Help rate these two 552 movements?

philips · Sep 18, 2021

krogerfoot
Just armchair logic here, but I have a hard time imagining a movement getting scratched up during a routine service. Case knives and screwdrivers might slip while getting a case open or loosening a screw, but I don’t know how a watch tech would manage to inflict scratches on the winding weight. Again, armchair logic—I have no practical insight into watch repair.

I've seen watchmakers use metal tweezers to test the rotor when assembling a watch, that can cause scratches. But logically you are right, scratches should not really happen, I don't think.

Archer · Sep 18, 2021

JimInOz
They both look pretty to me (I always liked the 552 caliber).

To add any value to my comment, I would need to strip and examine all components of both movements.

Trying to evaluate condition of a movement based on a photograph is a bit like looking at a lady at the other end of the bar at midnight and thinking "she looks nice".

Next morning..................

True - I have a similar movement in my shop right now that looks better than either of these, and almost every wheel inside is worn severely, and will need replacing.

Generally speaking though, watches that have wear on the rotor like the second one, are watches that in my experience have been run a long time without servicing, and usually have more worn parts. But you can never know for sure just by looking at it.

Archer · Sep 18, 2021

krogerfoot
Just armchair logic here, but I have a hard time imagining a movement getting scratched up during a routine service. Case knives and screwdrivers might slip while getting a case open or loosening a screw, but I don’t know how a watch tech would manage to inflict scratches on the winding weight. Again, armchair logic—I have no practical insight into watch repair.

It's simple - careless watchmakers. Keep in mind that before quartz every small town had several watchmakers who were all competing against each other. This is when a "full service" might cost you under $10, both because of the era and the level of competition. These were not the precious object that they are today - they were just everyday watches. The watchmaking practices of the time were often of a standard that would never be considered acceptable today.

Some of the old timers who worked in that era still operate the same way - old habits die hard.

Dan S · Sep 18, 2021

IMO, the amount you can learn about a movement from photos like this is pretty limited. Sure, if the movement is totally rusted out, you will see it. But if it looks generally ok (like these movements), the movement can still need a lot of replacement parts, which can be expensive and difficult to find.

So I will say that neither of these movements would put me off, if the rest of the watch was appealing. However, don't blame me if your watchmaker disassembles the movement and finds a lot of wear and tear requiring replacement parts. That is just part of vintage watch collecting that you have to be prepared for. You win some, you lose some.

gyromiterob · Sep 18, 2021

Thanks so much for the replies! This is the info I was looking for. I just wanted to make sure they weren't complete rubbish.

If anyone is interested, the first movement dates to 1960 and is in a Seamaster. The second movement resides in a Watchco SM300 and dates to late 1966. I was kinda wondering if I should try to find a cleaner movement for the SM300 since the rest of the watch is basically new? Both were serviced by LA WatchWorks a couple of years ago.

Archer · Sep 18, 2021

I did create a thread on the topic of what to look for in photos some time ago...

Spotting problems with watch movements | Omega Forums

Hope this helps.

gyromiterob · Sep 18, 2021

Archer
I did create a thread on the topic of what to look for in photos some time ago...

Spotting problems with watch movements | Omega Forums

Hope this helps.

Oh, that's awesome! Thanks for re-sharing. I haven't seen this.

gyromiterob · Sep 18, 2021

On the second movement, they did replace the rotor axle and the center seconds pinion. Perhaps the cause of the rotor rub?

Archer · Sep 18, 2021

gyromiterob
On the second movement, they did replace the rotor axle and the center seconds pinion. Perhaps the cause of the rotor rub?

Replacing the axle won't fix the rotor rubbing - they need to replace the pinion in the rotor itself.

Here's how that's done - Horia tool:

The pinion is the small gear on the underside of the rotor:

It's pressed out of the rotor:

New pinion:

That is pressed into the rotor:

Then the pinion has to be reamed to fit the axle:

Fit is tested:

Parts cleaned again:

Then final assembly:

It's not the axle that wears, so just replacing that is a waste of an axle and doesn't solve the problem.

Cheers, Al

gyromiterob · Sep 18, 2021

Archer
Replacing the axle won't fix the rotor rubbing - they need to replace the pinion in the rotor itself.

Thanks Al! That's an amazingly thorough response. Much appreciated. I don't think it was replaced during the most recent service, but it might have been on a prior service - there is one prior service that I'm aware of, but I don't know the details of what was done now. 👎

Help rate these two 552 movements?

philips

Archer

Archer

Dan S

gyromiterob

Archer

gyromiterob

gyromiterob

Archer

gyromiterob

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