Advice on 165.024

zwjk · Nov 11, 2020

Hi all,

I have an opportunity to purchase this 165.024 locally. I really like the dial and that's what has drawn me to it. I know the bezel is a write-off, but I think I can live with an aged service one.

I have done some research and it looks OK to me. My notes:

- Dial: Correct dial small triangle with white numbers. No closed 6 and 9. 6 and 12 markers missing pin holes - is this a concern? Dial doesn't look relumed to me.
- Hands: Sword hands with long seconds hand(?). I can't tell if the second hand is short or long. Minute hand appears to have either been relumed or cracked.
- Bezel: My eyes aren't that good to determine which type it is. I'm not too concerned as it is too far gone.
- Crown: Correct naiad crown. Is a naiad crown suppose to have a mercedes logo? Can't seem to see it on this one. Perhaps it is a later crown?
- Case: Worn but strong.
- Caseback: Correct with non-pointed 'A' in waterproof and sea monster visible.
- Movement/.number: Correct 552 movement - looks fairly clean? 24 million serial dating it to 1966 (due to the bad movement shot I need to confirm as it could be 26 million)

I would also like to know where you would value this watch? I would like to account for a full overhaul as part of the purchase price.

All opinions are appreciated. Thank you as always.

Concer · Nov 11, 2020

Hey,

very good and almost complete examination of the watch 👍

The condition is of course always a question of the price that is being charged. Imho its a nice watch. I would agree with the most of your points.
The dial with its lume has a nice color, which matches to the (unfortunately) very heavy worn bezel. Keep in mind that a service bezel will not match in its lume color to the dial. Otherwise in my opinion the bezel should be changed cause of its condition. Difficult decision.
And mind the big dangs on the bezel (around the "40" marker e.g) and that this also could have an effect to the movement (is it serviced? proof of service?).

The lume on the hands looks brittle. On the minute hand it has been already relumed. Unfortunately in the wrong color.
The case is worn but not heavily polished, which is good. The crystal has several signs of age which are in its material and cant be polished out (!) So if this bothers you, a replacement is necessary.
Are you sure about the naiad crown? Personally i dont see the naiad sign. Its a service push down crown. There are dif. opinions about it should be a sd or a pd crown. I wouldnt mind. A replacement for a other crown woulndt be a deal breaker.

Best
Oli

Cuttysark · Nov 11, 2020

Hi,
original tritium on the dial to me. You can see also the dot on the 12 index. It has a nice color of the tritium. It's the plus on this watch. The minute hand has been relumed badly but it's not a big issue. I would keep my eyes open on the forum and Ebay for the original bezel. Sometimes you can be lucky 😀 keep on mind 1500€ for an original bezel in good condition. This one hasn't the rarest font so can be easier to find.
Of course the crown is a service one.

Cuttysark · Nov 11, 2020

If the price is good I would buy it 😀 The dial is very attractive IMHO.

zwjk · Nov 11, 2020

Concer
Hey,

very good and almost complete examination of the watch 👍

The condition is of course always a question of the price that is being charged. Imho its a nice watch. I would agree with the most of your points.
The dial with its lume has a nice color, which matches to the (unfortunately) very heavy worn bezel. Keep in mind that a service bezel will not match in its lume color to the dial. Otherwise in my opinion the bezel should be changed cause of its condition. Difficult decision.
And mind the big dangs on the bezel (around the "40" marker e.g) and that this also could have an effect to the movement (is it serviced? proof of service?).

The lume on the hands looks brittle. On the minute hand it has been already relumed. Unfortunately in the wrong color.
The case is worn but not heavily polished, which is good. The crystal has several signs of age which are in its material and cant be polished out (!) So if this bothers you, a replacement is necessary.
Are you sure about the naiad crown? Personally i dont see the naiad sign. Its a service push down crown. There are dif. opinions about it should be a sd or a pd crown. I wouldnt mind. A replacement for a other crown woulndt be a deal breaker.

Best
Oli

Thank you for the repsonse.

Yes, the only thing that is holding me back is the bezel. The hands are no issue, I will just get them colour matched with the dial 😀

Also noted about the crown. I thought it was not correct and you confirmed my suspicions.

zwjk · Nov 11, 2020

Cuttysark
Hi,
original tritium on the dial to me. You can see also the dot on the 12 index. It has a nice color of the tritium. It's the plus on this watch. The minute hand has been relumed badly but it's not a big issue. I would keep my eyes open on the forum and Ebay for the original bezel. Sometimes you can be lucky 😀 keep on mind 1500€ for an original bezel in good condition. This one hasn't the rarest font so can be easier to find.
Of course the crown is a service one.

Thank you for your response.

The seller is asking around USD$4000. I think that's a fair price but once I factor in servicing, parts etc. it will add up, so will need to think about it.

Dgercp · Nov 11, 2020

I am sure a minority opinion but I like the way that bezel works with dial and I would keep as is.

zwjk · Nov 12, 2020

Dgercp
I am sure a minority opinion but I like the way that bezel works with dial and I would keep as is.

