Just watched the movie “Contagion”

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In terms of vaccines (this is not anti vaccination or anti medical as I use both and it has saved my life) things can go wrong and it is good to have balances and control groups.

I have to say, in all good nature which I hope comes across, that I simply can’t understand your angle or your insistence upon it.

Wherever the v-word is brought up you pop in, as here and elsewhere, with some version of “things can go wrong and it is good to have balances and control groups.” The way you raise it, one almost looks around to find whomever you’re correcting, as if someone else had just insisted “things can never go wrong and it is bad to have balances and control groups.”

It seems your instinctive response is to assume that no one around you is aware of how both science and cost-benefit analyses works, and it’s your responsibility to insist upon it?

For what it’s worth, you should know it comes across a bit like the following scene:

[group of people getting into a car, chatting casually]

Driver: “everyone buckle up!”

Omegafanman: “Don’t get me wrong I’m buckling up, but did you know that car manufacturers sometimes make errors in their production of seat belts or air bags, that then lead to people sustaining injuries or death due to those malfunctions? Did you also know that it is possible to find cases of vehicle accidents involving flood or fire where the use of a seatbelt actually caused injury or death? We should buckle up but at the same time remember that it is good for car manufacturers to test their equipment and that sometimes things can go wrong”

Driver: “yes, you mentioned that also yesterday on the way to lunch, and the day before that”
 
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I have to say, in all good nature which I hope comes across, that I simply can’t understand your angle or your insistence upon it.

Wherever the v-word is brought up you pop in, as here and elsewhere, with some version of “things can go wrong and it is good to have balances and control groups.” The way you raise it, one almost looks around to find whomever you’re correcting, as if someone else had just insisted “things can never go wrong and it is bad to have balances and control groups.”

It seems your instinctive response is to assume that no one around you is aware of how both science and cost-benefit analyses works, and it’s your responsibility to insist upon it?

For what it’s worth, you should know it comes across a bit like the following scene:

[group of people getting into a car, chatting casually]

Driver: “everyone buckle up!”

Omegafanman: “Don’t get me wrong I’m buckling up, but did you know that car manufacturers sometimes make errors in their production of seat belts or air bags, that then lead to people sustaining injuries or death due to those malfunctions? Did you also know that it is possible to find cases of vehicle accidents involving flood or fire where the use of a seatbelt actually caused injury or death? We should buckle up but at the same time remember that it is good for car manufacturers to test their equipment and that sometimes things can go wrong”

Driver: “yes, you mentioned that also yesterday on the way to lunch, and the day before that”

My last serious post on the topic was Jan the 16th (in this thread) - I have slept since then..... it was a BBC article and seemed to be good news story- and now on the 26th Jan we are still on track to reduce the rules in England and so far, we have avoided a vaccine passport system. We (well UK Gov) are about to insist on mandatory vaccination of NHS workers which I do not support. They have not done that in Wales, Scotland or Ireland which is odd as the Covid rules are tougher in those local countries. I don’t think the NHS can afford to lose any experienced staff - especially in maternity care which it has been indicated might be hard hit by people leaving. In terms of risk benefit some hard numbers I found out this week (which were a big surprise for me) - The NHS pays out £2-£3 billion on medical fault claims each year (pre-covid) - but they have a contingency fund of £83 billion (again pre-covid). That is because a high percentage of the claims by value are for birth incidents - and life time claims for birth injury are very expensive (this is from the BMJ). To put this in context the nuclear decommissioning authority only has £131 billion contingency so £83 billion is a big number for health care error claims - so losing 6-10% of your experienced maternity staff could be a very bad move. I am in touch with some eminent, very qualified and honoured people in the UK who are keen to stop that - so there is a case to put a balanced view (IMHO) as clearly UK Gov does not agree. I had no intention to spew all this out / my last post was very vanilla and positive I thought. Hopefully the English situation continues to improve and other countries follow that trend - (and I know there is much luck in that for all countries). Being very open I am rather keen to avoid posting / responding to Covid related information and have mostly stopped doing that on this forum.
 
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We just watched the movie Don’t Look Up two nights ago. Although a bit of a dark comedy, it left us both despondent afterwards. It really speaks to how we, globally, deal with natural disasters that affect us all.
 
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@Omegafanman My bad, I actually did not notice (but should have) the age of that post or I would thought differently (better) of re-raising it

I was out too late last night and in need of far more coffee 👍
 
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We just watched the movie Don’t Look Up two nights ago. Although a bit of a dark comedy, it left us both despondent afterwards. It really speaks to how we, globally, deal with natural disasters that affect us all.

Started it and got about half way before we turned it off. Not our type of humor I guess. The unfortunate reality is I honestly believe a portion of the worlds population would react in the same exact manner.
 
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Started it and got about half way before we turned it off. Not our type of humor I guess. The unfortunate reality is I honestly believe a portion of the worlds population would react in the same exact manner.
I was told going in, this movie may really piss you off…and it did- was really too on the nose.
 
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thanks for the heads up on Don’t Look Up. We’ve been trying to keep things light lately, so going back through silly stuff like 30 Rock and Futurama.
 
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I was told going in, this movie may really piss you off…and it did- was really too on the nose.

For me, felt like a Saturday Night Live sketch that they decided to turn into a 2.5hr movie

Poignant, thought-provoking, but ultimately could have achieved 80% of the point in 5% of the time
 
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We already have seen a rise in these and others. Whether it gets to pandemic proportions or not remains to be seen. But at the rate un-immunized people are being allowed into the U.S. (legally or not) these previously all but eradicated disease’s will increase. Just my thoughts.
If people vaccinated then people comming in don’t matter.
 
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thanks for the heads up on Don’t Look Up. We’ve been trying to keep things light lately, so going back through silly stuff like 30 Rock and Futurama.
Oh, it’s not light! It has moments of roll your eyes and chuckle, but it’s one of those- have to laugh otherwise we would cry.