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evil nina chrono hand question

  1. jhross98

    jhross98 Feb 7, 2018

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    UG experts

    This minty evil nina sold at phillips last fall

    What do people here think about the chrono hand ? I have seen versions where the chrono hand does not extend into the lower middle subdial. I was told perhaps this was a replacement chrono hand from a space compax or the like, but others have said this chrono hand is original and correct. I cannot find examples of the longer chrono hand on a regular Nina.

    Thoughts ?

    I would also note on the Phillips one it says "compax" but on the Fratello one it does not. Is one an earlier version?

    https://www.phillips.com/detail/UNIVERSAL/CH080217/151

    "regular" chrono

    https://www.fratellowatches.com/tbt-universal-geneve-compax-evil-nina/

    download.png P5056353-894x1024.jpg
     
  2. LouS

    LouS Mrs Nataf's Other Son Staff Member Feb 7, 2018

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    I have always regarded that super long chrono hand as a Space Compax hand. it is true one sees it often on Ninas, but that's my opinion FWIW
     
  3. ChicagoFrog

    ChicagoFrog wincer, not a bidder Feb 7, 2018

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    I've seen it enough times now that I have just come to accept it as kosher. That said, it looks very out of place compared to the right-sized chrono hands.
    IMG_1313.jpg
     
  4. Diabolik

    Diabolik Feb 7, 2018

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    That hand is correct for the compax. Earliner nina and evil ninas have shorter hands. I have seen three three different versions of chrono runner hand.

    Long with lume
    Longer with lume (as shown)
    Medico compax which is longer but has no lume.
     
  5. jhross98

    jhross98 Feb 7, 2018

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    so... it is correct? its not correct ?
    i am told there were a lot of the longer red chrono hands around. ..the regular sized ones not so much

    does anyone have catalogs / advertisements from when the watches were sold originally that would prove the case ?
     
  6. CajunTiger

    CajunTiger Cajuns and Gators can't read newspapers! Feb 7, 2018

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    here are a couple
     
    UG Catalog.png Catalog- thin hands pre 1964.png
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  7. jhross98

    jhross98 Feb 7, 2018

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    Awesome.
    These appear to show the regular size chr9no handh..
     
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  8. jhross98

    jhross98 Feb 8, 2018

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    so does anyone have proof that the longer chrono hand is correct / original ?
    otherwise i'm going with LouS's explanation. .
     
  9. Diabolik

    Diabolik Feb 8, 2018

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    there is no absolute proof. what we see is space compax references with long and short runner hands

    upload_2018-2-8_20-51-54.png upload_2018-2-8_20-55-37.png

    and compax references with long chrono runners ...

    upload_2018-2-8_20-57-21.png upload_2018-2-8_20-58-18.png


    Service replacements maybe ? perhaps a change of supplier or just a straight forward design change. They both look good on both ....
    Unfortunately documentation on later references is scarce.

    Another subject to research ...
     
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  10. jhross98

    jhross98 Feb 8, 2018

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    hmm. . those two bottom evil ninas have many differences (look at the printing of universal geneve as an example)

    the red chrono hands in those photos don't look anything like the red in the space compax. .

    i agree the longe red hand just looks incorrect to my eyes but that didn't mean it wasn't used either as a service part or on later models
     
  11. ELV web

    ELV web Feb 8, 2018

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    It is early and later version. I would say the evolution of the Nina configuration is something like this

    1) earliest execution (1.1 execution), applied logo dial, thin sub hands, cal 130

    2) early execution (1.2 execution), same as above but cal 85

    3) 2nd gen early (2.1 execution) applied logo dial, baton subhands, cal 85

    4) 2nd gen last (2.2 execution) flat logo dial, baton sub hands, cal 85
     
    Edited Feb 10, 2018
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  12. UGNewbie

    UGNewbie May 13, 2018

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    My research shows there is some suggestion that there are several groupings of serials with long hand, I suspect there are just two types, bit like when we see red chrono hands on 3646 1st exec Autavia or three different style dauphine hands etc (originally people thought some of these were incorrect).
     
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  13. Diabolik

    Diabolik May 13, 2018

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    There is no clear delineation i am afraid.

    I have looked into this on some depth. The earliest execution of the nina was the 22706 and had different hands (dauphin) and dial with applied batons ... The dial is very similar (but not identical) to the 22704.

    [​IMG]

    I have only seen one and I am unsure how many exist ! That in my eyes is the true grail !!

    upload_2018-5-13_10-12-21.png

    Unfortunately, the dial on the above has been redone but it retains the original applied batons and logo as well as hands....

    Catalog image ...

    upload_2018-5-13_10-15-45.png
     
    Edited May 13, 2018
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