I posted this at NAWCC but thought I'd see if anyone here can help too.

I’m new to vintage watches, but I now know just enough to wonder what exactly I bought when I purchased my first watch.

On EBay I bought what the seller said was a 1945 Longines, caliber 12.68N, serial # on the movement is in the 6.885.xxx range. The seller posted a photo of what they said was an email from Longines.

What’s now odd is that I’m looking at what the Longines email says is the reference number—5638–and I can’t find any mention of a Longines 5638 online anywhere (including in this forum).

I don’t have the tools to open the watch myself, so I’m going off the photos that the seller provided.

So I am now puzzled as to what I have. As it happens, I really like the watch, it keeps good time, and it cost me $325. So unless it is a total junker, I don’t feel like I’m out a great deal of money, even though it needs a service.

OTOH I’m puzzled as to why I can’t find any mention of a 5638 reference number for Longines. I did find a 5774 here, so 5638 doesn’t seem completely implausible. And if someone faked it, why go to the trouble of producing an “email” from Longines but providing a nonexistent reference number?

I’ve also noticed that the minute hand looks like it may be of a difference style from the hour hand. Both are blue, but the hour hand has a curvature that isn’t really there in the minute hand. But I can only tell if that’s a deviation if I can find other examples of the same reference number, which gets me back to the original problem.

Any thoughts? Is this a frankenwatch?

Thanks for any advice or pointers!

 

The reason for the lack of information on ref. 5638, and many other Longines references, is twofold. Firstly, reference numbers were not marked on Longines watches until the late 1940s so most collectors do not discuss pre-1950s Longines in terms of reference numbers. There are of course exceptions for very collectible references. Secondly, Longines made thousands of references (as far as I know) so there is unlikely to be information available for every single one.

Your watch is not a franken. The movement and case belong together. Unfortunately, the dial has been refinished. Additionally, the second hand and crown are incorrect replacements. It is difficult to assess the hour/minute hands from the photos provided.

Below is another example with the same order number as your watch (23016). This watch should also be a ref. 5638. The dial, crown, and second hand all look original. However, the hour and minute hands are mismatched.




https://www.watchuseek.com/threads/longines-efco-case-ref-number.5250457/

 

Here is another ref. 5638:




https://www.phillips.com/detail/longines/CH080217/178

 

This is really helpful - thank you!
Can you make any guesses about the dial? The font on mine obviously doesn't resemble at all the one on the photos you provided. Would you guess that it is a true Longines dial, but from another watch/reference? Is there any way to know more about the dial (short of pulling the watch apart)?

 

To me, the dial appears to have been refinished. This means that the printing and surface finish are not original. However, I would guess that the dial itself (i.e. the brass disk with feet) is original to the watch. I do not think that the dial came from another watch or reference. It was quite common to refinish dials. As you noted, the fonts on your dial do not match the other two examples that I posted. In this instance, it is the font of "Longines" that serves as an important indicator. Additionally, the visible dial foot of your dial appears to be silver in tone. The vast majority of original dials from this period have copper-toned feet, whereas many refinished dials have silver feet. See dial feet encircled below.

 

While this is true, I should have said that most dials with silver feet have been refinished.

 

This is so helpful. Thanks for your patient and thorough explanations!

It’s interesting that whoever refinished the dial didn’t choose (or bother?) to use a serif font for the logo, which the examples you listed clearly do.

 

I have seen stranger things on refinished dials but I agree, it is surprising that someone would make that decision. I will add that there were original dials from the 1940s with signatures that did not have serifs (see example below). These dials were primarily found in watches for the American market. I think that it is unlikely that your watch has one of these correct, sans-serif signature dials given that it was originally sold to Switzerland, has a silver dial foot, and has somewhat atypical hour numerals.




https://www.horol.com/items/cat6/0215.html

 

Very interesting site BTW. Never found that on google