Doubts on the Moonwatch

Cp3 · Apr 16, 2023

Hi everyone, I'm new in the forum. I live in Italy, near Milan, and I would like to buy my first mechanical watch.
Over the last couple of months, I have been reading and watching almost everything on the web, and at the end the history of the Speedmaster Moonwatch definitely conquered me.

I have 2 kind of doubts:
1) The OB in Milan does not make any discount, but they offer an interesting service, which is polishing, mechanism check and waterproof check done for free and forever on yearly basis.
On the other hand, the AD in Switzerland (which is close to where I live) offer some discounts, so I could save roughly €1200. I'm not aware of any additional service in the AD.
Where would you buy it? I'm really curious about the experience of buying in OB, especially for the first time. On the other hand, €1200 is an important amount of money for me.

2) As many of you know, Omega recently released the new Spirate system, which is a significant step forward in terms of accuracy. Do you think they are going to implement this system also on the Moonwatch? If yes, do you have any idea about when this could happen? I know it's a difficult question, but maybe people more experienced than me could at least have a reasonable expectation.
Last but not least: do you think it is better to wait for the Spirate system or should I buy the 3861?

Thank you all in advance.

MrFriday* · Apr 16, 2023

I have also been to OB Frankfurt yesterday. They have been really friendly even though they knew I wouldn’t (couldn‘t) buy a Speedy right away. Just wanted to see how it looks like on my wrist and decide whether I should start saving money for a Speedy.
They also told me that right now I could not expect a discount. I would say it depends on you whether the buying experience at an OB over an AD is worth 1200€ to you. Shouldn‘t pressure testing be possible at any OB even if the watch is AD-derived?

MrFriday* · Apr 16, 2023

Ah, forgot that pics are always needed:

MarcusF · Apr 16, 2023

1. The watch comes with 5 year warranty. The boutique will accept the watch for warranty repairs if needed.
Yearly polishing, mechanism check and waterproof test is pointless. After the warranty perid you need to pay for fixing the broken mechanismen or the waterproffness ! Before the 5 years Omega will fix it as part of warranty.
So to me i see no benefit in bying with the OB.

2. 3861 came to Appolo 11 in 2019. The Professional Speedmaster was upgraded with movement, case & bracelet in 2021. I personally doubt, that you will see anymore changes until 2027. (70th anniversary)

A spirate based Moonwatch will also trigger another price increase. I personally did buy the 3861 in 2022 before another round of price increases. for around 5.2k Euro from an AD.

MrFriday* · Apr 16, 2023

MarcusF
1. The watch comes with 5 year warranty. The boutique will accept the watch for warranty repairs if needed.
Yearly polishing, mechanism check and waterproof test is pointless. After the warranty perid you need to pay for fixing the broken mechanismen or the waterproffness ! Before the 5 years Omega will fix it as part of warranty.
So to me i see no benefit in bying with the OB.

2. 3861 came to Appolo 11 in 2019. The Professional Speedmaster was upgraded with movement, case & bracelet in 2021. I personally doubt, that you will see anymore changes until 2027. (70th anniversary)

A spirate based Moonwatch will also trigger another price increase. I personally did buy the 3861 in 2022 before another round of price increases. for around 5.2k Euro from an AD.

Just out of curiosity: Where would you expect to get it at a price of 5.2k€?

Omegafanman · Apr 16, 2023

MrFriday*
Just out of curiosity: Where would you expect to get it at a price of 5.2k€?

After price rises, with Moonswatch, inflation and Brexit I don’t think you will find that price new in Europe now.
€1200 discount on a new one seems a good price, especially if you plan to keep the watch. Chrono 24 can be a good guide,,,,
.

Aroxx · Apr 16, 2023

MarcusF
1. The watch comes with 5 year warranty. The boutique will accept the watch for warranty repairs if needed.
Yearly polishing, mechanism check and waterproof test is pointless. After the warranty perid you need to pay for fixing the broken mechanismen or the waterproffness ! Before the 5 years Omega will fix it as part of warranty.
So to me i see no benefit in bying with the OB.

2. 3861 came to Appolo 11 in 2019. The Professional Speedmaster was upgraded with movement, case & bracelet in 2021. I personally doubt, that you will see anymore changes until 2027. (70th anniversary)

A spirate based Moonwatch will also trigger another price increase. I personally did buy the 3861 in 2022 before another round of price increases. for around 5.2k Euro from an AD.

