Ref. 145.012 deconstructed/(under)valued

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not quite. start with the observation of the chrono buttons..but besides that, a 105.012-66 and a 145.012 are damned close 馃榾

Unless you're talking about the 105.012-66 CB.

Isn't there a difference with the case as well as the SP pushers (although we're well into the minutiae there)?
 
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Unless you're talking about the 105.012-66 CB.

Isn't there a difference with the case as well as the SP pushers (although we're well into the minutiae there)?

CB has different polished lugs, my 105.012 is a CB. Pushers are flat and stubby, just like on the other 105.012s.

Added a picture:

 
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CB has different polished lugs, my 105.012 is a CB. Pushers are flat and stubby, just like on the other 105.012s.

That's what I'm saying. The CB seems to be the more common variant of the 105.012-66 and the case is different to that of the 145.012, so it's only the rarer 105.012-66 HF that is similar to the 145.012 apart from the pushers.
 
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Only because I've had prior experience with a 105.012-66w/CB Case that had a dial with the plots completely washed and a modern square-end chrono sweep: What you you place the value of the dial and hands with these issues?
 
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Well we cannot forget that one was in the moon... so comparing 105. With 145. Would not be fair emho but yes they look quite the same watch
 
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Looking alike does not equate with values alike. The tribute speedmaster 57 broad arrow will always have a very
different value than original 2915.
 
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To me, any of the Speedmasters that have a 321 movement ticking away inside are in a class of their own... BUT

It would seem that @Spacefruit may have given us a clue as to why the 'running' to 'good' prices of the 145.012 are below the 105.012 and sit closer to the 145.022.

(Quote from the Speedmaster101 assessment guide on the 145.012)
'This is the most affordable 321 Speedmaster, and consequently it spend the longest time languishing in sub $1000 territory. (Some while ago now!) This value made them uneconomic to service, so care must be exercised in choosing one that has not been neglected.'
(End of quote)

If I understand this correctly, it means you are more likely to find watches with and uncertain or poor service history in this reference and that effects the value???
Doesn't that also kind of suggest that a really good 145.012 would be rarer and sit in a better price bracket? If you take a look at the collectors condition 145.012, they are way up over $11,500. That's $2,000 dearer than any 145.022.

Having said all that, as the owner of a 1965 105.012 I should be even more put out because a 'good' 105.003 of the same year is worth $5,800 more than a 105.012!
Personally, I'm not keen on the early references unprotected pushers but then the straight lug Speedys are very tasteful. I just think (In my humble opinion) that the 105.012 with it's asymetric case, short pushers and lyre lugs took the Speedmaster design to a higher level of elegance.

Anyway...If I've got this wrong let me know.馃槙
Edited:
 
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I think that the early 145.022 are a bit over valued, more than that the 145.012 is under valued. But market dictates price.
 
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The market, the one true dictator of price, inspires emotions in many of us.
"That's a ridiculous price" we exclaim.
"That's way to much to pay" has often been my first thought.
I get emotionally involved in the prices I see paid - but I have trained myself to ignore it.

Because only in coldly accepting what things achieve, can I stay involved. Those of us who have been buying for years, find it very hard to pay $5000 for something that cost $1500 five years ago.

The trick, for me, is to pay 5000 for the example ONLY if it is more attractive (to me of course) than the hypothetical 1500 watchthat I already own . Is it worth 3500 more than the 1500 watch? no. But the 1500 watch is now perhaps 4500. it does need to be sold to achieve the gain.

145.012's are the runt of the 321 litter. Often they have lost originality and we struggle to find something nice to say about a watch - so many have poor bezels and this plays such a huge part in values that we can't avoid it. So good to top examples will start to hit $15,000 while poor examples my stay around 4000-6000.

Breaking a 145.012 will only make sense for a finite time - as owners fulfill their needs of dials, movements and cases - yes the bezel will always find a home.

We are at the edge of a massive change in the speedmaster market - in my opinion. Here are my predictions, and as always this is for fun, I can easily be wrong but this is my feeling:

2998-1's will trade around 60-100k. Dials, hands, bezels will all start to be faked.
2998-3 to 105.003 will also have fake dials, but these are easier to make. They will trade around 40-60k
Straight lug watches will appear more and more in auctions, often with severe problems as naive auctioneers learn - and several will have issues that cause them to be withdrawn or the sale will fail.

Dealers will sell a lot of non original watches as original

There will be a rise in specialist watchmakers who can handle 321 Calibres using remade or hand made parts, and owners will avoid sending to factory, even though the factory will belatedly change policy to please collectors - too little too late.

105.012's will become the hot desirable watch. The value will pull away, but only for watches with original pushers and an extract.

Extracts will become essential for top money.

Dealers will build more frankens.

This forum will become the de facto resource to check validity for professionals.
 
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@Spacefruit, Hard not to agree to the described scenario as we already see this happening especially in - and I have no clue why - Italy for quite a while. Single Serial brigdes, baked dials, assemblies and other crazy things..But that just one source that will drive things as you described them.
 
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I hope the 145.012 remains unloved by the market. I am in this as a collector, not an investor.
Picked this guy up about 2 years ago (?) at an estate sale with the 1039/516 bracelet. For what I paid I couldn't get a decent DON bezel in today's market...

 
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Picked my 145.012 up from its service today an attached the 1039 bracelet (fully linked = too big).

 
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@Spacefruit, Hard not to agree to the described scenario as we already see this happening especially in - and I have no clue why - Italy for quite a while. Single Serial brigdes, baked dials, assemblies and other crazy things..But that just one source that will drive things as you described them.

My previous 145.012 came from italy and had a service midcase.
 
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Italian Watch Dealers....
::facepalm1::
Always have really attractive things, but I always feel I am in a very expensive bordello that is slightly beyond my means, and leave feeling shafted and poorer than I intended.