Fake Daytona Sh*tstorm

Als 27 · Feb 4, 2020

Read it from the start right up to today on the Rolex Forum....
& continue to follow it
The guy ( seller ) is an out & out Roy Rogers cowboy, con man, criminal two bit con man....
Other serious allegations have also been laid at his door....

yes the buyer ( all buyer's ) must do their home work & recherche on both the item & the seller.
However the buying of items ( watches ) in this case.
The transaction are based on trust from all parties involved.....
Not delays; excuses, & bull manure ....
I'm very pleased i don't have or collect Rolex....
but the above can / could be applied to any make or manufacture....
one could write a book on this subject but it won't be me...

connieseamaster · Feb 4, 2020

Just going to point out that Horology House had been around (as a YouTube channel/Instagram) for not even 2 years. Slick production values != Trustworthy.

@pseikotick, i just wanted to say that I agree 1000% with your original comment in this thread and was sad that I could only "like" it once.

Speedy 419 · Feb 4, 2020

JohnLy
Wouldn't it be nice if the watch manufacturers could somehow apply/inbed something on the actual watch that the crooks cannot replicate. If I were Rolex I would be all over this.

I wonder if Rolex could embed a small chip in the watch, similar to when you chip a pet. Now, I'm not suggesting that the chip be used for tracking, but that it would be activated at the AD with the proprietary tech. The chip would store the date sale, location of sale, etc.

nzshadow · Feb 4, 2020

pseikotick
I have owned a few over the years and enjoyed them... I'll stick to vintage. Only.

As a boy growing up in the late 60s and 70s I collected baseball and football cards... Things have changed.

Manufactured 'collectability' vs authenticity. The original baseball cards earned their collectable status through their pure authenticity, whereas the later cards manufactured in a bubble with the sole aim being 'collectable' were always bound to fall short.

CoDiffe · Feb 4, 2020

This is absolutely crazy. I follow Horology House on IG and have seen a few of his videos on YouTube. He had a ton of followers and has been around for quite awhile.

A lot of his videos were comparing replicas to originals and how to spot the differences.

I would have felt pretty comfortable buying the seller had I been buying from him. This doesn’t sound like a mistake but sounds like he was blatantly trying to con the buyer. Absolutely insane.

CameronD · Feb 4, 2020

I enjoyed his channel. I thought the presentation and photography were well above most youtube channels. When I read about this scam, I was surprised. When I read the What's App message thread, I thought, he is in trouble - tax man, civil fine, maybe something else.

Slick production does not equal trustworthy. I think people bought into it and thought he was trustworthy.

It all goes back to the expression, "Buy the seller". I have purchased two used watches in my life. Both of them on this forum. The first one was smooth sailing, the second one was misrepresented and I have not purchased a used watch since. I only buy from the the AD or manufacturer now. (Watchbuys in North Carolina, Stowa - direct and Guinand direct)

The Rolex bubble is crazy. In the end, it is still, just a watch.

duc · Feb 4, 2020

Martin_F
Haven't read the whole original thread, just the article linked above, but here is what I took away from it (and maybe I misread some of it).

He ordered a Rolex that got lost in the mail. Nobody knows if that one would have been real, or if it ever was sent, correct?
Seems like the seller already used the money, so he couldn't refund it.
Maybe it was at that point that the seller realized he messed up and sent the "replica".
You would think a guy like that would have more cash laying around to cover something like this happening.

Not trying to defend the guy, but maybe it wasn't all bad intentions from the beginning. Even the story about helping family with the fires might have been real, but I guess at some point non of that matters anymore, because people aren't going to believe you anymore.

The whole thing makes me feel a lot better about buying my Speedmaster at the AD, even if I payed more for it.
I agree with statements above, that you need to do your homework beforehand and weigh the risks.
In hindsight a meeting in person, even though both guys would have been flying to a neutral location, would have made a lot of sense...

It doesn't sound like you read much, if any of the 52 pages.

He is a straight up con. "Even the story about helping family with fires might have been real"; is just laughable. If you read any part of it you would know he lifted a photo of a burning house from on line and claimed it was his parents house. A bold faced lie that was put down within minutes of him making the claim.

I'm not in the 30k per watch market, and I never spend anything on a watch I actually need for real life. However, the lessons taugh by this criminal of the first degree are broad and deep. There is nothing remotely legitimate about his behavior.

Martin_F · Feb 4, 2020

duc
It doesn't sound like you read much, if any of the 52 pages.

He is a straight up con. "Even the story about helping family with fires might have been real"; is just laughable. If you read any part of it you would know he lifted a photo of a burning house from on line and claimed it was his parents house. A bold faced lie that was put down within minutes of him making the claim.

I'm not in the 30k per watch market, and I never spend anything on a watch I actually need for real life. However, the lessons taugh by this criminal of the first degree are broad and deep. There is nothing remotely legitimate about his behavior.

Doesn't sound like you read my full post either. In my first sentence I mentioned that I didn't read the whole original thread.
So no, I didn't ready any of the 52 pages.

