Omega Cal. 1320 vs 1325: Movement Differences & Repair

sheepdoll

134x is a way of writing 1340,1342,1343,1345 and 1346. These calibers all use the same motor.

You already have what you need for scanning to make a PCB in the photograph you circled.

I get zero ohms resistance in the bad motors and about 1.5k in the good motors.

My guess is Omega probably used the same coil across a range of calibers. That way they only needed one coil winder (which is a lathe. and a rotation counter) Sewing machine bobbin reminders are also coil winders. This can all be controlled by stepping motors. I have a custom winder for pipe organ magnet coils. (some which can be rewound using a drill press and a paper straw for a core.)

Resistance is determined by wire diameter, length and ohms law. The math for fitting the coils in the can is the same for figuring out how a mainspring fits in a barrel.

The linear lavete motors also have 1.5 to 1.7k in the maintenance sheet. The control chip may also be similar across calibers since etching chips is an expensive process. So they want to keep inventory on the low side.

Most likely these solder connections were done by hand, by women on an assembly line.

The wire gauge is really small probably somewhere around 60 to 120. Most coils are wound with 30 or so gauge. (larger number smaller wire.)

sheepdoll

Not quite sure I follow? The windings of the coil attach to the two solder points on the PCB.

On the 134x calibers there are springs on the electronics module what connects the traces. My guess this PCB is the difference between the calibers. Possibly as the manufactures were looking for the best way to handle this weak point.

The motors I have are glued and spot welded together. There is no indication that any of this can be serviced or replaced.

sheepdoll

Well that was a bust. I spent the morning letting google giggle tell about Time domain Reflectormitry. TDR. That only works on data cables with a return pair, like coax or Ethernet,

giggle suggested something called Inductive Signature Analysis or Ring Testing.

This told me how to test ignition coils.

Eventually I got something about capacitive testing. This was the best it could do.

I think the wire is too thin to do anything with it to recover the broken ends. The wire is too far embedded into the resin block to find the ends.

The way my winder works is there is a wick which activates the insulation with alcohol. As the coil is wound a heat source melts the insulation together. This results in a solid block of wire and resin. There is no way to reverse this.

Most of giggle's reference sites to places like WRT. Say to toss the coil and replace it.

The only other option would be to make a new coil.

given that the caps on my coils are spot welded. There really is no practical way to fix a coil where the ends are broken at the place your drawing asks where are they? The wire is simply too thin to support rework. The pcb is glued to the coil preventing access. Removing it may have destroyed the cable I was trying to test.

I may dismember one of the other coils, but I doubt that there is much that can be done to repair it. Does seem frustrating that a tiny piece of wire renders the watch useless.

I started playing with the quartz as I was getting frustrated with kinked hairsprings. Guess that is the nature of watches. Dependent on the tiniest piece of coiled wire.

sheepdoll

Well that was a bust. I spent the morning letting google giggle tell about Time domain Reflectormitry. TDR. That only works on data cables with a return pair, like coax or Ethernet,

giggle suggested something called Inductive Signature Analysis or Ring Testing.

This told me how to test ignition coils.

Eventually I got something about capacitive testing. This was the best it could do.

I think the wire is too thin to do anything with it to recover the broken ends. The wire is too far embedded into the resin block to find the ends.

The way my winder works is there is a wick which activates the insulation with alcohol. As the coil is wound a heat source melts the insulation together. This results in a solid block of wire and resin. There is no way to reverse this.

Most of giggle's reference sites to places like WRT. Say to toss the coil and replace it.

The only other option would be to make a new coil.

given that the caps on my coils are spot welded. There really is no practical way to fix a coil where the ends are broken at the place your drawing asks where are they? The wire is simply too thin to support rework. The pcb is glued to the coil preventing access. Removing it may have destroyed the cable I was trying to test.

I may dismember one of the other coils, but I doubt that there is much that can be done to repair it. Does seem frustrating that a tiny piece of wire renders the watch useless.

I started playing with the quartz as I was getting frustrated with kinked hairsprings. Guess that is the nature of watches. Dependent on the tiniest piece of coiled wire.

rafnsvartr

I am so sorry if it sounds a bit rude but could you please try to reply in a less vague way with less unrelated side info?
To just clarify - I am not sure my coil is broken and I never claimed it was. I just need to know how you measured the resistance in your coil? Where do I need to touch the probes IF the PCB is not attached? How did you manage? Because you did give me a resistance value - where do you have it from?

Other questions above are also a bit unrelated to that.
But the main question stays

-

Where do two terminals on the PCB and the coil itself touch physically? Where is that one precise point on the coil?

sheepdoll

The two points are physically soldered to the PCB board.

The outside of the can and the frame of the watch is + common. The current (and voltage) through the coil alternates between + and minus. So there is a positive pulse, a rest period then a negative pulse followed by a second rest period.

I have not successfully been able to re connect broken wires from the coil to the PCB board. They are too fragile and break under the pressure of the tweezers.

When I did manage to pull two wire ends from the coil and tin them with solder I got zero resistance.

The coil resistance 1.5k comes from reading a number of data sheets. This is the same number the google AI regurgitates. It comes from Physics and the 'laws' what govern how elecromagnetisim work.

The PCB is probably glued on to the PCB before the wires are soldered to the contact points. That glue is probably an epoxy resin glue which is cured by a catalytic reaction. Removing this probably damaged the coil further.

My guess is the coil is wound first around a former. This assembly is probably then glued to the PCB and the wires soldered using a fixture. The armature is then added in a separate process. possibly after the coil is inserted in the can and the bottom cap spot welded on. The armature with the jewel settings can be pressed out even while still in the can. The stater and the top cap are separate pieces. Not all the motors I have seen have the top cap which helps to stabilize the steps.

I do realize this may come across as unrelated side info. It does however relate as I find it helps understand the underlying issue and why these motors fail.

I think we have the same problem, and a lot of the same frustration. Even though the calibers, 1342 and 1320 are different. That the PCB snapped off the base of the can.

sheepdoll

The two points are physically soldered to the PCB board.

The outside of the can and the frame of the watch is + common. The current (and voltage) through the coil alternates between + and minus. So there is a positive pulse, a rest period then a negative pulse followed by a second rest period.

I have not successfully been able to re connect broken wires from the coil to the PCB board. They are too fragile and break under the pressure of the tweezers.

When I did manage to pull two wire ends from the coil and tin them with solder I got zero resistance.

The coil resistance 1.5k comes from reading a number of data sheets. This is the same number the google AI regurgitates. It comes from Physics and the 'laws' what govern how elecromagnetisim work.

The PCB is probably glued on to the PCB before the wires are soldered to the contact points. That glue is probably an epoxy resin glue which is cured by a catalytic reaction. Removing this probably damaged the coil further.

My guess is the coil is wound first around a former. This assembly is probably then glued to the PCB and the wires soldered using a fixture. The armature is then added in a separate process. possibly after the coil is inserted in the can and the bottom cap spot welded on. The armature with the jewel settings can be pressed out even while still in the can. The stater and the top cap are separate pieces. Not all the motors I have seen have the top cap which helps to stabilize the steps.

I do realize this may come across as unrelated side info. It does however relate as I find it helps understand the underlying issue and why these motors fail.

I think we have the same problem, and a lot of the same frustration. Even though the calibers, 1342 and 1320 are different. That the PCB snapped off the base of the can.