ because outside of DUI Cyclists and Big Box Purchasers - folks who don't give a shit about their bicycle - those that I know who love/ride their steel bikes also maintain them with touch-up paint for the exterior and TI Framesaver for the insides of the tubes.

My favourite bike happens to be titanium though, famed for its all day comfort, but it’s a racy geometry and has carbon components and wheels. 😀

I hear ya there brother... currently having a Ti custom frameset built by arguably The Guru of MTB Ti frames - James Bleakley founder/owner of Blacksheep Bikes in Colorado.

Screenshot_20221104-233116_Instagram.jpg IMG_20221104_222627.jpg
 
THFan346
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Actually quite a few... I live in the Desert SW. UV eats much here.
Steel: very few ~ because outside of DUI Cyclists and Big Box Purchasers - folks who don't give a shit about their bicycle - those that I know who love/ride their steel bikes also maintain them with touch-up paint for the exterior and TI Framesaver for the insides of the tubes.



I hear ya there brother... currently having a Ti custom frameset built by arguably The Guru of MTB Ti frames - James Bleakley founder/owner of Blacksheep Bikes in Colorado.
Fair enough. I live in damp Wales, UK. Weather capable of UV damage is rather minimal. On the flip side, corrosion to Steel is far more prevalent.

Blacksheep Bikes are meant to be epic. Not ridden one, but heard good things. Mine is a Van Nicholas, who used to be called Airborne.

Carbon bikes are by Bianchi and Ridley, the latter built and tested for use on Cobbles in Belgium. Pretty robust as a result, but still ultra light.
 
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@bpsmith yeah I lived in Portland Oregon for a decade, and besides the abject depression and pending alcoholism brought on by the shitty weather... 10 months of rain stop gapped by 60 glorious days of Summer - as close to the UK weather wise as an American can get (at least according to all the Brits residing there) -- almost everyone I rode with rode steel (or Ti) and really had no issues with their whips as long as maintenance was attended to every couple years... which really isn't a bother compared to the normal maintenance required when riding a bicycle 10-15k per year.
 
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THFan346 bpsmith
Fair enough. I live in damp Wales, UK. Weather capable of UV damage is rather minimal. On the flip side, corrosion to Steel is far more prevalent.

Blacksheep Bikes are meant to be epic. Not ridden one, but heard good things. Mine is a Van Nicholas, who used to be called Airborne.

Carbon bikes are by Bianchi and Ridley, the latter built and tested for use on Cobbles in Belgium. Pretty robust as a result, but still ultra light.

I have such a soft spot for Bianchi... probably my favorite brand. Oddly, I've never owned one!
 
THFan346
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I have such a soft spot for Bianchi... probably my favorite brand. Oddly, I've never owned one!
My Bianchi was one of my earlier purchases. Mid range so not that exotic, but still a great ride. Ironically, it was involved in a road rage incident where I was followed by a dodgy car driver and words were had. End result was the guy driving over the rear of the bike. Carbon frame was tested and is intact. Aluminium wheel obliterated.
 
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THFan346 bpsmith
My Bianchi was one of my earlier purchases. Mid range so not that exotic, but still a great ride. Ironically, it was involved in a road rage incident where I was followed by a dodgy car driver and words were had. End result was the guy driving over the rear of the bike. Carbon frame was tested and is intact. Aluminium wheel obliterated.

Good to know motorists are morons across the Pond too.
So many incidents here I've lost count.
 
THFan346
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Good to know motorists are morons across the Pond too.
So many incidents here I've lost count.
Tapped “Like” on that post, but like isn’t exactly the best of words given the circumstances.

Anyway, gone way off topic now. I think my point is, we should move with the times and make modern watches with old school materials and old school watches with modern materials, just to keep it all interesting. There is clearly space for homage pieces but the thought of releasing brand new versions of vintages watches exactly the same as they were when originally released just feels all shades of wrong for me.
 
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gbesq gbesq
There is certainly something to be said for heritage models with modern technology, but in my view they will never have the cache and the collectible value of the originals. I don’t have any of the original trilogy models (I wish!), but I do have an original and nearly mint 1958 Ranchero a/k/a “The Fourth Musketeer” in my collection and it is arguably the rarest of the four. Could a modern heritage piece ever take its place in my mind? Absolutely no way.
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AGREE 100%....A non-radioactive manual wound version of the Ranchero would be my dream come true.....as per this silly post from me a while back: https://omegaforums.net/threads/suggestion-for-omega-ranchero-reissue.131134/#post-2050904
 
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