Good to know you wouldn't have fallen for this guy. From what I'm reading a lot of people say his online facade was pretty good. So it's understandable but not excusable people would the guy.

jhross98 · Feb 4, 2020

interestingly. . there is a related post about telling a real rolex guarantee card from a fake. i wish the guy had posted a real close up of the guarantee card on the fake as well as exposed it to UV light to see if a holograph is there. . .not that a real guarantee card doesn't preclude a fake but i would think a fake card does preclude a real watch

Andy K · Feb 4, 2020

So TRF has finally locked the thread, but I encourage everyone to read through as much as they can. A few details that the article didn't mention:

1. This guy had been running the same scam on several people - I lost track of how many (it's a really long thread!)
2. This guy was using his position as moderator on two Australian FB watch groups to censor/ban anyone that critiqued people for reselling while at the same time criticize the selling prices of other (presumably) legit sellers on those platforms, and he'd ban or censor anyone that had any perceived negative feedback about the watches he sold or his YouTube videos.
3. Another moderator on one of the groups was dutifully deleting any and all criticism of the scammer. Well, it turns out that guy spent two years in jail for fraud.

duc · Feb 4, 2020

Martin_F
Doesn't sound like you read my full post either. In my first sentence I mentioned that I didn't read the whole original thread.
So no, I didn't ready any of the 52 pages.

Well you have me there.... 😀

Evose · Feb 4, 2020

As others have pointed out, rather interestingly, until Rolex implements a proprietary system that secures their IP it's going to be an uphill battle. I would never purchase a Rolex from anyone but an AD, but there also lies the issue - with inventory being scarce people resort to individuals like Chris.

I hope Rolex does something. As in technology, always think ahead and reverse engineer problems to create new solutions.

Als 27 · Feb 4, 2020

pseikotick
I'm pretty sure Roy Rogers was a squeaky clean good guy. You may be thinking of Donald Trump. oops

And I see comments about Rolex creating a new way of securing their watches, but my real problem is in that watches that are ALMOST exactly the same can be made for pennies on the dollar. I will never again be able to pay thousands for a new luxury watch. The world has changed. And I get Rolex makes a very nice watch. My Sub is still one of a few favorites and will remain so. At some point we have to ask what we are paying for , I guess.

And thank you Connieseamaster, (from below) if that IS your real name, for the kind words. Were you a card collector? Stingray rider?

Ha Ha Ha good point .... re Mr Orange ( Jaffa - Outspan )
But the term Roy Rogers is British slang for cowboy
depending where your from in Britain

CoDiffe · Feb 4, 2020

Andy K
So TRF has finally locked the thread, but I encourage everyone to read through as much as they can. A few details that the article didn't mention:

1. This guy had been running the same scam on several people - I lost track of how many (it's a really long thread!)
2. This guy was using his position as moderator on two Australian FB watch groups to censor/ban anyone that critiqued people for reselling while at the same time criticize the selling prices of other (presumably) legit sellers on those platforms, and he'd ban or censor anyone that had any perceived negative feedback about the watches he sold or his YouTube videos.
3. Another moderator on one of the groups was dutifully deleting any and all criticism of the scammer. Well, it turns out that guy spent two years in jail for fraud.

How did he get away with it for so long?? Argh, I'll bite and read the TRF thread. 😉

Als 27 · Feb 4, 2020

CoDiffe
Your in for a long long read it's an eye opener to say the least 😲

Evitzee · Feb 4, 2020

CoDiffe
How did he get away with it for so long?? Argh, I'll bite and read the TRF thread. 😉

How did Bernie Madoff, Allen Stanford, Jeff Skilling and many others get away with multi billion dollar frauds? They were con men who had the talent to deceive and still have people believe in them. HH was a peanut in the scam world, but hits close to home because of the watch angle.

I wouldn't freak out about buying a Rolex watch from established grey market dealers, you will almost always get the real deal. But only work with established dealers who have the watch in hand, can send you detailed pics of the watch, details of the warranty card, provide references, etc In the Essery case this didn't happen and the buyer relied on his reputation.on Youtube and social media, which tell you nothing about his financial history and trustworthiness. If the buyer had asked for references up front I suspect the deal would have collapsed.

Walrus · Feb 4, 2020

Speedy 419
I wonder if Rolex could embed a small chip in the watch, similar to when you chip a pet. Now, I'm not suggesting that the chip be used for tracking, but that it would be activated at the AD with the proprietary tech. The chip would store the date sale, location of sale, etc.

How about what some of the Swiss companies do with gold bars. You download and app and scan the bar for authenticity. Perhaps this wouldn’t work as each bar can have different characteristics, I did it a couple times I forget exactly how it works. I wonder if that could be worked into watches.

auxpomme · Feb 4, 2020

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gui Gui
Think this proves once and for all that Omega make better watches than Rolex. Too hard for the Chinese to counterfeit.

No, it proves nobody wants a fake Omega, just like they don’t want real ones.

My absolute favorite comment from the fauxlex scandal on the Rolex snob site.

janice&fred · Feb 4, 2020

pseikotick
my real problem is in that watches that are ALMOST exactly the same can be made for pennies on the dollar. I will never again be able to pay thousands for a new luxury watch. The world has changed. And I get Rolex makes a very nice watch. My Sub is still one of a few favorites and will remain so. At some point we have to ask what we are paying for , I guess.

I agree 100%. it's all gotten out of hand.

jhross98 · Feb 4, 2020

jhross98
interestingly. . there is a related post about telling a real rolex guarantee card from a fake. i wish the guy had posted a real close up of the guarantee card on the fake as well as exposed it to UV light to see if a holograph is there. . .not that a real guarantee card doesn't preclude a fake but i would think a fake card does preclude a real watch

here is the link to the thread on detecting fake guarantee cards

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=716674

i just looked at both of mine and appear authentic. . .to be honest these super fakes are just too hard for even experienced watch people to figure it out

Fake Daytona Sh*tstorm

Als 27

connieseamaster

Speedy 419

nzshadow

CoDiffe

CameronD

duc

Martin_F

jhross98

Andy K

duc

Evose

Als 27

CoDiffe

Als 27

Evitzee

Walrus

auxpomme

janice&fred

jhross98

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