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Omega Constellation 14902 on original BOR bracelet

  1. navigator

    navigator May 28, 2015

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    I'm a new vintage omega collector and have the opportunity to buy what I believe is an all original omega 14902 sc-61. From what I can tell everything looks good, but I know this is one of the more faked cases.

    Opinions on anything that does not look to be original would be greatly appreciated.
    2151cb.jpg 2151clasp.jpg 2151crown.jpg 2151crown.jpg 2151dial2.jpg 2151move.jpg
     
  2. CanberraOmega

    CanberraOmega Rabbitohs and Whisky Supporter May 28, 2015

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    Looks good to me
     
  3. peatnick

    peatnick May 28, 2015

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    Do the end links on the bracelet have numbers stamped on them?

    [​IMG]

    Can't tell from this pic, also think the Constellation came with a 7 link BOR rather than the 5 link here, they were used on Seamaster models

    Ask the seller for a picture of the inside case back, he's clearly had it open, that will give you a bit more to go on :)
     
  4. navigator

    navigator May 28, 2015

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    Thanks for the quick replies.

    I don't think the end links have any numbers on them. I'm going to see the watch in person next week so I'll check on that.

    I'll have to research the bracelet more as to whether it should be a 7 or 5 link.

    The seller said it was original and I have seen pictures of vintage constellations with similar styled bracelet.
     
  5. CanberraOmega

    CanberraOmega Rabbitohs and Whisky Supporter May 28, 2015

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    5 vs 7 is not a big deal. Personal preference only.
     
  6. Selbo

    Selbo May 28, 2015

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    The crown is a replacement and not original to the watch. Not a big deal to replace but something to point out in your negotiation if the watch is priced as all original. The BOR bracelets were accessories and not specifically designated for a particular product line. It really is personal preference but I think you mostly see the 5 with a Constellation. Good luck. Hope it works out for you.
     
  7. Peemacgee

    Peemacgee Purrrr-veyor of luxury cat box loungers May 28, 2015

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    I'm no expert -but I seem to remember reading (Desmond's site?) that the new BOR bracelets have oval links like the OP's but the vintage version have flattened links like mine.
    My 67/68 Connie came with a 7 bead bracelet and '70' stamped on the end links.
    I was going to say that was what I thought usually came with a Connie -but as I said I'm no expert.
    The crown should also look like the one pictured below -no biggy but you can't get the original any more (there is a similar alternative available)
    The rotor looks like it might have been replaced (by the colour)
    The dial looks good but the pics aren't quite good enough to be absolutely certain about the fonts.
    For what looks like a a 15m serial number (?) -late 50's -early, cal 561, the case also looks almost too good to be true -mine is in really good nick for a 50 year old watch but you can tell it has had a life -this one looks virtually unused -but it may have just been well polished.
    -sharp bezel edge but soft-edged doglegs.
    as peatnick says -a look inside the case back could tell you a lot about the authenticity of the case

    hope that helps

    IMG_20150522_163813.jpg
     
  8. navigator

    navigator May 28, 2015

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    Looks like there are a lot more questions on originality than I initially thought. I think I may pass on this one. Thanks for all the replies.
     
  9. TNTwatch

    TNTwatch May 28, 2015

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    There is no question on the originality of this watch. The case is shiny as it's been polished, but not too bad. Dial has some aging spots. Rotor if replaced would even be better than an old and worn out one, but it doesn't look that new here. Bracelet is fine, worth about $150 alone. Crown is recent replacement and is way more usable compared to the original one which is a pain to use. Unless for collection purpose only, this crown is preferable to the old one.

    The main deciding factor should be whether you're comfortable with the price or not, and the only hold back for this watch is the somewhat aging dial.
     
