British WW2-surplus

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I’ve recently cleared my parents’ house of 60+ years, as my mother has had to move to a care home.

In a drawer, I found the old Omega watch that my late father had worn up to around 1978.

I vaguely recall him telling me that he had bought it just after WW2: it was inside a brown envelope on which he had written.

Over the years the ink has faded but it was just possible to discern that he’d bought it as War Surplus from John Bull, in Peter Street, Bedford, in 1946.

That makes sense because he had grown up in Bedford, his mother still lived there at that time and he was de-mobbed from the RAF that year, in which he had been ground crew, having volunteered in 1940 and been trained as an Armourer (Gun).

Although he served with a Servicing Commando unit from late 1942, I think it’s unlikely that he would have been issued with a watch whilst in the service.

It’s surely more likely that he saw aircrew wearing such watches and heard their positive reviews!

Anyway - the watch still works and keeps good time, though it operates for no more than about 10 hours on as much as I dare to wind it.

I shall keep it and would like to wear it regularly - should I entrust it to Omega in Switzerland via my local dealer, or is there an alternative?

Constructive comments very welcome!

Thanks in anticipation

I forgot to add - there are no markings on the rear of the case, and -

What colour and strap type might it have been supplied with? I remember my father having stainless steel expanding bracelet for years but that wouldn’t have been original.
 
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No markings on back and if it has spring bars. It’s a civie model and not military.

nice piece.

Guessing UK as there’s. Bedford NS in Canada.

could contact Simon Freese about servicing it. Highly recommended watchmaker
 
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DON DON
No markings on back and if it has spring bars. It’s a civie model and not military.

nice piece.

Guessing UK as there’s. Bedford NS in Canada.

could contact Simon Freese about servicing it. Highly recommended watchmaker
 
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Many thanks - yes, it’s Bedford GB, not Canada.

If it’s ‘war surplus’ as I am sure it was - then it would have been purchased by the Ministry of Supply and intended for military service or issued to a governmental civilian organisation, perhaps?

If so, it may have been issued and then recovered - or held in stock as new and the sold as surplus?

Is this watch of a pattern that could have been issued to the RAF or other services?

What internal markings should I be looking for?

Sadly, the long established business from which my father bought it ceased trading a couple of years ago.

Thanks again - RM
 
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Many thanks - yes, it’s Bedford GB, not Canada.

If it’s ‘war surplus’ as I am sure it was - then it would have been purchased by the Ministry of Supply and intended for military service or issued to a governmental civilian organisation, perhaps?

If so, it may have been issued and then recovered - or held in stock as new and the sold as surplus?

Is this watch of a pattern that could have been issued to the RAF or other services?

What internal markings should I be looking for?

Sadly, the long established business from which my father bought it ceased trading a couple of years ago.

Thanks again - RM

if not mistaken. It’s only military when converted by the MOD and officially marked. These models were sold in retail stores hence the Civie title. Military. Back would have been stamped the proper designation. Fix3d bars soldered onto the lugs.

if you get the serial number of the movement and interior case back number. You might be able to contact Omega, but think someone said they closed down the archives

just get it serviced and wear
 
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Hallo, it looks as it is the RAF Mk 7A pilots watch stores ref 6b/159 of 1942 or the HS8 from the Royal Navy.
The marking on the back may have been polished away. In that case the case back is a bit thinner than normal, but I dont have the meaures.
Konrad


 
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It looks like a 6B/159 movement and dial/handset (could be an MoD redial, with a seconds hand also seen on some of the '56 recased watches) possibly recased in a Dennison 13322 case as many were when being sold off post war. The inside of the case back will tell more.

That's fabulous with the box Konrad, thanks for posting it.
 
