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Should I keep this $24,000 Explorer II 1655 from Tourneau?

  1. backpackerx Mar 7, 2023

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    I bought this online from Tourneau and it shipped from the Bucherer TimeMachine watch shop in NYC. It was listed for $28,000 and they were running a promo for 20% off so with NC tax $24,024.


    First posts are always suspicious so note that I have no intention of trying to sell this watch to anyone.


    Wanting some expert eyes to see if anyone notices anything as I'm hoping it was well vetted by such a large brand but would love opinions. I've seen some really helpful posts by PitPro and others here so I wanted to post here as my normal, albeit sporadic history, is mostly over on Watchuseek.


    Details: This is a Mk1 dial with what I believe is a MKII bezel. Serial number is in the 3,2m range. Bracelet appears to be an almost new 78360 with 580 end links. The lugs and crown guards appear to be in fairly good shape and reasonably thick. The side case beveling is barely noticeable but also doesn't appear to be polished away necessarily. Case in decent vintage shape. The bezel numerals have been filled in at some point but looks to be a reasonably decent job. The 24 hour hand border is faded completely white while the hour and minute hands have a slightly yellowed. Very even patina throughout the dial and the dial itself seems to be in excellent condition. Under magnification it has a light texture to it.


    Any help or opinions on the watch and original hands/dial etc. would be much appreciated as I have two weeks to keep it or return it. I've been looking for one of these for a while and from my research this appeared to be priced well but opinions welcome.


    It's my first entry into vintage Rolex and I kind of went big so juuuuust a tad nervous. Did as much homework as I could. Will probably post on Rolex forum and Watchuseek as well.

    E42A2CC6-F654-402B-8C61-79507E4D1919.jpeg DD470781-DFFB-4EC3-BC15-FC046F8E2F31.jpeg 05943BF1-5F00-42F8-A851-639270B8FCD0.jpeg 18038979-41AC-418F-8164-7FD9B2CA2ADE.jpeg D83CF862-CC4B-48F4-BE9D-01C140A3D07D.jpeg C3019526-A3B0-4733-9A9A-C692A5C3A189.jpeg 309D018F-D481-46E2-A426-55E21E1BDD56.jpeg E3780F43-2C28-489D-BD58-9B11AE6624E8.jpeg
     
    Edited Mar 7, 2023
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  2. backpackerx Mar 8, 2023

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    Harsh lighting in photos makes look worse for every ding and scratch. On wrist was a bit better than expected.
     
    DF2594EE-8D52-4F29-A086-BE61604051B1.jpeg
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  3. Dan S Mar 8, 2023

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    It looks legit to me at first glance, but IMO that's a high price for a watch in poor condition. Badly overpolished case and bezel, unappealing dial and handset, etc. I am seeing poor 1655s going for $15k-$18k usually. But that is at auction, and if you're more comfortable buying from a retailer, I understand that. Just be aware that it will be a hard watch to sell if you want to upgrade.
     
    Edited Mar 8, 2023
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  4. backpackerx Mar 8, 2023

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    Appreciate the reply. Was hoping to get good thoughts on this from folks like you and @pitpro @Marsimaxam and others I've seen write some really good posts on the 1655. I've done a ton of reading but extremely limited on my expertise here.
     
  5. spacemission Mar 8, 2023

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    Service crown. I'd like to see the clasp.
     
  6. spacemission Mar 8, 2023

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    A photo of the crown is enough.
     
  7. backpackerx Mar 8, 2023

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    The clasp and bracelet look almost new. Definitely a later 78360 bracelet.
     
    427BF963-2904-4D67-A799-85EE24F75090.jpeg DAD0EE0C-32A6-4967-AF02-A5913A323281.jpeg
  8. spacemission Mar 8, 2023

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    Yeah, 80s and 90s crown.
     
  9. ATWG Mar 8, 2023

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    I agree with @Dan S, I would value this watch around $16-18K, the dial is unattractive and and I have not see an "orange" hand that white before. Additionally, the bracelet is a replacement and not period correct for that watch.

    I do like the case, seems to have enough meat on the bones to clean up nicely, but all is lost with a tarnished dial. I'd return it and wait for the right one to come along.

    For reference, I hunted for the right 1655 for about 5 yrs. before this one came along.....
    4F55099A-CDFB-4B37-BB6E-B6520306591A.jpeg
     
  10. Foo2rama Keeps his worms in a ball instead of a can. Mar 8, 2023

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    Seems like a high price even for buying via a re seller like T.

    the 1655 is special due to the Orange, and missing it really diminishes the impact of the watch.

    I have no concerns about it being legit from T.

    But you may want to keep an eye out on Bobswatches.com . They are a highly respected vintage dealer as well.
     
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  11. calalum Mar 8, 2023

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    That price with that dial? Absolutely a big no for me. I have had a few 1655's and even the rough ones had much better dials. That would end the inquiry for me. And that doesn't even start with the other issues. Candidly, even at a lower price I would pass on that one. Sorry-just being honest. Good luck whatever you do.
     
  12. backpackerx Mar 8, 2023

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    Appreciate the insight. That is a beautiful watch.
     
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  13. backpackerx Mar 8, 2023

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    No need for the sorry, happy to have the opinion.
     
  14. spacemission Mar 8, 2023

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    16k for the op's watch? :coffee:

    On the other hand, the 16550 is more useful than the 1655.
     
  15. rcs914 Mar 8, 2023

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    Is it artifacting from the camera and relatively low light that makes the lettering all look hand-written? Or is that a "Feature" of the MK1 dial?

    rolex crayon.JPG
     
  16. Davidt Mar 8, 2023

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    I’m no expert on this reference but I would say that to my eye it’s not an attractive example and should command a discount to the mean price, not a premium.

    The dial appears washed out and unattractive and the case looks soft and worn.
     
  17. backpackerx Mar 8, 2023

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    It's a domed acrylic crystal and the angle of the photo causing that. Under magnification (10x jeweler loupe) it's exactly as crisp as some detailed images of other dials for this model I referenced. The dial is in really good shape. The hands have extensive patina obviously.
     
  18. backpackerx Mar 8, 2023

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    Agree on discount to mean. Mean is $28k-$30k. Good examples getting crazy high. Thinking this maybe more in the $20k range.
     
  19. backpackerx Mar 8, 2023

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    I missed that comment at first. Yeah, it's hard for me to tell as I haven't seen others in person before. My initial thought was that I didn't mind the patina and knowing Submariners with "tropical" dials are highly valued so initially didn't see the hands as a huge issue. Dial seems decent but that's "decent" to me who hasn't held another one.

    And by the way, this discussion is waaaaay more civil than my same thread over at Watchuseek. I posted over there where my history is for as much insight into this large purchase as possible but saw so many helpful 1655 posts here I created an account to post. Thank you all for polite, helpful opinions.
     
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  20. Marsimaxam Mar 9, 2023

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    I agree with the general consensus, you could have done a lot better considering how much you paid for the 1655. The watch in my opinion is authentic, but, far too many issues. The dial is unattractive as are the hands. It is not uncommon for the orange hand to fade to white, also known as an "albino". Hopefully, you will be able to return the watch and find another.

    By the way, ATWG, a beautiful example of an early reference 1655. 45A7EECC-E3FA-4A34-A291-48665342332D.jpeg
     
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