I second all of this. I say buy it now in Switzerland with the discount and enjoy!

Evitzee · Apr 16, 2023

Younger people seem to put value on the 'experience' factor in their day to day activities. Being coddled at an OB by someone wearing white gloves while sipping champagne is something I don't need or particularly want. I certainly don't want to pay for it. I remember going to Singapore in 1982 and being bowled over at all the watch shops in the old Lucky Plaza, the plain showcases lit by fluorescent lights chocked cheek to jowl with AP, PP, Omega, Rolex and every other brand. On the top of the counter was a calculator and the ubiquitous ashtray, and a young salesguy behind the counter wanting to deal. Those were the good old days, now it's all faux-luxury.

Omega is not likely to do anything with the 3861 movement for years to come, they stuck with the 861/1861 for over 50 years.

PhilF · Apr 16, 2023

I bought my Sapphire Sandwich in July of 2021, traded a 1861 Hesalite complete kit and was treated very generously by my AD. The 3861 saphire, especially with the thinner profile and lighter more flexible bracelet is a significant advancement in comfort and is far more accurate. Both my AD and a OB have performed pressure testing at no charge (actually asked me if I would like them to check it) and it certainly doesn't need to be polished as after nearly two years of daily wear, it still looks flawless. It has been a delightful daily companion.
IMHO, go to the AD, get the discount and start enjoying, hopefully yours will have the updated clasp.

rudagger · Apr 16, 2023

Evitzee
Younger people seem to put value on the 'experience' factor in their day to day activities. Being coddled at an OB by someone wearing white gloves while sipping champagne is something I don't need or particularly want.

I have never seen champagne at an OB in Canada. Maybe it is a result of liquor laws.

In any event, it seems to me that it is a bad idea to drink while contemplating the purchase of a very expensive consumer product.

People talk about hangovers as a result of drinking....maybe in this case it would be buyer's remorse! 😀

rudagger · Apr 16, 2023

C Cp3
1) The OB in Milan does not make any discount, but they offer an interesting service, which is polishing, mechanism check and waterproof check done for free and forever on yearly basis.
On the other hand, the AD in Switzerland (which is close to where I live) offer some discounts, so I could save roughly €1200. I'm not aware of any additional service in the AD.
.

Another vote for skipping the services and saving EUR1200!

Cp3 · Apr 16, 2023

I've read all the comments carefully and sincerely thanks to everyone for your feedbacks and suggestions.

Overall, the general sentiment seems to consider the money saving more than the OB experience, which is quite understandable. It's a pity because in Milan Boutique, all the people were really kind and prepared, without the veneer of fake kindness which sometime one could expect in such environment (I have personally experienced it in a Roelx boutique). However, to be honest I must say that maybe I will find the same also in the AD (at the end of day, it really depends also on people).

Regarding the second point (caliber 3861 vs future Spirate system), it seems that according to your opinion Omega will not change the Moonwatch movement over the next years, and if we look at the history of the Moonwatch, it is reasonable (maybe they will focus first on everyday watches, such as Seamaster Aqua Terra). Moreover, I have read that between 2025 and 2026, it is planned another trip to the Moon (where people will physically land on Moon's surface). If this will be done with current Moonwatch, my expectation is that the value will increase more, won't it?

Last but not least: how can I understand if the version that the AD will sell me is with the latest clasps or with the old one? I am not an expert of the difference. I thought that the last reference visible on Omega website was already the one with latest clasps, but maybe I'm wrong.

YY77 · Apr 16, 2023

C Cp3
Moreover, I have read that between 2025 and 2026, it is planned another trip to the Moon (where people will physically land on Moon's surface). If this will be done with current Moonwatch, my expectation is that the value will increase more, won't it?

I don't think a new trip to the moon will have real impact on value increase. Overall I think a nice tritium Speedy would gain more just because it looks nicer over time and will become rarer.

C Cp3
Last but not least: how can I understand if the version that the AD will sell me is with the latest clasps or with the old one? I am not an expert of the difference. I thought that the last reference visible on Omega website was already the one with latest clasps, but maybe I'm wrong.

The new one is the bottom one in this pic;

speedy_fan · Apr 16, 2023

Speaking from a history and DNA point of view, the moonwatch MUST be a manual winding.
Spirate movement is considered an "Automatic" movement and will not be considered a real moon watch
Hence I doubt spirate will ever be used in moon watch.