Thank you. Is the bakelite in the bezel dangerous due to the damage?

zwjk · Nov 12, 2020

I think I might make an offer. Does anyone have thoughts on the value in its current state?

Seaborg · Nov 12, 2020

It looks like a fantastic SM300 !
$4000 seems to be a very reasonable price for this fantastic watch (look at this dial and those hands 🥰). So, even at $4000 I would take it so it is already a good deal !!

The second hand is definitly a short one (good).

Cheers

watchyouwant · Nov 12, 2020

Offer 3700 and keep the bezel, but secure the big damage around 40. If you have a Dremel with a small white and fluffy polishing wheel ( or your watchmaker), use super glue and cover that area as a "fill in the damage " material. Let it harden for 30 hours. Use polish paste for plexy watch crystals on the lowest possible Dremel speed and don't let that area get hot. Wait between attempts. Take your time and eventually you will achieve a secured polished area . Good luck ! Achim

Caliber561 · Nov 12, 2020

watchyouwant
Offer 3700 and keep the bezel, but secure the big damage around 40. If you have a Dremel with a small white and fluffy polishing wheel ( or your watchmaker), use super glue and cover that area as a "fill in the damage " material. Let it harden for 30 hours. Use polish paste for plexy watch crystals on the lowest possible Dremel speed and don't let that area get hot. Wait between attempts. Take your time and eventually you will achieve a secured polished area . Good luck ! Achim

I mean, the OP could also just keep the bezel in its original condition. Rather than modifying the original, they could get a service bezel and/or have a service bezel relumed with ZnS to approximate the look of a vintage bezel while being able to use the watch for daily wear.

watchyouwant · Nov 12, 2020

I was under the impression, that the damage at 40 was actually shattered Perspex...... If that is not the case, no repair necessary. Unless you go for optics, which will improve when filled in. Kind regards. Achim

Concer · Nov 12, 2020

If you are thinking about to buy this watch, ask the seller whether the bezel can be rotated freely. Maybe its jammed after this hard hit which it has suffered.

zwjk · Nov 12, 2020

Seaborg
It looks like a fantastic SM300 !
$4000 seems to be a very reasonable price for this fantastic watch (look at this dial and those hands 🥰). So, even at $4000 I would take it so it is already a good deal !!

The second hand is definitly a short one (good).

Cheers

Thanks for confirming the hand. The short and long second hands look the same to me LOL! I will discuss with the seller tomorrow.

watchyouwant
Offer 3700 and keep the bezel, but secure the big damage around 40. If you have a Dremel with a small white and fluffy polishing wheel ( or your watchmaker), use super glue and cover that area as a "fill in the damage " material. Let it harden for 30 hours. Use polish paste for plexy watch crystals on the lowest possible Dremel speed and don't let that area get hot. Wait between attempts. Take your time and eventually you will achieve a secured polished area . Good luck ! Achim

Thanks mate. I'm not too good with the tools so will be sending it to my watchmaker if I buy it.

Caliber561
I mean, the OP could also just keep the bezel in its original condition. Rather than modifying the original, they could get a service bezel and/or have a service bezel relumed with ZnS to approximate the look of a vintage bezel while being able to use the watch for daily wear.

Yep, an aged service bezel was my original intention.

Concer
If you are thinking about to buy this watch, ask the seller whether the bezel can be rotated freely. Maybe its jammed after this hard hit which it has suffered.

The bezel rotates; I have confirmed this with the seller.

-
Thanks everyone for their invaluable advice!! That's why I love this forum 🥰

Redwes25 · Nov 12, 2020

zwjk
Thank you. Is the bakelite in the bezel dangerous due to the damage?

Also as an FYI these bezels aren’t Bakelite but acrylic. Think only first generation had a Bakelite bezel which is why so few of those have survived as they were much easier to crack then these acrylic bezels.

Seaborg · Nov 12, 2020

Thanks for confirming the hand. The short and long second hands look the same to me LOL! I will discuss with the seller tomorrow.

Please find bellow the difference (from Omegaseamaster300.com):

Oh, and just in case, DIBS if one day you want to sell it 🙄

Vintagewtchzilla · Nov 13, 2020

Redwes25
Also as an FYI these bezels aren’t Bakelite but acrylic. Think only first generation had a Bakelite bezel which is why so few of those have survived as they were much easier to crack then these acrylic bezels.

FYI the bezels were never bakelite as it was already an outdated material in 50's . the "early bezels used nitrocelluloid

Vintagewtchzilla · Nov 13, 2020

i would just replace the bezel and polish the crystal .... done a nice daily watch is born

zwjk · Nov 14, 2020

After a 6 hour round trip, I finally picked up the watch. Looks right at home on a black NATO - will probably go off to my watchmaker now for some much needed TLC.

Advice on 165.024

zwjk

Concer

Cuttysark

Cuttysark

zwjk

zwjk

Dgercp

zwjk

zwjk

Seaborg

watchyouwant

Caliber561

watchyouwant

Concer

zwjk

Redwes25

Seaborg

Vintagewtchzilla

Vintagewtchzilla

zwjk

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