Hey you 'muricans ... get those Swiss watches pronto [tariffs and international trade]

glownyc · Wed. 3:07am

pdxleaf
That's not what he's saying. He's saying that if anyone says something positive about the current state of the USA, then they are accused of being a Nazi.

Nah. The whole "people think 50% of Americans are Nazis" is an attempt to dismiss and downplay the pointing out and criticism of fascist behavior.

pdxleaf · Wed. 6:28am

glownyc
Nah. The whole "people think 50% of Americans are Nazis" is an attempt to dismiss and downplay the pointing out and criticism of fascist behavior.

That's possible too. But yet another thread and in a another direction.

The Father · Wed. 7:10am

p4ul
America, the country and people, have many positives and negatives like all countries. The ‘50% Nazis’ is, I think, overstating the number but unfortunately the few seem to have an inordinate amount of influence at this time.
As a Brit I have felt what is known as the special relationship all my life but that feeling is eroded daily by the current politics.

There we go the first one. Not really 50% Nazis. What is it? 45% 42.5%?
The country that defeated the horrific Nazis of Germanic Europe, but here we the first one to state he isn’t sure how many Americans are Nazis.
Thank God we are not 50% Nazis. That for clearing that up.

The Father · Wed. 7:18am

Like it has been said, the thread veered off tariffs policy. It veered off by the bashing America and the current Administration.

The “tariff policy” in effect few weeks. Damn, let it play out. Trump didn’t get elected to sit around and let things be as is. In 4 years we will all see what the result is. If Amrica is the mess that you fear elect AOC or Newsome. Hell, elected Bernie if the old bastard is alive. Old bastard is term of endearment.

Dan S · Wed. 7:27am

To connect back to tariffs, I will note that raising tariffs is straight out of the authoritarian playbook as part of isolationism. Indeed one of Hitler's first actions was to raise tariffs in an effort to make Germany self-sufficient.

Currently, many comparisons are being made to policies being implemented by Trump and other authoritarian leaders, past and present. The comparisons are apt, IMO, and it's a distraction to feign outrage about it. Nobody is claiming that Trump will engage in genocide.

bsowers34 · Wed. 7:28am

The Father
Like it has been said, the thread veered off tariffs policy. It veered off by the bashing America and the current Administration.

The “tariff policy” in effect few weeks. Damn, let it play out. Trump didn’t get elected to sit around and let things be as is. In 4 years we will all see what the result is. If Amrica is the mess that you fear elect AOC or Newsome. Hell, elected Bernie if the old bastard is alive. Old bastard is term of endearment.

In 4 years the USA will not exist. Ended at 249 years.

p4ul · Wed. 7:33am

The Father
There we go the first one. Not really 50% Nazis. What is it? 45% 42.5%?
The country that defeated the horrific Nazis of Germanic Europe, but here we the first one to state he isn’t sure how many Americans are Nazis.
Thank God we are not 50% Nazis. That for clearing that up.

“America, the country and people, have many positives and negatives like all countries. The ‘50% Nazis’ is, I think, overstating the number but unfortunately the few seem to have an inordinate amount of influence at this time.“

Did you not read FEW? Or the previous sentence? You mentioned 50%.

National Socialism, commonly known as Nazism, is a far-right totalitarian ideology associated with Adolf Hitler and the Nazi Party in Germany. It emphasizes extreme nationalism, racial superiority, and authoritarian governance, often leading to violent and oppressive practices, particularly against minority groups.

This definition has some similarities to what appears to be happening in the US.

@Dan S ‘s point above is also salient.

gatorcpa · Wed. 7:54am

Whenever a leader demands personal loyalty over their own conscience, that makes me nervous. One can easily quit your job in a private business if your view doesn’t match that of your boss.

Not so easy to quit when it comes to your country.
gatorcpa

noelekal · Wed. 8:02am

Do we have evidence that such demands are made in the current administration in a way that were not demanded in previous Democrat administrations, or are we posting assumptions for the consumption of the likeminded here?

gatorcpa · Wed. 8:22am

Read the stories and testimony of people who used to work for him, especially those in his first administration. It’s a lot more than one or two.

Smoke and fire.
gatorcpa

STANDY · Wed. 8:27am

Plenty of beautiful places to see and visit in America.
Plenty of great people I have met over the years visiting.
I have a abundance of appreciation for America 🇺🇸

Besides the current tariffs (which won’t really effect myself at a my age and place in life) I have zero issue with 🇺🇸

I do feel for the people there and the slippery slope they are on at the moment, and the future it will create.

