How many female members now?

Syrte · Aug 2, 2022

M'Bob
I came across this advertisement recently, and since this thread has grown some interesting sociological tentacles, it would be interesting to hear members opinions of it, with the hope that we can recognize with our responses that people look at things differently, and we don’t demonize anyone who doesn’t perceive it like we do.

This lawyer either came up with this herself, or approved it, with the obvious intent of increasing her business. Either way, implicit is the idea that she thinks it’s okay:

Now, some may find it a lighthearted nod to (hopefully) outdated female stereotypes. Some, on the other hand, will find it completely offensive. And of course, that’s not to imply that those are the only legitimate responses. But what do you all think?

The fact ONE woman may be catering to a sexist audience in an unspecified region of the United States where she expects her clients to be sexist doesn’t mean it’s worthy of discussion on an international forum, and I don’t see why you should hold it up as an example worthy of us considering. That billboard shows idiocy can exist equally within all genders, is that a surprise?

Except to say indeed you’re choosing to air and repost a sexist stereotype knowing full well it will be perceived as such. There are many people here who are argumentative and yet they are men— and their face (and perhaps yours?) would fit equally well on that billboard.

Not sure what profound point we’re making with all that.

Omegafanman · Aug 2, 2022

As an aside (and back to the OP) I still think the idea of a survey to give any ladies a chance to give their views on what would make the forums better for them is a good idea.

wrist time · Aug 2, 2022

Syrte
Not sure what profound point we’re making with all that.

His point is to try to move the goal post with whataboutism. It didn't work with his made up stories about made up people so he tried the billboard.

NGO1 · Aug 2, 2022

blufinz52
Give me a break. If you find that post bizarre and creepy than you either are way too sensitive or just have h***-o* for M'Bob .

not if Bob has a history of pissing on women and people of color.. The 'joke' he made about Lewis Hamilton would have gotten him fired any where in corporate America. As a matter of fact, a young engineer was fired earlier in the year for making a similar joke in a work forum. If you don't know where the line is, find out. Don't make it up.

dsio · Aug 2, 2022

Omegafanman
As an aside (and back to the OP) I still think the idea of a survey to give any ladies a chance to give their views on what would make the forums better for them is a good idea.

That’s already what this thread is doing is acting as a survey…

Omegafanman · Aug 2, 2022

dsio
That’s already what this thread is doing is acting as a survey…

I was thinking more private PM to that 17% so they can be open on what works for them and any concerns about the current setup (separate section or not etc) - like a suggestions box. Blokes are not the ones to decide or comment on that.

Dan S · Aug 2, 2022

Omegafanman
I was thinking more private PM to that 17% so they can be open on what works for them and any concerns about the current setup (separate section or not etc) - like a suggestions box. Blokes are not the ones to decide or comment on that.

I was inferring that the 17% referred to users, not necessarily members. But I agree with you that the goal is to hear from some of the women who don't typically participate. And it does not seem that this thread is a totally safe space.

pdxleaf · Aug 2, 2022

wrist time
The fact that you were able to gain knowledge and perspective without having to put in the effort to seek it out sounds great. For you. Hopefully you've availed yourself of the many articles or videos or book on these subjects to further expand your understanding. Maybe you could use the knowledge you gained to actively educate others. Take some of the burden off those who already have to deal with these things in multiple aspects of their lives. Especially since they would be opening themselves up for direct attack if the person they reach out to isn't as open mined as you.

Point taken. It's not my intention to diminish either the impact or experiences of others. Neither would I suggest that one person's experiences are universal.

Neither has my life been without effort, which I think you intended to be sarcastic.

My primary point i am/was attempting to make is that if people are going to have a dialog, we should be open and candid. What i say might be wrong or insensitive, not out of malice, but out of lack of understanding. (Yes, malicious behavior exists but that's a different issue.) If I am personally attacked as ignorant, rude or worse, then there is no further conversation. I can no longer hear the other person, who may actually have some excellent experiences that I could learn from.

My personal perception of America where I live, is that we are entering dangerous times, where we are quick to demonize the other. My family has experienced wars first hand. I do not believe America is immune.

