Watchfid..... Marketing of Military Speedmasters....

watchyouwant · Feb 10, 2021

I'm getting annoyed now with that sales practice from very knowledgeable People.... " Sold to the US Forces.....Rhodesian Army..... " And more. They did so much research and now these misleading labels in the watches for sale section . Misleading for new collectors to spruik a higher price for something, that is not there. They know, that the Only ever issued military omega speedmaster is for the FAP. Documented accordingly. Everything else is speculation and private purchases from duty free NAAFI / Military stores worldwide. The fact, that a soldier buys an Omega Speedmaster duty free during his service does not make it a military Speedmaster. Misleading. Nothing special. Why would you label a Remington Razor, bought there duty free, a military Razor? Kind regards. Achim

JimInOz · Feb 10, 2021

I served in the military from the day after I turned 17, and I have a few Speedmasters I may sell one day.

Are you saying that I can't sell one of them as a "Military Speedmaster"?

😉

SpeedyPhill · Feb 10, 2021

Same here, well it depends if an officer/NCO/soldier wore those during his career, for instance a watch worn by a pilot or a diver (e.g. the recent Rolex Submariner in ARS) ... but most people want a story in " Operations "... in a warzone (Vietnam, Falklands, etc...) 👎
There's a lot to say about " military watches ", as these toolwatches were roughly used in difficult circumstances to say the least...
On the other hand, for instance because of uniformity, in some countries officers were issued wristwatches to be used during NATO TacEval so evaluators couldn't deduct % points for that reason, but the officers had to return the watches to the N4/S4 after each week-long TacEval 😁
Most people have an interesting story about their wristwatch
I have an Omega Speedmaster which I wore while walking on the large NASA DSN antennas in Tidbinbilla - Australia, Robledo de chavela - Spain, Goldstone - USA... special for me, but for others the question what the radio environment did to the watch 🤔
I can assure nothing as such influence because most radio-astronomy sites have these kinds of signs:
.

.
That being said, most colleagues I know, don't understand the fascination of civilians with military watches... well it might be the same with us spaceflight fans' fascination with wristwatch-models used by spacefarers, and even more with actual wristwatches worn in space !

tamura · Feb 10, 2021

If a Speedmaster (or any other Omega) is a military watch,is a good reason for me, that I do not want to have it!

SpeedyPhill · Feb 10, 2021

That's the other side of the story 😉

SpeedyPhill · Feb 10, 2021

e.g. These are clearly military watches, with military purchase history on military contracts, service history... Tudor for the French Navy
.

Franco · Feb 10, 2021

Ciao Achim (keeps autocorrecting)

I see your point, and it is irritating indeed.

It all depends on the pleasure that a civilian may have in owning a piece which has seen battle. If acquiring it entails a higher cost, the buyer should ascertain if that pleasure justifies the higher price. Military Remington = no extra pleasure. Seamaster 300 bought at a military base shop = no extra pleasure. Seamaster bought in a shop and then gone to war at my dad’s wrist = extra pleasure. Seamaster 300 issued and marked to the MOD =. Some extra pleasure. Pleasure varies between people, and also how pleasure converts to will to pay.

Nobody believes anyway what sellers say, unless there is evidence.

SpeedyPhill · Feb 10, 2021

Anyway, the Rhodesian Air Force history is an interesting story to say the least...
.
https://www.watchbooksonly.com/articles/watch-stories/the-rhodesian-air-force-omega-watches/

Shabbaz · Feb 10, 2021

Why would somebody have more pleasure in owning a piece that has seen battle? It looks to me a bid sad if you really want this. Especially if your own best war performance is changing your kid's diaper... I understand the fact it's nice to wear a watch with fantastic provenance. But is war really the best provenance?

Well, bring out the gold watch scene from Pulp Fiction...

watchyouwant · Feb 10, 2021

SpeedyPhill
Anyway, the Rhodesian Air Force history is an interesting story to say the least...
.
https://www.watchbooksonly.com/articles/watch-stories/the-rhodesian-air-force-omega-watches/

Yes, the Omega 1953 is well documented and follows the UK MoD nomenclature in marking them. Maybe except for the tale of the center second hand , which might be a red herring.... Regarding the Speedmasters: it gets murky here....Rhodesia independence was 1970. From that day on, British nomenclature in marking was history. Therefore the shown Speedmasters might have been engraved much later . engraved with the previous markings without taking into account the changed circumstances. 6B stands for UK inventory. 6BB for use by UK forces outside the UK in protectorates. Arrow and I for India aso.... Marking Omega Speedmasters after the independence of Rhodesia with 6B and INV 188 (following the British way), makes no sense at all. The Speedmasters MK 2 : yes. The speedmaster Moon watch : no. The new sovereign state would not follow the old colonial ways rgd. Purchases. Omega archives do not acknowledge these sales to any government entity. Because there is no contract. Which would have ensured, that the purchase price to governments would be very low. SO..... Many if 's, maybe's , associations , assumptions. Which, again, does not rectify the sales section " Rhodesian Army " label for unsuspecting new collectors..... kind regards. Achim

Dan S · Feb 10, 2021

Shabbaz
Why would somebody have more pleasure in owning a piece that has seen battle? It looks to me a bid sad if you really want this. Especially if your own best war performance is changing your kid's diaper... I understand the fact it's nice to wear a watch with fantastic provenance. But is war really the best provenance?