Wlcutter · Wed. 8:29am

noelekal
Do we have evidence that such demands are made in the current administration in a way that were not demanded in previous Democrat administrations, or are we posting assumptions for the consumption of the likeminded here?

If by "such demands" you're referring to @gatorcpa's point about loyalty over conscience: yes. Lots of examples.

On the larger points of name-calling, nazis, etc, I have a question for @The Father. So far, you've seemed to push back against any criticism of President Trump. Do you, in fact, believe all actions he's taken so far are good and supportable?

This, imo, is the biggest issue behind the tariffs and, more broadly, American politics presently. President Trump seems to be asking for supporters to back him on everything—this despite the huge flashing warnings we're getting about the economy (GDP shrank this quarter), the likely results of the tariffs (bare shelves are coming soon, says just about everyone), the results of slashing funding, deporting people without due process, cutting bureaucracy in the name of cutting red tape (despite that many of the agencies/jobs targeted help in important ways, from protecting consumers from financial fraud to preventing cyber attacks, etc etc etc). It is not just un- but anti-American to demand fealty to one politician's every move. I've never supported every action of anyone I've voted for, and Trump's seeming need for that is a shocking sign of weakness.

Back to tariffs: Speaking only from experience: I have a small business. I'm importing parts from China in the coming weeks. I presume the $400 or so in fees I used to pay will now be close to $6k. Mine's a tiny business, but good lord. The real-world consequences of these choices will be profound.

gatorcpa · Wed. 8:37am

Wlcutter
It is not just un- but anti-American to demand fealty to one politician's every move. I've never supported every action of anyone I've voted for, and Trump's seeming need for that is a shocking sign of weakness.

We can shut the thread now. You just got to the bottom line.

Thank you.
gatorcpa

Archer · Wed. 8:49am

Back to tariffs...good news from Lutnick...

"Commerce Secretary Howard Lutnick on Tuesday teased that the Trump administration has reached its first trade deal, but said it was not fully finalized and declined to name the country involved."

Great, but was he not aware of the other 199 that Trump has already said he's made, as he claimed in that Time interview a few days before?

Your trade adviser, Peter Navarro, says 90 deals in 90 days is possible. We're now 13 days into the point from when you lifted the reciprocal, the discounted reciprocal tariffs. There's zero deals so far. Why is that?

No, there’s many deals.

When are they going to be announced?
You have to understand, I'm dealing with all the companies, very friendly countries. We're meeting with China. We're doing fine with everybody. But ultimately, I've made all the deals.

Not one has been announced yet. When are you going to announce them?

I’ve made 200 deals.

You’ve made 200 deals?

100%.

Hmmm....who to believe...

fiberguy · Wed. 8:50am

Wlcutter
Back to tariffs: Speaking only from experience: I have a small business. I'm importing parts from China in the coming weeks. I presume the $400 or so in fees I used to pay will now be close to $6k. Mine's a tiny business, but good lord. The real-world consequences of these choices will be profound.

We are starting to see some 50% cost increases on China made goods - 10% on Taiwanese goods. We have a vendor or two holding goods at the port, hoping there is a decrease in tariffs on their particular items.

noelekal · Wed. 10:00am

Wlcutter
If by "such demands" you're referring to @gatorcpa's point about loyalty over conscience: yes. Lots of examples.

Post them.

With links.

Why we can do-si-do!

"You post yers
an' I'll post mine.

Swing yer partners,
all malign."

pdxleaf · Wed. 10:10am

noelekal
Post them.

With links.

Why we can do-si-do!

"You post yours
an' I'll post mine.

Swing yer partners
all malign."

January 06.

noelekal · Wed. 10:11am

Biden dementia cover up.

Walrus · Wed. 10:22am

noelekal
Biden dementia cover up.

I wonder if any in the administration will write books about this now that the cracks are showing in the media. Probably not as they will have to implicate themselves. The way our media runs cover for some is quite amazing. I felt bad for Biden more than anything as wherever was going on cognitively is difficult to watch befell any human.

pdxleaf · Wed. 10:24am

noelekal
Biden dementia cover up.

Here's the difference.

I agree. Biden should not have run. Too many people near him allowed him to run.

But if someone can't acknowledge that Jan 06 was a treasonous assault on our democracy, then that's where there's loyalty over conscience.

I don't want to make enemies of anyone here. I've met many and I follow many more and am impressed by the knowledge of not just watches but other hobbies and life in general. Which is another reason I can't understand how January 06 was not a line in the sand.