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thought I had a pre-viceroy heuer autavia 1163MH... maybe not?

dinexus
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Quick background – just bought this from an antique dealer up in Sonoma for a song. Case is still razor-sharp and in remarkably good condition, dial is exceptional, just needs a little polywatch on the crystal and a service. Impulse purchases aren't really my style, but I thought it was a pre-Viceroy Autavia 1163 with the MH bezel. However, brought it home, did a bit more reading, and noticed the filled-in indices (not the sloped ones of earlier variants), the red highlights on the hands, and more notably, the individual hours on the 12-hour register at 9:00 – all hallmarks of the standard Viceroy.

vK8nDXjl.jpg

However, there's no 'V' etched on the case at 12:00 under '1163' as I've seen on all other Viceroy editions, and my serial looks to be pretty low (202XXX...) – far lower than any other Viceroy listing I've seen, but a touch higher than the older "pre-Viceroy" editions. Is this a transitional model introduced prior to the Viceroy promotion? Can anyone shed a little more light on this piece before I take it into SF for a service?

LObuf4Tl.jpg
 
neilbardsley
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This might help

http://thoughts.onthedash.com/thoughts/serial-numbers-of-viceroy-autavias/

"The second batch of 1163 cases runs from 202xxx through 205xxx. There is relatively little corroborating date evidence for this range but as we do have such evidence for the previous and subsequent batches, it appears likely that this run dates from some point in 1970. The 205xxx block is occupied by 1163 GMTs."

There is another article on that site to say that type of 1163 you have but it appears not to be a Viceroy. Please post a photo of the movement you may be lucky like me and have a 11 or 11i!

PS chronomatic heuer forum is the place to ask this question
 
abrod520
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Heuer sold the regular model at the same time they were running the Viceroy promotion, so this is essentially the same watch but without the V case.
Really nice looking example though
 
dinexus
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abrod520 abrod520
Heuer sold the regular model at the same time they were running the Viceroy promotion, so this is essentially the same watch but without the V case.
Really nice looking example though

Ahh, this is immensely helpful. Thank you! So this is essentially the slow-selling variant that competed with the Viceroy. Now I'm curious about the movement inside based on Neil's comment!
 
abrod520
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dinexus dinexus
Ahh, this is immensely helpful. Thank you! So this is essentially the slow-selling variant that competed with the Viceroy. Now I'm curious about the movement inside based on Neil's comment!

My guess is it's a Cal. 11i. The Cal 11 was phased out quite a while before these, while the Cal 12 appeared during the Viceroy's run. I've owned a Cal 11i Viceroy before
 
dinexus
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abrod520 abrod520
My guess is it's a Cal. 11i. The Cal 11 was phased out quite a while before these, while the Cal 12 appeared during the Viceroy's run. I've owned a Cal 11i Viceroy before
That's super interesting. Found a great breakdown of the calibers and an estimate that based on the serial, this should be an 11i, but the only way to know for sure is to pop open the caseback. Only I think, with this being a single-owner watch, it doesn't appear to have ever been serviced, and I think the gasket might be coming apart.
No Heuer specialists in the Bay Area from the sounds of it, so it might be headed to New York for a service...
 
neilbardsley
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It's a watch someone in SF or CA will be able to service it well for you?
 
JimJupiter
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Interesting! I had a Pre-Viceroy with 204.xxx serial and 1-12 sub counter, and have a Derek Bell MK III with 203.xxx Serial from first owner and 3-6-9-12 Counter and polished hands.

IMG_6025.JPG


You can check the back of the watch. at the lug, you will find a triangle or two. If I remember correctly one triangle means Cal.11, two are Cal. 12.

Best guess is, your dial and hands were swapped at a service?
 
abrod520
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neilbardsley neilbardsley
It's a watch someone in SF or CA will be able to service it well for you?

A lot of watchmakers don't want to take modular chronographs, and there are fewer and fewer independent watchmakers in the Bay Area each year due to the stupid high rents.
 
dinexus
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abrod520 abrod520
A lot of watchmakers don't want to take modular chronographs, and there are fewer and fewer independent watchmakers in the Bay Area each year due to the stupid high rents.

That's what I've heard as well.

JimJupiter JimJupiter
Interesting! I had a Pre-Viceroy with 204.xxx serial and 1-12 sub counter, and have a Derek Bell MK III with 203.xxx Serial from first owner and 3-6-9-12 Counter and polished hands.

IMG_6025.JPG


You can check the back of the watch. at the lug, you will find a triangle or two. If I remember correctly one triangle means Cal.11, two are Cal. 12.
Best guess is, your dial and hands were swapped at a service?

Interesting! Found the triangle (damn, that thing is tiny!) on the lug to the left of '1163, so it confirms my suspicion that it's a Cal.11. Serial number would suggest the i variant, but only opening the caseback would confirm this. Definitely haven't had enough liquid courage to do this myself!
 
abrod520
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dinexus dinexus
Serial number would suggest the i variant, but only opening the caseback would confirm this.

It's definitely an 11i - there were relatively very very few Calibre 11 movements made and if your movement were swapped from the original 11i, it'd have been with a 12 since they were the most prolific
 
H
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JimJupiter JimJupiter
Interesting! I had a Pre-Viceroy with 204.xxx serial and 1-12 sub counter, and have a Derek Bell MK III with 203.xxx Serial from first owner and 3-6-9-12 Counter and polished hands.

IMG_6025.JPG


You can check the back of the watch. at the lug, you will find a triangle or two. If I remember correctly one triangle means Cal.11, two are Cal. 12.

Best guess is, your dial and hands were swapped at a service?

According to On the Dash, a polished markers 1163 MH (Derek Bell MK III) like the one you show should have serial numbers in the 143xxx serial number, but I also have the same watch with a 203xxx serial number.
 
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