This is beginning to be melodramatic. But i don't think it's exaggerated.

The one point I suggest is that the personal messaging tool is helpful and available. I may write something different in a group thread than I would write to an individual. It doesn't always work, as I said earlier. I previously made the mistake of commenting in a public thread about a joke someone shared. I later pmed the person to say that i was offended and to try to explain why. By then it was too late and they rightfully told me to F'off. But, as I said earlier, others have been more magnanimous and accepted my apologies after the fact and we are now good friends.

There are people here who I heartily disagree with politically, and they with me. Yet we manage to be if not friends, then friendly in our shared community.

Again, i wouldn't dream to know what it's like to be anyone else. Sometimes I even wonder at how much I know about myself. You are right to challenge me on that and I agree that i shouldn't pretend to understand what it's like for others.

My one suggestion is to try to give people the benefit of the doubt, try to understand their reasons, express your own truths without excuse, and hope to if not change someone's mind, at least give them something to think about. IMHO, a personal message can be more effective then a public posting.

Cheers,

Dave

Dave

dsio · Aug 2, 2022

Omegafanman
I was thinking more private PM to that 17% so they can be open on what works for them and any concerns about the current setup (separate section or not etc) - like a suggestions box. Blokes are not the ones to decide or comment on that.

Ok yea we have been chatting privately to several over the last few days and more are against adding a new forum topic than for it on that front.

Dan S
I was inferring that the 17% referred to users, not necessarily members. But I agree with you that the goal is to hear from some of the women who don't typically participate. And it does not seem that this thread is a totally safe space.

The 17-19% is overall viewers not members specifically, It’s definitely a much lower percentage of members and the fact that such a small proportion actually register and participate is really the crux of the thread as they do read but prefer to not get involved from what our data shows.

Scarecrow Boat · Aug 2, 2022

blufinz52
I didn't say you are 'too sensitive'

blufinz52
I said you are either too sensitive or

Same thing

dsio · Aug 2, 2022

Yea let’s not go down the Facebook memes path here please.

wrist time · Aug 2, 2022

pdxleaf
Point taken. It's not my intention to diminish either the impact or experiences of others. Neither would I suggest that one person's experiences are universal.

Neither has my life been without effort, which I think you intended to be sarcastic.

My primary point i am/was attempting to make is that if people are going to have a dialog, we should be open and candid. What i say might be wrong or insensitive, not out of malice, but out of lack of understanding. (Yes, malicious behavior exists but that's a different issue.) If I am personally attacked as ignorant, rude or worse, then there is no further conversation. I can no longer hear the other person, who may actually have some excellent experiences that I could learn from.

My personal perception of America where I live, is that we are entering dangerous times, where we are quick to demonize the other. My family has experienced wars first hand. I do not believe America is immune.

This is beginning to be melodramatic. But i don't think it's exaggerated.

The one point I suggest is that the personal messaging tool is helpful and available. I may write something different in a group thread than I would write to an individual. It doesn't always work, as I said earlier. I previously made the mistake of commenting in a public thread about a joke someone shared. I later pmed the person to say that i was offended and to try to explain why. By then it was too late and they rightfully told me to F'off. But, as I said earlier, others have been more magnanimous and accepted my apologies after the fact and we are now good friends.

There are people here who I heartily disagree with politically, and they with me. Yet we manage to be if not friends, then friendly in our shared community.

Again, i wouldn't dream to know what it's like to be anyone else. Sometimes I even wonder at how much I know about myself. You are right to challenge me on that and I agree that i shouldn't pretend to understand what it's like for others.

My one suggestion is to try to give people the benefit of the doubt, try to understand their reasons, express your own truths without excuse, and hope to if not change someone's mind, at least give them something to think about. IMHO, a personal message can be more effective then a public posting.

Cheers,

Dave

Dave

There was no sarcasm in my post. People were generous to you with their time and effort. That's not how people on the receiving end of isms tend to experience things. Would you advise your daughters to give every man who says something insensitive the benefit of the doubt? At work how much of their time and effort should they take away from their career to explain things that the other person could easily learn by doing a google search. After dealing with that a work should they come home and repeat the process with some stranger on a watch forum?