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DON DON
if not mistaken. It’s only military when converted by the MOD and officially marked. These models were sold in retail stores hence the Civie title. Military. Back would have been stamped the proper designation. Fix3d bars soldered onto the lugs.

if you get the serial number of the movement and interior case back number. You might be able to contact Omega, but think someone said they closed down the archives

just get it serviced and wear


DON, If military watches only have fixed bars soldered, I think you are right. It has spring bars. From what you say, it was the War Office (pre-MoD) that would arrange conversion of watches to the desired specification (fixed lugs, markings on rear), though I don't understand why they wouldn't just get the supplier to do the fixed bars in the factory as part of the specification....reply much appreciated.
 
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Hallo, it looks as it is the RAF Mk 7A pilots watch stores ref 6b/159 of 1942 or the HS8 from the Royal Navy.
The marking on the back may have been polished away. In that case the case back is a bit thinner than normal, but I dont have the meaures.
Konrad


Konrad, that's a fabulous watch in wonderful condition - thank you for sharing. My fathers' watch doesn't have 'Swiss Made' on the face, though - which is no doubt relevant. See above post - DON may be right? I shall get it serviced and wear it, I will ask for images of the markings inside the case.
 
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DON, If military watches only have fixed bars soldered, I think you are right. It has spring bars. From what you say, it was the War Office (pre-MoD) that would arrange conversion of watches to the desired specification (fixed lugs, markings on rear), though I don't understand why they wouldn't just get the supplier to do the fixed bars in the factory as part of the specification....reply much appreciated.

it’s not something Omega does. That’s the job of the MOD. Fixed bars, added printing on the dial and back engraving.

again. It most likely wasn’t a military model. Similar civilian models produced by Omega sold through stores and military PX’s. The same for a number of military watches. Ones shipped to the military and same models sold in retail stores.
 
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First of all : you need to take a sharp picture of the Dial straight from above; make sure the font of the Omega sign and writing is in focus. So far it looks like a re dial. Which was done regularly before sales. Is your case middle stainless steel or an Alloy type greyish part ? Whatever you have now, is no longer a military Omega. But it will not matter to you, because it is a Family Heirloom. So, get it serviced by an older normal Watchmaker for
around £200 and wear it proudly.
 
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DON, If military watches only have fixed bars soldered,

There has been a lot of discussion about this over at MWR, but the consensus seems to be that most (all?) 159/6B watches for the RAF were delivered on fixed bars, but most HS↑8 watches for the Royal Navy's Fleet Air Arm were delivered with spring bars. Since the OP's watch doesn't have visible caseback engravings or etchings, it can't be classified as 159/6B or HS↑8, but in theory it could still be a FAA watch with a replaced or worn caseback.

Edited to add: If the OP is comfortable opening the watch or taking it to a professional who can do so, one thing to look for would be a 3-digit (very small) engraving on the lug (under the caseback) and on the case under the bezel. These would be the last three digits of the 4-digit HS↑8 issue number, so if they're present (and match), that would suggest that the watch may well be an FAA issued watch. Photo below shows the engraving on my HS↑8:

Edited:
 
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Hallo, it looks as it is the RAF Mk 7A pilots watch stores ref 6b/159 of 1942 or the HS8 from the Royal Navy.
The marking on the back may have been polished away. In that case the case back is a bit thinner than normal, but I dont have the meaures.
Konrad

Brilliant box, Konrad. To your knowledge, was that only for Test examples or did every single one came in that Box ? Have never seen one so far .... Now you only have to find an original Dial ... Haven't seen a good one in a long time ...
 
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@watchyouwant: Thanks Achim.
If that dial on my watch is an MoD dial, its ok for me because its original military! These watches dont need to look as they came from Switzerland without individual history.
Gruß Konrad

And no I don't know wether all these watches came with that box to Herstmonceaux, but I have seen several...
 
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It's just the Omega sign and the Omega font is much later ... Which does not distract from the Beauty of your watch, Konrad. Have to search for that Box ...
 
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It's an aside to the OP, apologies, but I think that the 2292 Omega's were supplied from the factory to the MoD in these 6 watch boxes. I wonder if Konrad's box is a Herstmonceaux post service box...perhaps?