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  1. DirtyDozen12 Thanks, mystery donor! Dec 27, 2021

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    Below is a "Heuer" that was sold by a dealer this year. I am not an expert on Heuer but the watch appears to have a laundry list of unusual attributes. I question whether any part of the watch is authentic.

    Starting with the dial, I am not well-versed enough to make a confident assessment. However, my untrained eye finds the seconds scale, sub-dials, and hour markers odd. Though not an issue on its own, the pristine condition in conjunction with the aforementioned potential oddities is noteworthy. Lastly, the absence of lume does not fit with the luminous hour/minute hands. So, it seems reasonable to assume that either the dial is wrong, or the hands, or both.

    b8.JPG
    b6.JPG

    Moving onto the case, there are a number of atypical features. Firstly, there are the large round pushers. Comparing these pushers to all other round-pusher references listed on OnTheDash with Valjoux 71 or 72, none are similar. As a side note, these pushers can also be found on certain examples of the highly suspicious "original" Longines Avigation BigEye chronographs that have surfaced. Secondly, the case-back markings do not fit with original examples. Comparable examples have perlage, an "Ed. Heuer & Co Swiss" marking, and either "Stainless *Steel*" or "Stainless Steel".

    b2.JPG

    Ref. 346 AT, photo from OnTheDash: http://www.onthedash.com/chronograph/reference-346-at/
    upload_2021-12-27_13-21-23.png

    Ref. 2447, photo from OnTheDash: http://www.onthedash.com/chronograph/reference-2447-white-silver-dial-radium/
    upload_2021-12-27_13-20-59.png

    Ref. 2444 T, photo from OnTheDash: http://www.onthedash.com/chronograph/reference-2444-t/
    upload_2021-12-27_13-20-8.png

    Finally, the movement has a number of apparent issues. Firstly, Heuers with the Valjoux 72 (pre-1960), usually have copper-toned wheels. The example in question has silver-toned wheels. Secondly, original Heuer Valjoux 72 movements usually have a distinctively-shaped "chronograph" bridge. The example in question has a generically-shaped bridge. The bridge is also missing the usual 6-digit number. Furthermore, the "Heuer" marking on the bridge is also missing its usual copper tone. Thirdly, the balance cock with mobile stud carrier is not typical. I also find it noteworthy that the movement of the example in question has severe where underneath the balance wheel, and an incorrect minute recording jumper spring.

    b9.JPG

    Ref. 2447, photo from OnTheDash: http://www.onthedash.com/chronograph/reference-2447-white-silver-dial-radium/
    upload_2021-12-27_13-23-58.png

    Ref. 2444, photo from OnTheDash: http://www.onthedash.com/chronograph/reference-2444/
    upload_2021-12-27_13-23-3.png

    To conclude, the watch in question appears highly anomalous among known Heuer chronographs. Unfortunately, the given example is not the only one I have seen (three thus far).

    I look forward to any comments.
     
    Dan S likes this.
  2. DirtyDozen12 Thanks, mystery donor! Dec 27, 2021

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  3. Mark020 not the sharpest pencil in the ΩF drawer Dec 27, 2021

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    Not an expert - especially not on these variations - but this seems to me a franken. Bridge wear does not match the movement. Inscriptions are wrong and too fresh. Dial does not feel correct. So: I think you pointed it all out.
     
    MRC and DirtyDozen12 like this.
  4. DirtyDozen12 Thanks, mystery donor! Dec 27, 2021

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    Expanding the discussion to Heuers with round pushers and Landeron 13 movements, reference 2406 has similarly large pushers. However, the shape of the pushers differs from those found on the watch in question. Case-back design and marking seems to vary on ref. 2406. However, all have perlage and none are marked like the watch in question.

    Ref. 2406, photos from OnTheDash: http://www.onthedash.com/chronograph/reference-2406-white-dial-no-radium/
    upload_2021-12-27_19-54-15.png upload_2021-12-27_19-54-32.png

    Ref. 2406, photos from OnTheDash: http://www.onthedash.com/chronograp...-no-radum-tachymeter-and-telemeter-tri-color/
    upload_2021-12-27_19-55-30.png
    upload_2021-12-27_19-55-47.png

    Ref. 2406, photos from OnTheDash: http://www.onthedash.com/chronograph/reference-2406-black-dial-radium/
    upload_2021-12-27_19-56-23.png
    upload_2021-12-27_19-56-39.png
     
  5. abrod520 Dec 28, 2021

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    Just look at all the variation in the numbers on the dial - the differences in the 5s alone, yikes.

    As for the movement, from my limited knowledge it should at the very least be Swiss-signed, though the presence of another non-signed example on OTD casts doubt on that.

    Either way, stay far away from this one!
     
    DirtyDozen12 likes this.
  6. DirtyDozen12 Thanks, mystery donor! Dec 28, 2021

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    Yes, I also wonder if that bridge and the balance cock have been transplanted.

    I agree about the movement being marked "Swiss" and wonder about the example from OTD.
     
  7. Foo2rama Keeps his worms in a ball instead of a can. Dec 28, 2021

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    Those movements are from 3 clearly different generations. I would not take the signed bridge differences as having any meaning. I can spot at least 2 major revisions on the 2 "Legit" pieces. In fact ref 2447 looks the fishiest to me...
     
    AustinPerpetual likes this.
  8. DirtyDozen12 Thanks, mystery donor! Dec 28, 2021

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    Yes, the three movements shown are three different iterations of the Valjoux 72. I must amend my comments about the silver-toned wheels, mobile stud carrier, and minute recording jumper spring. While one screw on the spring appears to be incorrect, the rest appears normal for a Valjoux 72 from the late 1960s/early 1970s. However, comparing the movement in question to a comparable Heuer Valjoux 72, the bridge still stands out as atypical both in terms of shape and markings (see below).

    Carrera 12 - Second Execution, photo from OnTheDash: http://www.onthedash.com/chronograph/carrera-2447-decimal-second/
    upload_2021-12-28_17-17-53.png
     
    Foo2rama likes this.
  9. DirtyDozen12 Thanks, mystery donor! Dec 28, 2021

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  10. Syrte MWR Tech Support Dept Dec 29, 2021

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    I like the phrase “a laundry list of unusual attributes” :D
     
    DirtyDozen12 and Mark020 like this.
  11. DirtyDozen12 Thanks, mystery donor! Dec 29, 2021

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    Unfortunately, the "laundry list" part is not my invention. But it is fun to use.