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Vintage gold constellation?

A
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Hi

I'd be really grateful if you guys could sanity check my research (googling) on what I think is a:

Gold Constellation (Pie Pan?) c 1960s?, possibly with a DS&S bracelet?

(photos attached)

It's been in my Dad's safe for close to 40 years, likely unworn - it was a gift from a private patient following a (presumably successful!) Neuro consult.

I've got the unfortunate duty of valuing his estate for probate & I've reached out to a couple of specialist watch shops that appear (from what it's possible to glean online) to be reputable, but would appreciate any other input.

I imagine I probably need to have the back taken off to get serial number etc, delicate stuff like that not my forte - I'll get to a jeweller at some point.

Many thanks!
 
IMG_0938.jpg IMG_0936.jpg IMG_0934.jpg IMG_0935.jpg
padders
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Not a pie pan, that’s a dome dial. The Shackman bracelet is fixed or welded on which may mean the case is by them too. That is common for a precious metal Swiss watch from around pre 1980 as there were stiff import tarriffs on gold items. D Shackman and Sons were based in London and made some lovely stuff. In terms of age, there are better experts than me on here but I would guess at mid-late 1960s.
 
Peemacgee
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Welcome @AL_V and condolences on the loss of your father.

your watch is a bit of a tricky one to assess.
It’s based on a ‘hidden crown’ Connie but without the lugs and with a fixed gold bracelet.
There are Swiss built Connies designed without lugs and fixed bracelet but because of the DS&S bracelet this might be an English cased watch.
you will need to have the back removed to confirm the reference and country of origin.
The style is dome dial not pie pan and it may have a de luxe gold dial.
We will need better in focus photos to assess the condition.

all of these things (significantly) affect any potential valuation

one thing to note is that sale/purchase/insurance value will vary significantly and I think you will require the lower sale value for probate.

edit - crossover with @padders post above.
 
BartH
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padders padders
Not a pie pan, that’s a dome dial. The Shackman bracelet is fixed or welded on which may mean the case is by them too. That is common for a precious metal Swiss watch from around pre 1980 as there were stiff import tarriffs on gold items. D Shackman and Sons were based in London and made some lovely stuff. In terms of age, there are better experts than me on here but I would guess at mid-late 1960s.

I actually think it is a pie pan. Look at the minute tracks, they're on the outside of a dome dial. The hidden crown (this particular one isn't hidden, because it looks like a replacement) often have a very flat pie pan edge.
 
Peemacgee
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BartH BartH
I actually think it is a pie pan. Look at the minute tracks, they're on the outside of a dome dial. The hidden crown (this particular one isn't hidden, because it looks like a replacement) often have a very flat pie pan edge.

another reason we need better pics....
 
aprax
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BartH BartH
I actually think it is a pie pan.
Nah, here's another example, and, btw, I believe the crown is right:
media.jpg


EDIT: On second thought, I see what BartH means, here is a better picture of the dial of the above watch I posted:

media2.jpg
Edited:
 
ConElPueblo
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aprax aprax
Nah, here's another example, and, btw, I believe the crown is right:
media.jpg


EDIT: On second thought, I see what BartH means, here is a better picture of the dial of the above watch I posted:

media2.jpg

That photo IS of a pie pan.

You can see the straight lines between the hour markers denoting this. On a dome dial the minute/second track is curved and on the other side of the hour markers. On the .004 reference this English version is based on, the pie pan is very discreet.
 
BartH
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aprax aprax
Nah, here's another example, and, btw, I believe the crown is right:
media.jpg


EDIT: On second thought, I see what BartH means, here is a better picture of the dial of the above watch I posted:

media2.jpg

yup, that is a pie pan.

media9DUKENOS.jpg
 
A
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Cheers guys, thanks for all the (super quick) insight!

I'll get some better photos uploaded !
 
cristos71
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Pie pan or dome, either way I don't think it will influence the value very much with this example.

Unfortunately an integrated fine mesh bracelet coupled to a lugless case is about the least attractive possibility imaginable when it comes to solid gold Constellations.

I think with the current gold price it would prove to be a very hard sell and as such I would value it based on its net gold weight + loose solid gold dial ( I think ) + loose movement.

Yesterday I was at a watch fair and saw quite a number of late 60's to mid 70's solid gold cased and braceleted Omega's, they were all in good enough condition but weren't the most sought after references. The prices were of course high due to gold content, €3K+, but the feeling all around was that these were soon destined for the smelter.
 
A
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cristos71 cristos71
Pie pan or dome, either way I don't think it will influence the value very much with this example.

Unfortunately an integrated fine mesh bracelet coupled to a lugless case is about the least attractive possibility imaginable when it comes to solid gold Constellations.

I think with the current gold price it would prove to be a very hard sell and as such I would value it based on its net gold weight + loose solid gold dial ( I think ) + loose movement.

Yesterday I was at a watch fair and saw quite a number of late 60's to mid 70's solid gold cased and braceleted Omega's, they were all in good enough condition but weren't the most sought after references. The prices were of course high due to gold content, €3K+, but the feeling all around was that these were soon destined for the smelter.

Makes sense - it's not something I'd consider wearing and a few people have told me it's probably 'only' worth £600-£700 for the scrap gold. To be honest every item that has a large value is more of a hassle when it comes to paying the IHT so I'm happy with a low value & something I sling back in a safe for 20 years (advice from a dealer, seemed sensible).

more photos attached
 
6681DCE5-EA86-45CA-88DA-972FCED79AEE.jpeg F7AAA68B-4630-4D43-AC3D-7F5FCA036E9C.jpeg D890B66D-B344-4229-A9E1-9FE3219ECB16.jpeg
padders
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Were the people who told you it was £600-700 trying to buy it off you? I think I see 18K marks on that clasp and I bet there is 40-60g of gold in the watch (don't forget the movement, crystal and possibly dial are not gold so have to be subtracted from the gross weight) which at today rate is worth at the very least £1K, maybe more like £1.5K if at the upper end of my weight estimation.
 
A
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padders padders
Were the people who told you it was £600-700 trying to buy it off you? I think I see 18K marks on that clasp and I bet there is 40-60g of gold in the watch (don't forget the movement, crystal and possibly dial are not gold so have to be subtracted from the gross weight) which at today rate is worth at the very least £1K, maybe more like £1.5K if at the upper end of my weight estimation.

In fairness they just said it wasn’t in fashion & to either scrap it (which seems a little OTT) or put away & see if fashion changes.
 
VetPsychWars
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None of these vintage watches are "in fashion"! Wear it if you like it, don't wear it if you don't.

Tom
 
Peemacgee
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Oh look! - a dome dial - who’d have guessed? 😁
4D052B0B-C3B7-4633-9840-0C23A17C2F7C.jpeg
 
Peemacgee
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A AL_V
Makes sense - it's not something I'd consider wearing and a few people have told me it's probably 'only' worth £600-£700 for the scrap gold. To be honest every item that has a large value is more of a hassle when it comes to paying the IHT so I'm happy with a low value & something I sling back in a safe for 20 years (advice from a dealer, seemed sensible).

more photos attached

Much better photos - thank you.
The case is a little soft (polished)
The dial looks correct and I believe to be a de luxe gold dial.
Whilst not as desirable as some gold Connies this is still a valuable watch but if it is preferable to you then take a low value for probate.
 
A
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I have to say, what a pleasant, passionate and informative community you have here!

Thank you all for your insight & help 😀
 
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