Archer · Apr 17, 2023

speedy_fan
Speaking from a history and DNA point of view, the moonwatch MUST be a manual winding.
Spirate movement is considered an "Automatic" movement and will not be considered a real moon watch
Hence I doubt spirate will ever be used in moon watch.

The Spirate technology has nothing to do with how the watch is wound, so yes, it will eventually make its way to the Speedmasters...of that I have no doubt.

7enderbender · Apr 17, 2023

C Cp3
Hi everyone, I'm new in the forum. I live in Italy, near Milan, and I would like to buy my first mechanical watch.
Over the last couple of months, I have been reading and watching almost everything on the web, and at the end the history of the Speedmaster Moonwatch definitely conquered me.

I have 2 kind of doubts:
1) The OB in Milan does not make any discount, but they offer an interesting service, which is polishing, mechanism check and waterproof check done for free and forever on yearly basis.
On the other hand, the AD in Switzerland (which is close to where I live) offer some discounts, so I could save roughly €1200. I'm not aware of any additional service in the AD.
Where would you buy it? I'm really curious about the experience of buying in OB, especially for the first time. On the other hand, €1200 is an important amount of money for me.

2) As many of you know, Omega recently released the new Spirate system, which is a significant step forward in terms of accuracy. Do you think they are going to implement this system also on the Moonwatch? If yes, do you have any idea about when this could happen? I know it's a difficult question, but maybe people more experienced than me could at least have a reasonable expectation.
Last but not least: do you think it is better to wait for the Spirate system or should I buy the 3861?

Thank you all in advance.

My take: buy where you are most comfortable. The free lifetime polish and waterproof test is basically useless. Expect that the watch will need to go to service every 5-10 years for a full revision just like any mechanical watch.
I’d probably go to Switzerland, but be mindful of your local tax and customs situation (not sure what the latest between the EU and Switzerland is for something in that price range).
In the current environment it’s not unusual to not get a discount.
Pick the right model for you. Some prefer the more traditional features over modern applications. I’m more of a Hesalite no display back kind of guy. And I actually picked the previous model over the most recent one despite the “upgrades”. I don’t care about the new Spirate or whatever system. Obsessing over 1-2 sec day accuracy for a watch like this is missing the point. For that you can get a Casio or Apple Watch.
So having something like this Spirate thing - or anything that takes things further away from the original “Moonwatch” design and movement is a negative for me.

Artemis missions? I’d be surprised to see manual Speedmasters as part of that mission. NASA May have been a bit nostalgic or superstitious (in a good way) with those relationships in the past. Same with individual astronauts. I doubt that will still be the case with the newer generations and their tech-bro overlords. Let’s also carefully evaluate the changes to the inscriptions on the back with the latest model. I think that was an indicator that these weren’t going to be used by NASA any longer.

sheepdoll · Apr 17, 2023

7enderbender
... Obsessing over 1-2 sec day accuracy for a watch like this is missing the point. For that you can get a Casio or Apple Watch.
So having something like this Spirate thing - or anything that takes things further away from the original “Moonwatch” design and movement is a negative for me.
...

+1

Then again I like vintage watches.

Interesting at the AMICA meeting yesterday (Player piano collectors.) One member had to show me his ETA watch. "Just like the omega." (But not really IMO) I would rather see vintage style brought back which is probably marketing self destruction. It is really about the sizzle and the emotion of what sells. Or is likely to sell. Then again I am way out of my depth here.

Cenzo · Apr 17, 2023

I bought my Speedmaster from a trusted seller on this site. Every year I go to the OB in Chicago and they are happy to pressure test it for me, no charge, even though I did not buy it there. I would save the 1200 and not look back.

Pastorbottle · Apr 18, 2023

Bugger going to get my watches pressure tested, I do them at home, I was lucky enough to score a Witschi Proofmaster M pressure test rig for free!
A case of being in the right place at the right time.
Here’s my Flighty going through the routine

Alex_TA · Apr 18, 2023

The regular 3861 is so accurate that you really don't need to improve it. Of course that even more accurate is better but I didn't set my Speedy for at least half a year and it's approx. +10 sec with almost everyday use. Much more accurate than a quartz watch in my car.

Doubts on the Moonwatch

Cp3

MrFriday*

MrFriday*

MarcusF

MrFriday*

Omegafanman

Aroxx

Evitzee

PhilF

rudagger

rudagger

Cp3

YY77

speedy_fan

Archer

7enderbender

sheepdoll

Cenzo

Pastorbottle

Alex_TA

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