Syrte · Aug 2, 2022

dsio
That’s already what this thread is doing is acting as a survey…

Isn’t there some sort of gizmo which could be put into a sticky thread with various multiple choice questions for lurkers to click on, and perhaps a box for suggestions?
There’s only about 4 women participating in this thread - and all who already made an active choice to take part, we don’t really represent the silent majority that’s browsing without posting. Mind you there’s also many male visitors w hi are happy to browse without posting…

Edit/ add, oops, just realized someone else essentially asked a similar question.

perks713 · Aug 2, 2022

I’ve bought some ladies watches and I wouldn’t mind having a specific place to post about them and ask questions. Posting them in the vintage omega forum can be hit and miss, there seems to be a limited number of members with deep knowledge so catching their attention can be difficult.

What I really don’t want is a ‘recommended ladies watches on eBay thread’… my daughter’s (3 years old) watch collection is out pacing mine, I don’t need the temptation to buy more 😀

connieseamaster · Aug 2, 2022

perks713
I’ve bought some ladies watches and I wouldn’t mind having a specific place to post about them and ask questions. Posting them in the vintage omega forum can be hit and miss, there seems to be a limited number of members with deep knowledge so catching their attention can be difficult.

What I really don’t want is a ‘recommended ladies watches on eBay thread’… my daughter’s (3 years old) watch collection is out pacing mine, I don’t need the temptation to buy more 😀

I'm all for equal opportunity enabling 😉

Olhenry56 · Aug 3, 2022

Could it be possible to prompt nonmember users to become members after several minutes (enough time to safely assume the user is interested in the forum's content). The response options could include something like "Yes, sign me up", "No, I'm not interested in participating in a watch forum", or "No, I'm interested in participating in a watch forum, but not this forum" and if they select the last option, kindly ask them to help OF improve by giving their reason(s). Could include reasons for users to select, including not feeling welcome based on gender, and an open ended response for further details.

I'm not sure how much response we'd actually get from that, but might be worth kicking around the idea.

I also like the idea of a sticky thread with a "suggestions box" kind of thing for lurking female members to speak freely. This sticky thread could also serve as a reminder to members (and maybe a signal to potential new members) that the issue is important to the community.

sheepdoll · Aug 3, 2022

I think it is like hearding cats ...

People also do not like to feel manupulated, which can go either way as manipulators often play that to their advantage.

For some reason humans have also evolved over the last 5000 or more years into a broadcast society. Where most of the tribe simply listens to what they already want to hear.

-j

Applepie · Aug 7, 2022

Syrte
Hi everyone,
I heard on some other forums some female members saying theybfelt they had to hide when they join a watch community, due to the large numbers of men.

I wonder if any are in hiding- and how many we now have in plain sight. There weren’t so many when I joined it seems, we’ve seen @connieseamaster @NYCwatchgal and @melanieux, maybe @Melanieds?, and now a lady watchmaker hobbyist @sheepdoll has joined the membership.

Anyone else ? Come out and be welcomed, this is a friendly place. 😀

Best regards to all,
S

Another lady collector here! Mostly vintage watches.

I hid for a while, I admit. Maybe I was a bit afraid of making a fool of myself asking questions. But alas, nobody is omniscient. So here I am. I posted in the ‚new member‘ area of open discussions, for those who might be interested.

padders · Aug 7, 2022

Applepie
Another lady collector here! Mostly vintage watches.

I hid for a while, I admit. Maybe I was a bit afraid of making a fool of myself asking questions. But alas, nobody is omniscient. So here I am. I posted in the ‚new member‘ area of open discussions, for those who might be interested.

Oh don't worry about the silly questions thing. We are utterly fair here and unprejudiced, everyone is treated with equal contempt 😉

Spruce · Aug 7, 2022

Applepie
Another lady collector here! Mostly vintage watches.

I hid for a while, I admit. Maybe I was a bit afraid of making a fool of myself asking questions. But alas, nobody is omniscient. So here I am. I posted in the ‚new member‘ area of open discussions, for those who might be interested.

And you’re very welcome😀