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Search for the Oldest Longines - 183. The historically important transitional Comptoir AA4 made 1867

Seiji Lépine
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I was going to hold off on saying anything but I can't control myself. The Oldest Watch Contest hasn't been held in several years. The management that influenced that contest has retired or left Longines for other careers. Not sure if there will be any future Oldest Watch Contest in the near future 183 may have made that contest pointless.

Also, watches in the past, I believe all had Longines original cases, movements, dial, and hands. So high original content was needed to be selected. The watch that won the UK for example, Longines actually even replaced the bow with an original one to make it more original.

Your watch has a case that does not appear to be Longines made. The stamped numbers match your serial number, however, they are not Longines factory numbers and not stamped in the fashion normally done by the factory as far as I know. I also do not see an EF Longines Co logo on your case. The case for the watch maybe locally produced in the country it was delivered to.

I would not throw the watch away, but if you are looking for a ultra low serial number, you might want to continue looking for something under 1,000; which are pretty darn hard to find as many are now in collections.
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DirtyDozen12
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Seiji Lépine Lépine
Your watch has a case that does not appear to be Longines made. The stamped numbers match your serial number, however, they are not Longines factory numbers and not stamped in the fashion normally done by the factory as far as I know. I also do not see an EF Longines Co logo on your case. The case for the watch maybe locally produced in the country it was delivered to.
My impression is that Longines was not making its own cases prior to 1880 (source: chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/https://www.watkinsr.id.au/Francillon.pdf). In my view, the numbers on this case are stamped in a manner that is typical of other Longines from the period. I would not expect to see an "EF Longines Co" logo on the case. See some examples below.

Serial 21'080 (source: unknown):
front cover.webp back cover.webp front.webp move.webp back.webp


Serial 23'478 (source: unknown):
5.webp 1.webp 2.webp 3.webp 4.webp


Serial 23'922 (source: unknown):
dial.webp mov.webp case2.webp case.webp mov2.webp


Serial 45'354 (source: unknown):
5.webp 6.webp 1.webp 2.webp 3.webp
 
Seiji Lépine
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IMG_0394.webp


This logo is on cases for #183, #300, #335, #347, #561, #3166


#561
IMG_0395.webp


#300
IMG_0396.webp


#183
Longines_Produits-11.webp


#3166
IMG_0401.webp IMG_0402.webp 1738188240884.webp

#3166 bottom and #183 top
IMG_0677.webp



#183 bottom next to #335 top
IMG_0403.webp IMG_0404.webp


#347
1738164393962.webp
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DirtyDozen12
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Seiji Lépine Lépine
I haven't looked at 20B as I think there are hundreds of them up for sale and too many possibilities. You might be right that no EF Longines Co. logo was used during the period of the posters watch. I would perfer a watch that at least had Longines written on the cuvette otherwise the case could have come from anywhere.
I do not think that the absence of "Longines" on the cuvette is of particular significance with respect to where a case came from. Many original Swiss cases do not have such a marking. Maybe more important are other markings that are typical such as apparent maker's marks and numbers.
 
Furby1184
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I'm currently trying to locate a bezel for the case and a period correct crystal if possible
 
DirtyDozen12
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Furby1184 Furby1184
I'm currently trying to locate a bezel for the case and a period correct crystal if possible
I think that finding another watch with those parts might be the simplest option. I notice that there is also a component missing that mates with a key for setting the time (highlighted below).

1738206150854.webp
 
Furby1184
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Would anyone be able to assist in locating a case that I could use with this?
 
Furby1184
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Seiji Lépine Lépine
You should start a new thread for help with your watch. Please don't continue here.
Good idea. I'll make now, thank you.
 
Seiji Lépine
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One of the long standing mysteries has been where was the 183 watch sent to.
The watch was sent to the agent Henry Grosjean, it appears that the agent could be
for France in 1867.
2025-03-27_13-09-23.webp 2025-03-27_13-31-00.webp
 
Katikon
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Hi, I'm from Serbia, I've just registered to this forum as I have some old Longines watch. But don't know much about it. Appreciate some info. Thanks

IMG_20250606_105902_edit_169439104653070.webp IMG_20250606_105718_edit_169948870768605.webp IMG_20250606_105756_edit_169856545314213.webp IMG_20250606_105806_edit_169847128847706.webp IMG_20250606_105829_edit_169462591449311.webp IMG_20250606_105820_edit_169827327446360.webp IMG_20250606_105917_edit_169418212033026.webp
 
Seiji Lépine
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Katikon Katikon
Hi, I'm from Serbia, I've just registered to this forum as I have some old Longines watch. But don't know much about it. Appreciate some info. Thanks

IMG_20250606_105902_edit_169439104653070.webp IMG_20250606_105718_edit_169948870768605.webp IMG_20250606_105756_edit_169856545314213.webp IMG_20250606_105806_edit_169847128847706.webp IMG_20250606_105829_edit_169462591449311.webp IMG_20250606_105820_edit_169827327446360.webp IMG_20250606_105917_edit_169418212033026.webp
Hard to tell much with just these photos. I think we would want the diameter of the movement in order to determine if it is a 20 something or 19 something movement. The case appears to be silver plated. The serial number range is a bit on the higher side than would be exciting for Longines pocket watch collectors looking for low serial numbers. I wonder about the reason the case engraver added such a non-Longines like cuvette engravings. The watch hands may not be a matching set. The bow on the watch also does not match the case. There is also a chance that the movement doesn't match the case, you would have to remove the dial and check if the serial number and the case match. Unfortunately, with Longines watches and especially vintage Longines, the matching serial number separates desirable watches from the items that should not be in a collector's collection. Maybe you can clean this watch and use it every day as originally intended?
 
O
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Like it when my saved searches occasionally deliver something interesting. See 1504 has been found - or at least listed for sale. Seiji- how many AA4s stamped have you come across? See they’ve said a dozen, which seems low? Still find your search so interesting!

IMG_5611.webp
 
Seiji Lépine
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O OmegaSeeker
Like it when my saved searches occasionally deliver something interesting. See 1504 has been found - or at least listed for sale. Seiji- how many AA4s stamped have you come across? See they’ve said a dozen, which seems low? Still find your search so interesting!

IMG_5611.webp
Longines #1504 not complete watch. Unknown movement caliber
 
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