Another Seiko 6309A Adventure

JimInOz · Jun 10, 2015

An International Delivery yesterday afternoon, turned out to be a Seiko 6309A diver from @UncleBuck. ::psy::

He offered it up for investigation as it seemed to be a non-goer. A good looking example of a bullet proof diver, what could be the problem?

Time to pop the hood on this one and see the engine.

At first glance, nothing wrong, a nice clean movement (compared to the last one). However, on closer inspection, the rotor was at a slight angle, not good. A slight touch to the rotor and no movement, doesn't look good so off with the rotor.

Once the rotor was off the problem was obvious. One of the barrel/train bridge screws was protruding and also at a slight angle.

Hmmmmmmm............maybe I could slip the rotor back on and have a "Seiko Bumper" 🙄

Closer inspection under the microscope showed that the screw hadn't just eased out and got whacked by the rotor, it had obviously been cross threaded 😡
After letting down what power was left in the barrel, I removed all three screws and the bridge. I will need to fix that hole, ideally with a tap to clean the threads up, but that'll be a task for the next chapter. Until then, we'll just leave it in the case and start looking for watchmakers taps.

JimInOz · Jun 11, 2015

Chapter 2.

I had a few minutes to spare after work so I got on with disassembling. After removing the movement from the case, remove the delicate parts.

Firstly, the hands. Using the zip bag eliminates (or significantly reduces) risk of marking/scratching and prevents the hands from vanishing into the ether.

After removing the dial, re-use the bag as a containment vessel to remove the day wheel circlip. They have a nasty habit of getting airborne so a hole in the bag for the screwdriver and no "missing in action" bits.

And now to put the delicate parts away until needed. Thanks to @Archer I now have a storage solution for hands 😉
And the dial, date ring and day wheel now have their custom made hard cases (SD card cases! re-use/recycle where you can.)
So now everything is stowed until after I've fixed that cross-threaded bridge plate mount 🙄

So until the next phase...............

A question for tinkerers and maybe Al.

Would an old stem of the same diameter be OK to restore the thread using an old battle repair* trick of inserting a screw from the other side of the plate to re-form the entry threads, or would the stem pitch be different to the screw pitch?

*"Battle Repairs" is from my previous life and were methods used to get aircraft or equipment back to operational condition so that they could limp back to a proper repair depot. That was when combat aircraft were made of aluminium, not epoxy and plastic like nowdays. All you needed was a roll of Duck tape, a shifter and a hammer. And some degree of improvisation 😁

Oh, and a set of aircraft tie-down chains. They came in very handy to lash the undercarriage in down position when the U/C hydraulics had crapped out and the S2E Tracker had to make a 100 kilometre flight back to base with it's wheels down and "locked".

pascs · Jun 11, 2015

Looks in nice condition and hopefully not too major a fix, not sure what other screws have that same thread but it will also depend how bad the cross threading is. Those screws for that piece are quite long if I remember correctly.

This is mine that I just picked up.................its a 6306 with stuck crown but it is apart now and just needs the movement serviced, so hope to do that this weekend. Its basically the same movement as the 6309 but has a few extra jewels.

JimInOz · Jun 11, 2015

pascs
Looks in nice condition and hopefully not too major a fix, not sure what other screws have that same thread but it will also depend how bad the cross threading is. Those screws for that piece are quite long if I remember correctly.

This is mine that I just picked up.................its a 6306 with stuck crown but it is apart now and just needs the movement serviced, so hope to do that this weekend. Its basically the same movement as the 6309 but has a few extra jewels.

Nice one. Are you going to create a distressed "rat" watch or do a full resto?

I think leave the looks, service the movement and put it on a ragged leather NATO (just my jealous wish list) 😁

pascs · Jun 11, 2015

Might not be so much ratty as just aged. Its actually a really nice watch underneath the initial dirt. The dial is 99% fine with only one dark dot on the aged lume at the 12 o'clock, the rest of the dial is clean. All the white bits you can see were stuck on the underside of the crystal. Also when I started looking at the movement I dont think its ever been touched before, not bad for a 40 year old diver. The bezel also has a nice aged blue colour

This is my ratty 6309..... I like the idea of a ragged leather NATO though 👍

Archer · Jun 11, 2015

JimInOz
A question for tinkerers and maybe Al.

Would an old stem of the same diameter be OK to restore the thread using an old battle repair* trick of inserting a screw from the other side of the plate to re-form the entry threads, or would the stem pitch be different to the screw pitch?

I take it you don't have thread pitch gauges? Even if you don't, you should be able to check the pitch of the threads on the screw to the stem just putting them together and looking with your loupe. I really don't work on Seikos much, so I can't tell you if the threads used would be the same given the same diameter.

Not all countries use the same screw thread system on their products, so you will find wide variations between countries and sometimes manufacturers.

Glad my ideas on protecting hands, dials, etc. have been useful to you.

