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Chrono24 escrow question.

TriSum
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Wasn't sure where to ask this, so sorry if in the wrong section.

I purchased an Omega Seamaster XXL through Chrono24 from a trusted seller. Put my CC information in and got the message for "Payment being verified". The next day I get an email from Chrono24 stating in order to move forward the escrow service needs a copy of my ID or Passport without any information being blacked out and a copy of my credit card that I used with the first 6 numbers and last 4 numbers visible.

I am not comfortable giving that info to them. Is this the norm for Chrono? Have any of you done this before?

Thanks, David
 
befobe
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Never done that... But they answer quickly by contacting them, you should ask them why. They will explain. Interested in their answer...
 
Dedalus05
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On mobile, so quick answer:

A. It is likely anti-money-laundering regulations in whichever jurisdiction licenses the escrow operation

B. Consider if you're reassured or not that the seller has to do the same? Especially if fakes is a concern.

C. You cannot get a library card without ID.

This is not snark, but it always astonishes me that people think they can do $1000's in business online without even identifying themselves. Asking for ID is the sign of legitimacy for me.

.
Edited:
 
Enzo
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I have bought and sold on C24....I can see that I uploaded a copy of my passport back in 2017.
Makes sense that each counterparty is identified.
 
TriSum
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befobe befobe
Never done that... But they answer quickly by contacting them, you should ask them why. They will explain. Interested in their answer...

Yes, I have contacted them. I'll see what they say, I just wasn't sure if this was the norm.
 
TriSum
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Dedalus05 Dedalus05
On mobile, so quick answer:

A. It is likely anti-money-laundering regulations in whichever jurisdiction licenses the escrow operation

B. Consider if you're reassured or not that the seller has to do the same? Especially if fakes is a concern.

C. You cannot get a library card without ID.

This is not snark, but it always astonishes me that people think they can do $1000's in business online without even identifying themselves. Asking for ID is the sign of legitimacy for me.

.

Being in the security industry and dealing with fraud on a daily basis, this is textbook phishing for identity theft. Now I understand showing ID, but why wouldn't I be able to black out non-pertinent information? Why is the CC picture needed, especially with so many numbers showing?

We'll see ????
 
TriSum
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Enzo Enzo
I have bought and sold on C24....I can see that I uploaded a copy of my passport back in 2017.
Makes sense that each counterparty is identified.

I agree, but why couldn't I black out the ID numbers? Why would they need that? Just skeptical I guess.
 
befobe
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Dedalus05 Dedalus05
This is not snark, but it always astonishes me that people think they can do $1000's in business online without even identifying themselves. Asking for ID is the sign of legitimacy for me.

.
Of course you identify yourself. But only when you create your acount and validate it. Not when you make a payment. I made several buy and sells on that plateform, and they never asked me an ID "during" a transaction.
But they may have change their protocol...
 
Dedalus05
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TriSum TriSum
Being in the security industry and dealing with fraud on a daily basis, this is textbook phishing for identity theft. Now I understand showing ID, but why wouldn't I be able to black out non-pertinent information? Why is the CC picture needed, especially with so many numbers showing?

We'll see ????

They are going to have you cc info anyway if you pay by card, no?

But that aside. It is AML regulations almost certainly as to why you have to ID yourself. Likely for the cc too.

Next to a casino (who will always ask for ID), I can think of no quicker way to launder money than to "sell a watch". Darn all vig too.
 
TriSum
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Dedalus05 Dedalus05
They are going to have you cc info anyway if you pay by card, no?

Exactly! Why can't I block out all but the last 4?

But that aside. It is AML regulations almost certainly as to why you have to ID yourself. Likely for the cc too.

I understand, I just don't like that I can't block out certain info.

Next to a casino (who will always ask for ID), I can think of no quicker way to launder money than to "sell a watch". Darn all vig too.

Yes, but a casino, (or whomever), looks at your photo and name, they don't take a picture that has ALL of your pertinent info.
 
Dan S
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Maybe they actually need those data, maybe they know that requesting that information eliminates a large fraction of dishonest customers, or maybe they are trying to gather data for other reasons. Whatever the reason, they are probably willing to alienate the small fraction of people who refuse. You don't have to use their services and they don't have to explain the rationale for their policies.
 
