OMEGA 420 1954 CAL 2759 1-SC 2761

[Nick W]

Hello All, I recently purchase this 1954 (14 mil) Omega Seamaster caliber 420, it looks reasonably original IMO. Has the Omega mark visible on the crystal and the crown looks original but I would appreciate any thoughts or observations. Certainly very pretty when you get the right light on the dial.

 

[gbesq]

I haven't seen this particular two tone dial variant, but the watch looks original to me. Case is in very good condition with the original edges still visible on the lugs. Movement also looks to be in good condition. Dial obviously shows some patina and the hands and markers show some oxidation, but that's not unusual for a watch from the 1950s. The crown is incorrect, but that can be replaced.

 

[Nick W]

gbesq

I haven't seen this particular two tone dial variant, but the watch looks original to me. Case is in very good condition with the original edges still visible on the lugs. Movement also looks to be in good condition. Dial obviously shows some patina and the hands and markers show some oxidation, but that's not unusual for a watch from the 1950s. The crown is incorrect, but that can be replaced.

Hello gbesq, thankyou for the quick reply. Re. the crown, how might I be able to find an original ?

 

[gbesq]

N Nick W

Hello gbesq, thankyou for the quick reply. Re. the crown, how might I be able to find an original ?

A "clover" style crown would be correct for this reference. I don't know if a modern equivalent is available from Swatch/Omega, but you can probably source an authentic vintage replacement by looking on eBay or the watch parts and accessories for sale forum on OF.

 

[seekingseaquest]

Actually, the clover crown isn’t correct for this reference, and the correct crown will be nearly possible to find. See the one I posted here for what it would have looked like originally.

I’d just keep the one you have - it’s what Omega probably would have installed if replaced during service anyway.

 

[gbesq]

seekingseaquest

Actually, the clover crown isn’t correct for this reference, and the correct crown will be nearly possible to find. See the one I posted here for what it would have looked like originally.

I’d just keep the one you have - it’s what Omega probably would have installed if replaced during service anyway.

Thanks, Phil. I've seen the clover crown on a number of these, but I'll take your word for it and appreciate the correction. Perhaps the clover crown appears on many of these references because the original type that you cite is so difficult to source?

 

[DON]

Dial has been refinished. Minute marks should be further out to match the hands

Old refinish due to the bubbling of the paint. Moisture underneath which accounts for the little corrosion on the case

Movement very clean

 

[gbesq]

Here’s the honeycomb dial on my 2761 which I know to be original. The minute track appears to have a similar placement to the markers as the OP’s watch. I’m not saying that the dial isn’t an old refinish (I generally agree with your comments, DON), but I’m not sure whether the placement of the minute track is the sure sign of a redial. I’ll have to go back and take a look at some more photos of genuine examples.

 

[seekingseaquest]

DON

Dial has been refinished. Minute marks should be further out to match the hands

Old refinish due to the bubbling of the paint. Moisture underneath which accounts for the little corrosion on the case

Movement very clean

This is another anomaly of this reference - they all came like this originally.

 

[DON]

gbesq

Here’s the honeycomb dial on my 2761 which I know to be original. The minute track appears to have a similar placement to the markers as the OP’s watch. I’m not saying that the dial isn’t an old refinish (I generally agree with your comments, DON), but I’m not sure whether the placement of the minute track is the sure sign of a redial. I’ll have to go back and take a look at some more photos of genuine examples.

Notch at 9 and inner dial not very round

 

[gbesq]

DON

Notch at 9 and inner dial not very round

Ah, I see it. Thanks.

 

[gatorcpa]

DON

Notch at 9 and inner dial not very round

Not enough evidence for me. You give 1950’s Omega too much credit.

I would need to see underneath dial to look for notations from redialler.
gatorcpa

 

[Dr No]

Dial and hands look ok to me.

I owned a '53 ref 2667 . . .



. . . which was gifted to a friend a few years ago. The cal 420 movement was an exceptionally good performer after my watchmaker serviced it.

Note the crown; I believe it's original.

Art

 

[Dr No]

Later '50s models would have had a crown like G B Esq's submission in this thread, and this ref 2761 . . .



. . . that belongs to a friend.

Art

 

[gbesq]

This has become an interesting thread. Is the OP's watch a redial? Maybe. Does the OP's watch have the correct crown? Maybe. Just goes to show that well informed OF members can disagree. At least we all seem to concur that the case and the movement appear to be in good shape. 😀 Personally, the 2759/2761 is one of my favorite Seamaster references because there are so many dial variations.

 

[DON]

gatorcpa

Not enough evidence for me. You give 1950’s Omega too much credit.

I would need to see underneath dial to look for notations from redialler.
gatorcpa

My refinisher never marked any dial on the underside. Neither did the other two I used sometimes.

I have other used refinished dials and none marked

Why would you think a refinisher would signed or mark the dial? It's not like a watchmaker who lets the next know when the movement was last serviced

Did a re-check on 10 dials (not from my suppliers). 3 had markings. One of them 1174. One looked like a name. Others blank except for a stamped number

As I mentioned previously. If a manufacture was going to do a series of dials. They are going to make a jig for a production run in order to get them done and out and most test samples are usually tossed

What reason would there be for the factory to notch the dial? On an improperly printed dial. A notch would be of no use as all markings would be out of alinement and you can't notch a blank dial unless you have two reference points which you would get with a small seconds dial and 2 holes to line up.

If Omega refinished the dial. It's still a refinished dial

I've refinished about 400 dials and wrote an article on dials in the TimeZone archives. I would think I had some knowledge on dials

Edited: Jun 27, 2023

 

[gatorcpa]

I’ve seen many with job numbers scratched in back. Although, I agree that it is not definitive.

I have also seen original dials that have been notched.

So, the bottom line for me is that I simply cannot say that this dial is original or redone.
gatorcpa

 

[Dan S]

Here's a similar one that I sold, but it stayed in the OF family. I guess it could be the photo, but I have to admit that I see some anomalies on the OP dial.

Edited: Jun 27, 2023

 

[Archer]

A notch is not definitive...there are plenty of brand new dials with notches. That old pearl of wisdom needs to die...

 

[Nick W]

gbesq

Thanks, Phil. I've seen the clover crown on a number of these, but I'll take your word for it and appreciate the correction. Perhaps the clover crown appears on many of these references because the original type that you cite is so difficult to source?

Hello both, thankyou so much for your feedback and thoughts. It's a keeper for sure.