Cheers, Al

michaelmc · Jun 11, 2015

like the poly bag trick. saves the flying projectile search.

wsfarrell · Jun 11, 2015

I do believe there's a parallel universe where the asteroid belt consists not of rocks, but rather of watch hands, circlips, and Beretta .32 safety springs.

UncleBuck · Jun 11, 2015

Archer
I take it you don't have thread pitch gauges? Even if you don't, you should be able to check the pitch of the threads on the screw to the stem just putting them together and looking with your loupe. I really don't work on Seikos much, so I can't tell you if the threads used would be the same given the same diameter.

Not all countries use the same screw thread system on their products, so you will find wide variations between countries and sometimes manufacturers.

Glad my ideas on protecting hands, dials, etc. have been useful to you.

Cheers, Al

Al, we state it often, but your contributions are priceless to us!
If you ever have piping questions, don't hesitate to ask.

Are you at full speed now, mate?

JimInOz · Jun 11, 2015

Archer
I take it you don't have thread pitch gauges? Even if you don't, you should be able to check the pitch of the threads on the screw to the stem just putting them together and looking with your loupe. I really don't work on Seikos much, so I can't tell you if the threads used would be the same given the same diameter.

Not all countries use the same screw thread system on their products, so you will find wide variations between countries and sometimes manufacturers.

Glad my ideas on protecting hands, dials, etc. have been useful to you.

Cheers, Al

Thanks Al, I'll figure it out.

And it's not just tips on storing hands and dials that have helped, I've lost count of the times I've learnt something new from your posts.

Cheers

Jim

JimInOz · Jun 11, 2015

wsfarrell
...................................................and Beretta .32 safety springs.

I didn't know girls cleaned their own guns.

Oh, hang on, I see.........sorry bout that.

😁

wsfarrell · Jun 12, 2015

It's not the bullet that kills you, it's the hole.....

SeanO · Jun 12, 2015

it lets all the air out?

Archer · Jun 12, 2015

UncleBuck
Al, we state it often, but your contributions are priceless to us!
If you ever have piping questions, don't hesitate to ask.

Are you at full speed now, mate?

Piping questions? Well as much as I like cooking sometimes, I'm not really a cake piping kind of guy...

Or maybe you are referring to these pipes?

If so I don't think my wife would be too pleased if I picked these up as a hobby. 😉

Seriously even though I wore a shirt and tie in my years as an engineer, I have run enough threaded black pipe (I can still smell the oil of the threading machine if I think about it), assembled enough hydraulic hoses, sweated enough copper pipe, and run plenty of plastic pneumatic piping (as well as designed numerous pneumatic and hydraulic systems for machine tools and automation systems over the years) that I have my piping needs pretty well covered, but seriously thanks for the offer. I don't do much of that sort of work anymore. The last bit of "pipe" I worked on was using a piece of ABS plastic conduit to make a movement spacer for a watch that was missing one on my lathe!

I am doing quite well thanks - working mostly normal hours, but not 7 days a week anymore. Not taking in as much work, and taking more time to relax. It's all good.

Cheers, Al

erpin9 · Jun 12, 2015

My 6306 7001 in tan leather strap.

JimInOz · Jun 14, 2015

A bit of spare time on my hands this arvo, so while listening to a TV broadcast of the Last Night of the Proms, I thought I'd tackle the cross-threaded bush.

No stem small enough to use as a tap, but I found a long dial screw in an old Swiss movement that was a match for diameter and pitch.

So with the plate upside down on my old dirty rodico holder, I cleaned up the thread by coming in from the undamaged side and pushed the thread back rather than cutting it like a tap would (and no, I'm not wearing cots or gloves as this is going into the cleaner).

With that done, I re-installed all 3 bridge screws to ensure that all is well and true, they can be seen at 12, 1:30 and 6.

In the pic below you can see the screw that saved the day, a few stems I tried, my VOH screwdriver and a cheap screwdriver with the tip ground off and replaced with rodico. I find it easier to insert and start a screw with this and there's little chance of cross threading as the rodico exerts no torque.

So now to clean all of the bits and start re-assembling (next weekend).

NT931 · Jun 14, 2015

An incredibly educational and cool thread which reminds me just how tricky repairing/servicing a watch can be! 👍

Thanks for the great photos and the running commentary.

pascs · Jun 14, 2015

Great to see the 6309 making progress 👍 I find them to be pretty robust especially when you think of the rough treatment most of these old Seiko divers received.

My 6306 after a strip down, clean and oil. Needs a new crystal and a set of hands to match the dial lume

And the 6309 made a movement swap into a TST case 😝

nickioa · Jul 19, 2015

What an excellent thread, I've enjoyed seeing the step by step pictures. Such intricate work.

Another Seiko 6309A Adventure

JimInOz

JimInOz

pascs

JimInOz

pascs

Archer

michaelmc

wsfarrell

UncleBuck

JimInOz

JimInOz

wsfarrell

SeanO

Archer

erpin9

JimInOz

NT931

pascs

nickioa

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