Hi guys,

As some of you guys might know I've yet to pull the trigger on an actual Speedy Pro, despite being an Omega guy from the beginning. Got an interesting offer from an acquaintance and wondering how you Speedmaster guys would value this - 3573.50.00, 1863 mvm't, sapphire sandwich dial, modded with (as per him) OEM Italian Albino service dial and hands. Original dial and hands to be included with box/papers/manual.

A few of their pics below:





What would you guys have to say about this lil' guy? I do like the original Albinos, but they are definitely above my punching weight for price, rarity aside. Neither he nor I is 100% about the market on a mod like this, especially also including the original pieces.

As always, my thanks and gratitude to the wealth of knowledge you guys (and gals!) are willing to share!

 

Cant give any input just wanted to say looks nice and I hope the deal goes the way you desire.

 

Much appreciated - I think it's probably a beautiful piece in person, just not certain I want to go so deep-pocketed for what is essentially a mod piece when I can get a solid Pro in the 4-5k range completely stock. On the other hand if I take the original parts with this into account, it could be worth the relatively slight premium that he wants over the typical 'regular' sapphire Pro price.

 

What is he asking for it? I’m of no real help when it comes to pricing, but my initial thought would be: as it is a mod/build, price it according to value of parts?

 

That's kind of my thinking - most OEM dials I've seen like this seem to go for 1.5k-2.5k, I figure 4-5.5k for the 3573.50 overall with the kit, few hundred for hands, at a guess I'm thinking 5-7k total ballpark for market...but that's strictly speculative.

 

Those pictures are a bit deceptive, remember the dial is cream and not white. I had one of these dials but I just could not get used to the cream colour and moved onto another mod instead. You used to be able to buy those dials for about $500 but now I've seen them in the $1000 to $1500 bracket which is pretty expensive imo.

Personally I wouldnt price a modded watch much above the actual watch it was modded from.

 

Projects are typically valued as parts...

 

@eugeneandresson and @pascs - that's basically what I tried breaking down above - the watch with all original parts, plus the currently installed 'mod' parts as a smaller additional value.

 

I believe that most agree the watch in question is most valuable in it's original unaltered state.
What if we considered the cost of reinstallation of the original parts minus the value of the the added parts?

 

I agree with most of the responses up to now. I see the original parts come with the watch, so take the value of that watch (minus the cost of having a watchmaker do the swapping...a few hundred...unless you are qualified to do that work) and add a realistic value for the white dial and hands to be sold separately. 1.5 to 2.5 for that dial seems high to me. I'd say 1k for the dial and hands together...+ 3573.50 value given cond. and market. So maybe a range from 4500 to 5500? Let him try to list it for sale and see how many months it sits. If I were you, I'd just get a good, solid Speedmaster with the boxes, etc in great shape from the 90s, 2000s.

 

Watches are emotional objects, it's hard to price that factor in to get to the 'correct' price for any watch, much less modified watches. Last year I bought a brand new modified Speedmaster from Adam Lewis in Perth; new Omega 35th Apollo 11 dial & hands, straight writing back, 50th Apollo 11 crown and pushers, Silver Snoopy cordura strap and Omega deployant buckle, a watch he completed on 12/31/19 as a final tribute for the 50th anniversary of the landing. It included the original bracelet, the suitcase box and all accessories but NOT the original dial, hands, back, pushers or crown. How do you price the watch? Depends on how much one wants the watch in the modified state. For me the Aussie dollar was weak last year so that worked in my favor; the watch landed on my wrist in Texas via DHL from Perth in 10 days at about 6% less than the US list price for the normal black dial version. To me it was a very fair value and I'm very happy with the watch, a conversion done by an authorized Omega repair specialist so I know it was done right. The loss of the original dial and back really doesn't concern me, it's not like I'd ever reconvert back to stock. OP will have to decide what the true value of a modified Albino is TO HIM.

 

This might seem off the wall, but does your watch have an Omega 1861 movement or is it a Lemania movement with an Omega branded Bridge? I ask because a mod built by Adam recently sold on our forum and the listing stated Adam used a Lemania movement with an Omega branded bridge instead of the Omega movement, and that surprised me.

 

I'd also be very interested to hear how common this practice is as well. I was interested in that recent sale but the lemania movement turned me right off. Seems to turn a custom speedy into a full franken IMHO

 

A completely stock Speedmaster was purchased from an AD in Perth, WA in 12/19, and that was the basis for the conversion by Adam. The original Warranty and Pictogram cards were included in the sale but the Omega warranty was void, of course, but Adam gave his own two year warranty. The watch is complete Omega, all replacement parts were new Omega (i.e., no non-Omega parts were used).

 

Well; as to the original post; didn't work out - it would've been a trade and while I liked the Speedy I prefer to keep an original, well, original, and it turned out he wanted a different size in my watch, in the end it was just an agreed-on near-miss. I think the watch was cool, and don't think he'll be in limbo on it forever, but I think most of the above-mentioned points have been valid.

Thanks as always guys.

 

I’ve seen fakes with Lemania movements in them (where the original markings were removed from the main plate and crude Omega stamping was addd), plus some projects made up of genuine Speedmaster cases and unmodified Lemania movements in them.

This example takes it to a different level, and reading the sales thread I’m not sure how clear it was that this had a modified movement when originally sold. The seller first says it’s all genuine Omega parts, and only later clarified that the movement is a combination of parts, so it almost didn’t appear that he knew this prior to the sale maybe?