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  1. Raymondo5508

    Raymondo5508 Dec 25, 2016

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    Hi,
    I was wondering if any of the members could help me with this very early movement and dial printing style. Is this a chronometre grade movement? Is the style of print the earliest that Omega used? This for me is the earliest movement serial i have seen in a wrist watch before. Have Omega 1.9 mill serial movement.jpg Omega 1.9 mill serial dial.jpg the members seen any earlier?
    Cheers.
     
  2. trim

    trim Dec 29, 2016

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    Hi,

    does look like a C grade. Its a 13'''NN - related to the later 13''' SB etc, you can see my somewhat later one here:

    https://omegaforums.net/threads/1916-omega-13-sb-trench-watch.41387/

    It seems most likely as this is a 0s neg set movement that it was originally in a small fob watch - but this is not certainly true. There is an earlier Labrador (Omega) movement that Omega shows in their book as in a WW demi hunter, IRCC the serial was about 1.1 Million. Here:

    [​IMG]
     
    Edited Dec 30, 2016
  3. OMTOM

    OMTOM Dec 29, 2016

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    The movement has no stem retaining screw. How is the stem held in place?
     
  4. François Pépin

    François Pépin Dec 30, 2016

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    It is very likely a NN as said above, so it has a special keyless work with a several parts stem.

    You can get an idea of this device in the pics here:

    http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&2&2uswk&Omega_19LOBNN

    Usually with these movements the movement get off the case without removing the stem. It means you pull the movement from the part of the stem that has the crown, which remains in the case. I hope I am making that clear enough!
     
  5. OMTOM

    OMTOM Dec 30, 2016

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    The following is an Omega illustration of their 13’’’ NN S – which strangely DOES show a stem retaining screw. Maybe it’s wrong?
    AJTT p.793 13 NN.jpg
     
  6. trim

    trim Dec 30, 2016

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    Actually this is quite interesting. Yes the OP's calibre is a negative set model intended for fitting in size 0 american cases. These have no stem retaining screw as the stem is retained in the case - these do not use the famous 8760 patent. The other ones for Swiss production used a conventional positive set stem and uses the famous 8760 patent.

    I actually own a very early Negative set which uses the 8760 patent and differs from the later neg sets, I should photograph it sometime, and the neg set examples I have as there are no accurate references out there. I also have some of the Regina versions too.

    But yeah, I guess Omega just reused some existing artwork, as there is no need for a stem retaining screw for a neg set movement, and is the usual tell.

    Grades (roughly - yeah I wrote some of these, so don't believe it is accurate)

    A - 7 jewel, pin in cock, plain regulator
    B - 15 Jewels, plain regulator
    Bsp - 15 Jewels, whip regulator
    BB - 15 Jewels, screwed collets, whip regulator
    C = "C" quality (15/16/17/19 jewels incl. 7 or 8 collets), regulator adjuster with screws or with snail star-wheel
    CC = Fine "C" quality.

    I now think on it, yours is probably a BB grade but could be a C - you might have to ask Omega. Chronometers start at grade CCR I understand.
     
    Edited Dec 30, 2016
  7. François Pépin

    François Pépin Dec 30, 2016

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    As explained by Trim, it could be some inconsistancy due to the fact reused devices in other calibers. But it could also be an error in the title of the model because, if it is a true NN, it should normaly not have a stem extending out the caliber.
     
  8. Raymondo5508

    Raymondo5508 Dec 31, 2016

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    Hi,
    Many thanks for all your information and help on this movement. I still have to receive the watch as i have just bought it. It looks high grade and well finished with the Reeds whiplash regulator. It is in an A.W.C.Co gold filled case. When i receive it i will have my watchmaker have a good look at it.
    It is still the lowest Omega wrist watch serial i have seen to date. I have plenty of 4 million serial watches in Omega cases.
    Cheers Russell.
     
    Tire-comedon likes this.
  9. Raymondo5508

    Raymondo5508 Dec 31, 2016

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    I will send for an extract from the archives from Omega...
     
  10. trim

    trim Dec 31, 2016

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    I would be very interested in you coming back and letting us know what yours states. I had no luck getting records for an early Labrador, I haven't tried a more recent early movement.

    Anyway an AWCC (Toronto) case makes sense - most the Canadian watches, Regina and Private labels seem to be in them - I have several. I believe that Ed Ueberall stated that only the lower grade Omegas sold in North America were housed in Omega cases. He noted that the higher grades are found in Canadian or U.S. made cases, since they were exported as movements only and cased on the other side of the Atlantic..

    I posted this watch of mine in another thread, but I'll repost it here, which is in an Philadelphia Sterling case, and dating a bit later than yours to about 1908-10. Its a private label 13NN and likely B grade.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    Edited Dec 31, 2016
    François Pépin likes this.
  11. Raymondo5508

    Raymondo5508 Dec 31, 2016

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    Thanks Trim for that info on the cases. That is still a nice watch and dial with early serial. Be interesting to see what the Omega Archives say.
    Cheers Russell.
     
  12. trim

    trim Dec 31, 2016

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    Hi, it'd be nice to see some of them - always need more trench watches around here :thumbsup:
     
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  13. Tire-comedon

    Tire-comedon First Globemaster Jan 1, 2017

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    Yes! I vote for more trench wathes here!
     
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