C
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This is a result of Big Brother’s reach extending into more areas of life, and more countries. When you are sending over $10K somebody is going to take notice and want to know who everyone is. Everyone wants their taxes, and everyone needs to know who is buying what from whom. I’m sure AML regulation is the justification.
 
Dedalus05
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You may not like it or think it is over-reach, but thems the facts.

In Ireland, the poker rooms/casinos I've been to take a copy of my ID when I first attend. I'm guessing it's an EU law. I'm pretty sure the Patriot Act in the US kicked it all off AML-wise. At the time I remember it drove out all the legit online gambling outfits from the US market. Not only did you have to ID yourself, if you took a wager you were considered a terrorist. The only places who'd take a US bet we're the offshore mob-run outfits. All money-laundering operations in any case.
 
TriSum
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Guy's / Gal's, I think you are over thinking this. I have given them all of my info, just not pictures of the actual cards used. They have my name and address, my card has been run through some type of payment service to make sure funds are available. I'm not gambling or making money, I am purchasing an item that is well under $10K. I just find it funny that they want actual pictures without anything blocked out. There is no reason for this transaction that they should need my DOB, DL # or PP #, nor my CC with a majority of the numbers showing.

Again, I will see what they say. If they NEED it to process the transaction I will cancel it. Identity theft sucks and can take years to fix and I'm not willing to take that chance, too much to lose over a watch.

Thanks!
 
TriSum
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So a little follow up....

Against my better judgement I sent pictures of my ID and CC. I blocked my actual DL number and only gave them the first and last 4 digits on my CC. I left all other info visible, you can clearly see me, my address (which is the CC billing address also), my DOB, everything and they rejected it. So I canceled the order and apologized to the seller, but I just don't see why they need my actual DL number for any proof of identity.
 
kippyk
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Wait until Crono24 gets hacked or somebody inside downloads customer data and then sells it to the Russian mob. It is not worth the risk.
 
Rado63
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Interesting that there were not more response form C24 buyers who had this same experience. I posted a couple of watches on there for sale a couple of years ago and don't remember what they asked from me in terms of ID as a seller.
 
Dedalus05
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TriSum TriSum
So a little follow up....

Against my better judgement I sent pictures of my ID and CC. I blocked my actual DL number and only gave them the first and last 4 digits on my CC. I left all other info visible, you can clearly see me, my address (which is the CC billing address also), my DOB, everything and they rejected it. So I canceled the order and apologized to the seller, but I just don't see why they need my actual DL number for any proof of identity.

Sorry you didn't get the watch you had your eye on. You may want to reconsider at some point. There may be a grail that comes up on Chrono24 that you want - where a risk/benefit analysis will skew towards having the watch. If/when that time comes, if it is any comfort I expect Chono24 would have to have very, very strict data protection policies in place to secure a European banking license (which is essentially what escrow is to my understanding). The EU data protection laws are very strict indeed - though no database is truly a fortress. Still I am guessing again, so it might be worth asking them for your own piece of mind.

Again, shame about the watch. Any pics?
 
hronists
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Interesting. I have chrono24 account for ages, purchased watches and I don't recall them asking proof of ID. My latest purchase was 3 weeks ago, less than 5k, maybe they have some threshold when KYC and AML procedures kicks in?

If they'd asked proof of ID I'd sent them, chrono24 is a reputable marketplace, I see no harm.
 
Joe_A
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Dan S Dan S
Maybe they actually need those data, maybe they know that requesting that information eliminates a large fraction of dishonest customers, or maybe they are trying to gather data for other reasons. Whatever the reason, they are probably willing to alienate the small fraction of people who refuse. You don't have to use their services and they don't have to explain the rationale for their policies.

Perhaps . . .

But I found them to be very accommodating when asked for a policy explanation.

Recently I purchased a watch through Chrono24 and they collected New York State sales tax. Before I agreed to move forward, I challenged them politely and they explained the reason they are required to collect local tax and they cited the relevant Federal requirements for me to read on my own. At no time did I detect the slightest "take it or leave it" attitude from the two employees with whom I communicated My most recent previous purchase with them occurred before the new regs went into effect and back then, they were not collecting local tax..
 
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