Here's the links to the Antiquorum auction, going off at 13th December:

http://catalog.antiquorum.com/catalog.html?action=load&lotid=227&auctionid=268

Details:

OMEGA REF. 2520 AUTOMATIC CLOISONNE ENAMEL DIAL YELLOW GOLD Omega, Neptune’s Chariot Cloisonné Enamel Dial, Automatic, Chronometer, Officially Certified, No. 12430172, case No. 11046362, Ref. 2520 / 2577. Made in 1952. Fine and rare, center seconds, self-winding, water-resistant, 18K yellow gold wristwatch.
C. Two-body, solid, polished, concave lugs, screw-down case back. D. Polychrome cloisonné enamel on gold, depicting Neptune and two seahorses, yellow gold diamond-shaped indexes, Omega symbol at 6, concentric minute track. Yellow gold dauphine hands. M. Cal. 352, copper-colored, 17 jewels, straight-line lever escapement, monometallic balance adjusted to 5 positions and temperatures, shock absorber, self-compensating fl at balance spring, bumper rotor. Dial, case and movement signed. Diam. 34 mm. Thickness 10.5 mm.

 

The big question here is... is this item original or not? The watch is 1952, same as the other Neptune that went for $268K at Christies, so it should have been from the same artist. Now even the Rolex Neptunes look like the one that sold at Christies, but this one looks dramatically different.

Here is the Christies Seamaster thread: http://omegaforums.net/posts/27847/

The colours are different, the design is sloppy, the lines are not as sharp, there's less detail. I know there is variation in Cloisonnes but the Christies Neptune looks like the work of a very talented artist, while this one looks far less professional.

This image compares the Christies to the Antiquorum Neptune:

 

Wow, looks awful. Gotta be fake.

 

Also the Christies Neptune has "CHRONOMÉTRE" while the Antiquorum has "CHRONOMETER".

The price estimate is also way off base for a genuine Neptune Cloisonne Seamaster:

Estimate: 5,000 USD - 8,000 USD
Estimate: 4,700 CHF - 7,500 CHF
Estimate: 4,000 EUR - 6,000 EUR

 

The Neptune is a Seamaster Ref OT2520 case, it should have a clover crown, rather than a 10 sided Constellation crown.

 

Fascinating thread, especially with the discussion of the modern "sailing ship" cloisonne in the other recent thread. Certainly, the Antiquorum one looks closer to that than to the Christie's one.

Antiquorum is officially going to hell in a handbasket. Each auction has more questionable pieces in poorer shape than the last. It's a shame. It used to be my favorite auction house because it handled midrange pieces at my price level, but now they seem bent on becoming a Patek house. Unfortunately, Christie's dominates that with a distant second from Sotheby. Even if they do everything right, Antiquorum will never be any more than third fiddle, while there is a huge gap in the midrange market waiting for an auction house to embrace it.

 

Well, the low to midrange gap is presently being filled by ebay. Most of the bidding at this time is done electronically (at least in the under $10k market and even I would guess in the over $10k market) so it would make sense for this gap to be filled by an internet entity. I would agree with the observation also that at least for vintage omegas, there has been a definite decline in the listings of Antiquorum and it is pieces like this poor neptune imitation that further contribute to their diminishing stature.

There definitely is a market to be had here especially since the amount you net after your watch is sold with one of these big auction houses is 50-60% of the final price of the piece. As this forum becomes more and more popular, perhaps we can help fill this niche in some small way but to get premium prices more standards will have to be set - verified sellers, extensive standard pictures that make it clear the seller is in possession of the item, strict packaging, shipping and insurance procedures, etc. The key to the success of these auction houses in addition to the audience they have is the security and standards they adhere to (or at least purport to adhere to).

 

'Zackly right. And when these are compromised, the reputation of the auction house diminishes as is happening at Antiquorum after their most recent management shift. These aspects are weak to begin with at Ebay. Someone in there, I contend, there is room for someone who can bring some knowledge and integrity to the game. There are a number of regional auction houses that seem well positioned for such a move. The notion that a purely electronic entity can do that same is a very interesting one. Rolex Passion Market seems to be one such effort. Bears watching.

 

Just what kind of vetting is going on for an entry such as this one? Is it up to the seller to vouch for the authenticity of his piece? Is it accepted on faith? I know that auction houses are accountable, so how can this watch be sold, is there disclosure statement with this watch that we are not seeing? Yes, some these questions I know the answers to, but I throw them all out here for the benefit of discussion.

 

They charge you a buyer's premium which I would assume serves to compensate them for their expertise and frequently their descriptions of the watch is lacking in accuracy. Then there are legal disclaimers that essentially say "caveat emptor" which makes you wonder what is the buyer's premium for?
I think there is money to be made here done properly - the main barrier to entry obviously is your name and reputation that's why eventually once omega forums becomes even more popular then that can be the springboard if of course we decide to go in that direction. It could be a way of generating cash flow without advertising and the compromises in forum content that brings.

 

Fundamentally, the auction house is on the hook if they sell you a fake. That's why the buyer accepts that a higher price has to paid for the same piece at an auction house than say on EBay. How they go about preventing refunds and lawsuits is up to them. That's how it goes in the fine art world. Too many screwups and they loose the faith of the buyers and go the way of Patrizzi, for example.

 

Don't even know about this. This is a direct quote of the standard verbiage of the disclaimer:

___ strongly encourages in-person inspection of items by the bidder. Statements by ___ regarding the condition of objects are for guidance only and should not be relied upon as statements of fact, and do not constitute a representation, warranty, or assumption of liability by ___. All lots offered are sold "AS IS"

 

Bob Maron is no longer there in charge?

 

William Friedman since January 2012. A Patek expert as I understand it. There seemed to be a sharp change in direction with his appointment.

A little dramatic, no?