  10. Peemacgee

    Peemacgee Purrrr-veyor of luxury cat box loungers May 28, 2015

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    I wasn't suggesting that the bracelet wasn't an Omega BOR -but from what I had read not a late 50's/ early 60's version -and it certainly has a value regardless of originality.
    but here is the extract that I was referring to -from Desmond's site:

    "Earlier stainless and gold plated vintage beads of rice bracelets can easily be distinguished from their newer counterparts by examining the links. The external, non-beaded links will be solid, rectangular and slightly bevelled on the edges, whereas more contemporary BOR bracelets have oval-shaped outer links. Vintage solid gold beads of rice bracelets, however, often have oval shaped outer links as do some 1970s rolled gold examples."

    http://users.tpg.com.au/mondodec//Omega_Constellation_Accessories_Part_2.pdf

    a new rotor is undoubtedly a better option than a worn one -but the OP did ask about anything that might not be original.

    -and I can confirm that the original crowns are a pain to use -not only to wind the watch but especially if you don't have a quick set date function. (luckily mine does!)

    as TNTwatch says -it all depends on price and what you are looking for -I would certainly happily wear this watch but not necessarily 'collect' it

    Philip
     
  11. navigator

    navigator May 28, 2015

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    Thanks for the clarifications. The seller is asking 1400 for it, which I think might be a little high given the above discussions. For a similar price he also has a solid 1950s 14k omega seamaster (caseback gx6546), which I will take a look at in person next week.
     
  12. navigator

    navigator May 30, 2015

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    The seller and I came to an agreement on price so I ended pulling the trigger.

    I found the numbers on the bracelet, the number "11" on the end links and "8220" on the clasp.

    Do those numbers correspond to a 1950s bracelet?
     
  13. Peemacgee

    Peemacgee Purrrr-veyor of luxury cat box loungers May 30, 2015

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    Congratulations on your new watch!
    welcome to the Constellation-owners club -it's likely to be addictive........

    if it hasn't been serviced -the mantra is -"get it serviced before you wear it"
    when you have the back off take pics of the inside of the case

    I have no info about end link numbers -I'm sure others more knowledgable than I will though.

    the 8220 refers to a 7 bead BOR bracelet (including outside links)
    mine is an 8270 -which is a 9 bead version.
    -all of this is in the link from Desmond's site I posted for you (look at the old adverts for the references)

    However, I think these references still hold true today -so won't date the watch strap (I still believe it to be a 'modern' strap i.e. not contemporary to the watch -but it's nice one for all that)

    Desmond's site is amazing -the best source of info on Constellations -so trawl through it to understand your Connie better.
    E.g. You'll see why folks here on OF think that the dial is original
    you will also be able to find out about the cal 561 movement -where it came from and what it evolved into -this is an incredibly good movement by the way -one of the best production movements ever made.

    As someone posted when I bought my Connie -for your first Vintage Omega, you really have started at the top
    (I'm sure the Speedy boys would disagree...)

    here are a couple of more links to help with research:

    Omega dates
    I couldn't quite read the serial number -what is it?
    find it here to date the watch (within a date range)
    http://ialreadyhaveawatch.com/watch-articles/omega/omega-serial-numbers-by-year/

    Omega database
    this should give you more info using case number, watch type etc.
    -warning, it can be tricky to find the right reference for some Connies in the database -there is lots of info missing -so don't be overly concerned if you can't find your exact watch as the case, the face and the movement on your watch tie up as being around at the same time -so look okay.
    http://www.omegawatches.com/planet-omega/heritage/vintage-watches-database

    Philip
     
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  14. navigator

    navigator May 30, 2015

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    Thanks Philip.

    The 561 movement is what finally sold me on the constellation over the 14k seamaster.

    I currently have a 2013 omega 8500 at, so the Connie should compliment it nicely.

    I'm enjoying learning about vintage omegas and hopefully will be able to contribute to the forum in the future.
     
  15. TNTwatch

    TNTwatch May 30, 2015

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    This 5 bead bracelet at least first appeared in a 1962 ad so it is appropriate for this movement serial number and this case.

    I've only seen the 7 bead appeared first in 1963 ad, not before.
     
  16. Peemacgee

    Peemacgee Purrrr-veyor of luxury cat box loungers May 30, 2015

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    reference Desmond's paper on bracelets -is there a conclusion on the style of the links being a later version?
     
  17. TNTwatch

    TNTwatch May 30, 2015

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    I haven't heard of a conclusion but you can check out the ads on old-omegas.com.