Well, bring out the gold watch scene from Pulp Fiction...

I really don't give much thought to whether or not a watch has seen action. Military issued watches are interesting to me for their history and "uniqueness", but usually I have no idea whether they were used in combat or not. On the flip side, I have bought a couple of non-issued watches from men who bought them in the PX and wore them while serving in Vietnam. It's an interesting tidbit of background that's of interest to me the same way knowing any history of a watch is of interest. But that's all. I bought them because I liked the watches.

To the OP's point, I agree wholeheartedly. There is a lot of deception around supposed military watches these days. Newbies really need to educate themselves before paying a premium for these pieces.

krogerfoot · Feb 10, 2021

SpeedyPhill
I have an Omega Speedmaster which I wore while walking on the large NASA DSN antennas in Tidbinbilla - Australia, Robledo de chavela - Spain, Goldstone - USA... special for me, but for others the question what the radio environment did to the watch 🤔
I can assure nothing as such influence because most radio-astronomy sites have these kinds of signs:
.

Imagine the frustration of dragging your microwave oven halfway across the desert in delicious anticipation of enjoying a piping hot burrito while overlooking a magnificent radio telescope array only to be confronted by this sign.

Fabrice M · Feb 10, 2021

I don’t think that most people are attracted by military watches because they may have seen battles, if you are a collector or a watch enthusiast there are several reason why a military watch are attractive. Most watch brand have an interwoven history with wars, and supplying watches for soldiers, same is true for brands with a history of producing watches for pilots or divers. We are attracted by artifacts worn by men and women who have put themself in danger for a cause they believed, a job they loved or pushing the boundaries behind wha is usually expected of us. Military watches definitely fall into this category, you are in effect wearing a piece of history.
Another important reason is provenance. Any vintage watches which can be traced to its origins is a big plus in any collection, and military watches are fairly easy to trace and many have their original papers or/and receipt. It seems that veterans are better at keeping records on their watch provenance, probably because it cost most of them several paychecks to acquire.
Lastly, most military watches will have unique details, or inscriptions on the back, making them more valuable than their civilian counterparts.

Cuttysark · Feb 10, 2021

I watched all the Rambo’s movies with the speedmaster on my wrist. Is anyone interested in this super military watch?

JwRosenthal · Feb 10, 2021

I got my first US Navy issued P-Coat from a friend of mine- it was issued to her uncle when he enlisted in the Navy in 1965. He served through 1969. He spent the entirety of his career on boats/ships in Greece drinking Grappa and chasing women- I don’t know if he ever had occasion to wear it.
Issued military gear can conjure up romantic (a touchy term for war) visions of valiant soldiers- but unless you have direct contact with the original issuee, you have no clue if that scratch on the case came from battle or a shuttlecock.

S.H. · Feb 10, 2021

Shabbaz
Why would somebody have more pleasure in owning a piece that has seen battle? It looks to me a bid sad if you really want this. Especially if your own best war performance is changing your kid's diaper... I understand the fact it's nice to wear a watch with fantastic provenance. But is war really the best provenance?

Well, bring out the gold watch scene from Pulp Fiction...

Personally, I sometimes get some perverse pleasure to have watches that were not available to the general public. So a military watch can be appealing that way, some kind of real life "limited edition". For example I just bought this:

Soviet 30atm vostok, AFAIK official use only. Simply unavailable in stores. Not enough pics in this thread!

And yes, I also find the NAAFI/private purchase speedys... just sad. Just marketing BS. If you have to get an official extract from the factory to determine if a watch is military or civilian issue, well... it is just a regular watch to me.

TexOmega · Feb 10, 2021

I have always wondered how to describe this combo.
No military markings on head but a custom bracelet with rank and name made in the Philippines, Olongapo specifically, with knowledge that US Servicemen did this commonly.
Head documents to the height of Vietnam War at 1967 delivery to US.

So, it was “used” by a serviceman but bought privately. Sounds like it falls in a gray area.
But definitely not military “issued”.

Dan S · Feb 10, 2021

TexOmega
I have always wondered how to describe this combo.
No military markings on head but a custom bracelet with rank and name made in the Philippines, Olongapo specifically, with knowledge that US Servicemen did this commonly.
Head documents to the height of Vietnam War at 1967 delivery to US.

So, it was “used” by a serviceman but bought privately. Sounds like it falls in a gray area.
But definitely not military “issued”.

I like the SCUBA tanks on the bracelet.

TexOmega · Feb 10, 2021

Dan S
I like the SCUBA tanks on the bracelet.

universal sign of a diver.

the other signifies US Diver 1st Class

watchyouwant · Feb 10, 2021

I have an Olongapo like this somewhere.... They are very short. If somebody is interested, let me know.